Opinion Will Elon Musk Interfere With Social Security?

[sickc0d3r]

No, that's called a taxpayer funded pension doofus. You don't even know what you need.

Obviously the government is funded mostly by tax payers, and SS is funded by the payroll tax.

Anyhoo, I said a government funded pension like SS because it doesn't have to be SS, which is the discussion I was having when you chimed in with your brilliant takes. Something like a sovereign wealth fund can be funded by other things, along with tax money.

 

[Natural Order]

Obviously the government is funded mostly by tax payers, and SS is funded by the payroll tax.

Anyhoo, I said a government funded pension like SS because it doesn't have to be SS, which is the discussion I was having when you chimed in with your brilliant takes. Something like a sovereign wealth fund can be funded by other things, along with tax money.

An individual's entire SS should be paid by themselves from the moment they begin working. There's no pool concept, you save for your own security.

Certainly there would need to be safety nets for those unable to earn a keep at all, but for able bodied people it's a pretty basic thing that has turned into nothing but a government coffer.

The system is beyond fucked.

 

[evergreenrider]

Theres a reason he brought it up on the largest mainstream media platform.

 

[Natural Order]

Almost every aspect of American economics is a ponzi scheme. Elon isn't wrong (I can't stand the fool)

Robbing from Peter to pay Paul. It's a disease, and it's everywhere. If anybody thinks this model is sustainable, they're nuts.

 

[Renard]

An individual's entire SS should be paid by themselves from the moment they begin working. There's no pool concept, you save for your own security.

Certainly there would need to be safety nets for those unable to earn a keep at all, but for able bodied people it's a pretty basic thing that has turned into nothing but a government coffer.

The system is beyond fucked.

It's funny to me that people can't fathom they could be doing these things themselves, i.e. putting money aside every time they get paid and investing it. Society is full of pathological refusal to take responsibility for one's own life. Gotta have daddy government, corporation, priest, doctor taking care of things for me and telling me what to do. Oh daddy government has been emptying the coffers of my retirement and leaving IOU slips? Well, we just need a different type of government program to fix it.

 

[sickc0d3r]

An individual's entire SS should be paid by themselves from the moment they begin working. There's no pool concept, you save for your own security.

Certainly there would need to be safety nets for those unable to earn a keep at all, but for able bodied people it's a pretty basic thing that has turned into nothing but a government coffer.

The system is beyond fucked.

I’d support something like this if there were an opt-in or out, with federal government matching up to some percentage (and employers can offer to match as well). SWF can be partially funded by other sources (like parks and public lands, etc). There are currently 9 or 10 states I think with an SWF for their citizens, mostly funded by the state’s own natural resources.

Or, like the other guy mentioned, a 403b with gov’t match also sounds good and would be totally voluntary.

And yeah, definitely still need a safety net program that everyone pays into and is need based.

 

[sickc0d3r]

It's funny to me that people can't fathom they could be doing these things themselves, i.e. putting money aside every time they get paid and investing it. Society is full of pathological refusal to take responsibility for one's own life. Gotta have daddy government, corporation, priest, doctor taking care of things for me and telling me what to do. Oh daddy government has been emptying the coffers of my retirement and leaving IOU slips? Well, we just need a different type of government program to fix it.

People can fathom it just fine, I think some folks just get too hung up on “should”, like, “people should be able to manager their own shit”. Sure, but we still have to decide what to do with people who don’t or can’t. I don’t think letting them roam the streets homeless is a great option. Maybe some do, and we can disagree.

For me I couldn’t care less about “should”, I only wish our stupid government would try to find the most efficient way to make sure people can survive when they retire. Whatever that is is fine with me.

 

[avenue94]

People can fathom it just fine, I think some folks just get too hung up on “should”, like, “people should be able to manager their own shit”. Sure, but we still have to decide what to do with people who don’t or can’t. I don’t think letting them roam the streets homeless is a great option. Maybe some do, and we can disagree.

For me I couldn’t care less about “should”, I only wish our stupid government would try to find the most efficient way to make sure people can survive when they retire. Whatever that is is fine with me.

That's one of the parts people tend to not consider about government programs and red tape. Their inefficiency is in part because they are designed to be as, not to be mean, but idiot proof as possible because the world will never be ideal. Also why move fast and break things works terrible with government programs.

 

[sickc0d3r]

That's one of the parts people tend to not consider about government programs and red tape. Their inefficiency is in part because they are designed to be as, not to be mean, but idiot proof as possible because the world will never be ideal. Also why move fast and break things works terrible with government programs.

Reality is reality, even if we don’t always like it the government has to face it somehow. I don’t claim to be an expert, but I am pretty sure a country as productive as ours, with the resources we have, shouldn’t have 11%, 36M, citizens wallowing in poverty while the richest 1% hold 30.8% of the country’s total net worth.

 

[AmonTobin]

Musk fraud checked by Sam Seder. Explaining the difference between a Ponzi scheme and Social Security.

 

[Sinister]

It's funny to me that people can't fathom they could be doing these things themselves, i.e. putting money aside every time they get paid and investing it. Society is full of pathological refusal to take responsibility for one's own life. Gotta have daddy government, corporation, priest, doctor taking care of things for me and telling me what to do. Oh daddy government has been emptying the coffers of my retirement and leaving IOU slips? Well, we just need a different type of government program to fix it.

Spoken like a true person who doesnt understand just how effective social security has been in assuring that MILLIONS of Americans die with some dignity.

There are people in hospices right now whose SS is paying for their end of life care. But sure, they must have just all been financial idiots. F*ck 'em. Let ther families bear the burden.

 

[AmonTobin]

An individual's entire SS should be paid by themselves from the moment they begin working. There's no pool concept, you save for your own security.

That's essentially life insurance. Doing it that way is unsustainable for a number of reasons, has unacceptable inherent risks, and exempts millionaires from contributing to it through taxes like everyone else.

Senior citizens should not have to live in a tent city eating cat food because the people making >$400K didnt want to contribute.

 

[Gotosleepho]

They want us as their slaves. The greed in this country is going to destroy us. Musk is having way too much influence over our government.

 

[jk7707]

That's essentially life insurance. Doing it that way is unsustainable for a number of reasons, has unacceptable inherent risks, and exempts millionaires from contributing to it through taxes like everyone else.

Senior citizens should not have to live in a tent city eating cat food because the people making >$400K didnt want to contribute.

I would love to hear a coherent argument against this.

 

[Sinister]

I would love to hear a coherent argument against this.

Bootstraps and financial literacy Bro

 

[djacobox372]

Bootstraps and financial literacy Bro

Bootstraps won't pay your rent when the market crashes and your 401k is wiped out. SS is a fallback for people who are investing, and a safety net for the needy.

It's relatively easy to "fix," remove the cap, and means test it... presto, fixed.

 

[Andy Capp]

An individual's entire SS should be paid by themselves from the moment they begin working. There's no pool concept, you save for your own security.

Certainly there would need to be safety nets for those unable to earn a keep at all, but for able bodied people it's a pretty basic thing that has turned into nothing but a government coffer.

The system is beyond fucked.

I disagree. When I graduated high school in 1983, the unemployment rate here was about as bad as during the COVID-19 pandemic. Should someone who couldn't land a job in that environment suffer as a senior citizen because he couldn't "save for his own security"? How about people who are mentally ill the the point it's often hard to hang on to a job, but not seriously enough to be considered disabled and unable to work at all? Should that person have to live off food banks at 70 years old?

 

[Andy Capp]

It's funny to me that people can't fathom they could be doing these things themselves, i.e. putting money aside every time they get paid and investing it. Society is full of pathological refusal to take responsibility for one's own life. Gotta have daddy government, corporation, priest, doctor taking care of things for me and telling me what to do. Oh daddy government has been emptying the coffers of my retirement and leaving IOU slips? Well, we just need a different type of government program to fix it.

If you are living paycheck to paycheck where's the money you advise setting aside coming from?

 

[Scheme]

What would happen to social security if we had less young people in the country? It would go bankrupt faster than it already is. It's basically a Ponzi scheme and if you're young and expect to get a decent social security payout when you hit 65 I have a shitcoin to sell you. It's just been accepted as what it is.

Introducing even more debt ballooning programs when our own government tells us that we can't even fund the existing ones is a lack of economic literacy that is quite shocking but all too familiar now. Unfortunately these things will have real consequences on our children and their children but I guess they can live off platitudes and fake dreams.

The only Trump card is DOGE potentially fixing huge swathes of waste and fraud and streamlining the government to the point that we can actually afford to fund these programs. Only then should we even discuss expanding government spending. But that is a big if and the left wing seem to be adamant on keeping every cent of spending and adding more when it's simply illogical and counter-intuitive to do so.

 

[Renard]

Spoken like a true person who doesnt understand just how effective social security has been in assuring that MILLIONS of Americans die with some dignity.

There are people in hospices right now whose SS is paying for their end of life care. But sure, they must have just all been financial idiots. F*ck 'em. Let ther families bear the burden.

You've obviously never read any of my posts on SS since you're attacking a strawman. I never advocated for removing it. Whoops, bye your entire post.

I've pointed out before that politicians and corporations have been pillaging the funds you contribute to it since the 90s and you don't give a shit about it. Lawlessness is costly to society, it drains trillions of dollars away from things that could help people. Instead you guys buy into either one of two incorrect narratives about social security: cut benefits or increase contributions. So either people lose the benefits they earned, or you force people to participate even more, double-down in a system that's being pillaged by the people who manage it. Insane. People don't even understand the nature of the problem. You're asking to pour even more water in a bucket with a hole instead of doing something about the hole. The real solution would be more integrity in the pension fund governance system and for the people responsible for pillaging it to be held responsible. However since MSM never frames the problem in this way, and people are mostly zombies who don't think for themselves, this will never happen. So if you're wise, you pull out, even if it contributes to the "under-funding crisis" (read: leadership who think financial obligations to the elderly are expendable). Dumb people won't and will lose some of their money as their pension funds are under the care of untrustworthy actors.