Aspinall is not better than Jon Jones (they are even),

[fzoid4454]

It's still all lost on you. You have this fairy tale belief that the "real" belt holds some sort of value outside what the organization grants it. So nope, it's still your logic that's retarded.

If the "real" belt isn't an arbitrary thing that's solely at the discretion of the organization, why don't you point out the set time frame the UFC must abide by when determining whether to strip a champion or not. Go ahead. What's that? There isn't one??? No way! So you're telling me that they and they alone decide what merits stripping a champ? They can determine "inactivity" to mean whatever the hell they want in a given situation? Well Holy shit!

So yes, the both the interim and regular belts hold exactly as much value as the organization seems them to hold.

Yes, and the organization tells us it's not the real championship by giving it an "interim" designation. "It's all still lost on you."

 

[mkess101]

Yes, and the organization tells us it's not the real championship by giving it an "interim" designation. "It's all still lost on you."

The problem for you is that doesn't matter. The organization has every bit the ability to arbitrarily strip the "real" belt as they do the interim belt. They can literally set up ANY matchup to crown a "real" champ the same as the interim. You're caught up on the word "interim" as if it holds some practical differentiating meaning, I'm dealing in reality.

Both the "real" and "interim" belts are subject to the whims of Dana and the UFC brass. The lack of rules that govern how both are determined makes them equal for all intents and purposes. Jon Jones is UFC champ today. If the UFC decides to strip him tomorrow for refusing to fight Aspinall (or for being too tall or for wearing a shirt Dana doesn't like or for ANY reason)...they can. Which makes his championship every bit as arbitrary as the interim. Because Jon wouldn't have lost it in the cage. He'd simply have had it taken away by the sole arbiter of who has it, the UFC.

 

[fzoid4454]

Yes, and they have decided that there is an actual champion, and a not-actual champion to give move va-voom to their cards if the real champ is inactive.

Stop pretending that they are on the same level. UFC champions, by the whims of the organization, are the real champs. Interim champs aren't.

As you mentioned, if they wanted the "interim" champ to be the real champ, they can strip the actual champ of their title based on Dana's whims, and make the interim champ the real champ. They haven't done so.

interim < champ.

 

[Jonny Ninja]

I heard him say that he'd drop the belt to fight Alex, sounds like thats what will happen or is being negotiated

I think people are reaching too hard for tom as the great saviour/ jones killer.

No i think the issue is a champion, not fighting the guy who’s got the interim belt (and been defending it), and instead trying to take other match ups. Fans of mma should absolutely be pissed about this and they are. Dropping the belt and going for ‘money fights’ isn’t gonna completely save face for jones but it is better than what we currently have, which is a farce. The irony is Tom vs Jon is what the mma world wants to see, and it’s the fight he will make the most money!

 

[Jonny Ninja]

Yes, and they have decided that there is an actual champion, and a not-actual champion to give move va-voom to their cards if the real champ is inactive.

Stop pretending that they are on the same level. UFC champions, by the whims of the organization, are the real champs. Interim champs aren't.

As you mentioned, if they wanted the "interim" champ to be the real champ, they can strip the actual champ of their title based on Dana's whims, and make the interim champ the real champ. They haven't done so.

interim < champ.

Why would they strip the interim champ for trying to get a match up with the champ?



If jones doesn’t fight aspinal next then I fully expect them to strip him, eventually

 

[cooks1]

Why would they strip the interim champ for trying to get a match up with the champ?



If jones doesn’t fight aspinal next then I fully expect them to strip him, eventually

Tom deserves the Jones fight. And I hope Dana stays true to his word and doesn't let Bones fight anyone else but Tom. But I also think there is a very decent chance Bones just wrestlefucks Tom to oblivion.

 

[Jonny Ninja]

Tom deserves the Jones fight. And I hope Dana stays true to his word and doesn't let Bones fight anyone else but Tom. But I also think there is a very decent chance Bones just wrestlefucks Tom to oblivion.

I’d favour Tom but that’s also very possible. It’s a great fight, we all want to see it. And we all know that it’s the ‘only’ fight to make at HW. Trying to fight derek Lewis or poatan instead is just an awful look for the champ. But if that’s what he wants then he should do it without his belt

 

[icemun]

No i think the issue is a champion, not fighting the guy who’s got the interim belt (and been defending it), and instead trying to take other match ups. Fans of mma should absolutely be pissed about this and they are. Dropping the belt and going for ‘money fights’ isn’t gonna completely save face for jones but it is better than what we currently have, which is a farce. The irony is Tom vs Jon is what the mma world wants to see, and it’s the fight he will make the most money!

If thats what MMA fans want to see and Dana/UFC pay thats what we will get. We didnt get it with Francis.



Id like to see it, but Tom has had 1ppv fight, I dont know how much that really pulls at the gate.

Realistically, Tom loses to Jones, he'll get dismissed and shit on faster than Gane

 

[fzoid4454]

Why would they strip the interim champ for trying to get a match up with the champ?



If jones doesn’t fight aspinal next then I fully expect them to strip him, eventually

How the ever-loving fuck did you get, anywhere in that post you were responding to, that I said an interim champ should be stripped for trying to get a matchup with the real champ?

Have a third-grader read the posts and explain what was actually said to you. That third grader, reading at their age level, will understand that all I said in the post is that the interim designation is less than the actual champion designation. Nothing was said, at all, about stripping Aspinall of his meaningless title.

If the interim title goes away, it's not because he's being "stripped" of it, it's because, by definition, "interim" means temporary or conditional. If the conditions that created it cease to exist, it does away on its own.

What I have said (in earlier posts) is that, by the very definition of what an interim champ is, and why those meaningless designations are handed out, that the "interim" title, logically, EXPIRES when the actual champ is active again, whether it's against the interim belt holder or some other contender. But, as it's not a real title, with any real criteria, that may or may not happen, depending on the aforementioned whims.

 

[Azzy]

Yeah....

Tom wants to fight Old man coked out Jones.

What a set of steel brass.

Tom wants the belt, he's just wanting to fight whoever holds the belt...

 

[Vehap1]

He's not.

He's just the next "maybe he can beat Jon" candidate and after he loses to Jon he'll be thrown away like last week's garbage. Him letting the Jon haters down will have them equating him losing to Jon as him sucking ass at MMA.

That same crowd has already decided that Alex can't beat Jon so they aren't throwing their support behind Alex.

I'm a Jon fan and I honestly believe Potan is a more dangerous opponent than Tom. Outside of luck I can't see Tom beating Jon. I can see Potan giving Jon issues.

34,440 posts and so clueless
I feel sorry for you.

Im sorry to tell you, but size matters......
Remember when Gus put Jon in hospital? You can check what 39 year old Werdum did to Gus by the way

Do you think Reyes would just beat up 263lb Pavlovich? and 6"8 Volkov?
He wouldnt last a round, the size is way too much

 

[Prince Nephilim]

Jon Jones is his own entity

 

[Doughie99]

Which shows that even as of now at 37, Jon Jones is still as good as Aspinall.

Nope.
Just because sone bookmaker has come up with some odds for a theoretical MMA fight that may or may not even happen doesn't mean anyone can conclude from some numbers on a screen that "Jones is still as good as Aspinall ".

Odds really don't mean that much, it's just a bookmaker trying not to lose money on a fight.

Only way to see how they compare os for them to actually fight. Seems to me that only ONE of them is super keen to actually fight and that's the guy from the UK. Jonesrreally doesn't WANT to fight Aspinall but Aspinall DOES want to fight Jones.

Jones is the big holdup it's completely obvious. Rapidly losing interest in this fight.
It'll probably only last 90secs anyway.

 

[Alpha_T83]

Honestly we have no clue how they will match up. For all we know, Jones will be able to secure the takedown and make it look easy.

But if the fight stays on the feet, I think Aspinall has the advantage in the striking.

 

[mkess101]

Nope.
Just because sone bookmaker has come up with some odds for a theoretical MMA fight that may or may not even happen doesn't mean anyone can conclude from some numbers on a screen that "Jones is still as good as Aspinall ".

Odds really don't mean that much, it's just a bookmaker trying not to lose money on a fight.

Only way to see how they compare os for them to actually fight. Seems to me that only ONE of them is super keen to actually fight and that's the guy from the UK. Jonesrreally doesn't WANT to fight Aspinall but Aspinall DOES want to fight Jones.

Jones is the big holdup it's completely obvious. Rapidly losing interest in this fight.
It'll probably only last 90secs anyway.

Oddsmakers are a good barometer in that they need to be right more than they're wrong in order to remain profitable.

What @Luffy doesn't understand is that oddsmakers are also making their own bets on where the public $ will be placed.

In this specific case, you have an extremely well known fighter vs one really only known by the MMA community. Public perception and casual action in scenarios like this strongly tilts toward the more well known entity. Meaning, the fact that Jones is an underdog at all is very telling. The books realize the betting public in general will want to bet on Jones if the fight is made. Which would normally mean making Jones the favorite in order to entice some action on Aspinall. In this case, they aren't doing that because if they make Jones the favorite, they're concerned that sharps will pounce on Aspinall at + odds. Not everyone makes wagers and understands sports betting markets and that's okay.

Cliffs: the books likely think Aspinall' chances of winning are even better than the odds actually indicate.

 

[MuddyFugger]

Strip Jones

 

[Luffy]

Nope.
Just because sone bookmaker has come up with some odds for a theoretical MMA fight that may or may not even happen doesn't mean anyone can conclude from some numbers on a screen that "Jones is still as good as Aspinall ".

Odds really don't mean that much, it's just a bookmaker trying not to lose money on a fight.

Only way to see how they compare os for them to actually fight. Seems to me that only ONE of them is super keen to actually fight and that's the guy from the UK. Jonesrreally doesn't WANT to fight Aspinall but Aspinall DOES want to fight Jones.

Jones is the big holdup it's completely obvious. Rapidly losing interest in this fight.
It'll probably only last 90secs anyway.

Like, it won't last more than 90 seconds? I doubt it.

I think JJ will either get a third round TKO like vs Gus 2 or it'd be a war like Gus 1 and JJ will pull something out and get a 5th round finish by choke or spinning elbow. Or at worst, it'll go to decision and JJ will get a 3-2 after Aspinall gets a solid 2-0, forcing JJ to dig deep like he always did when his opponents ended up winning the first two rounds. That is, the taking over point being round 3, when he'll even the fight and slightly get the round due to pressure and impact... And then, in the late round, he'll show his championship experience. I think round 4 will have JJ getting close to finishing, like Gus1 and vs Reyes, both fights in which Gus and Reyes were almost getting KO'd in round 4 and were on shaken legs.

And then, JJ will push hard since he'd need to win the last round, and Aspinall won't have the same cardio. JJ may be more injured, but Tom will either need to land a big shot or just survive the round like Reyes. Maybe fight back and getting good shots like Gus 1, but more likely, a JJ vs Reyes scenario where Tom, like Reyes, will be running away all the round just so he doesn't get finished and can get a psychological win of lying to himself he "was robbed" when he knows he wasn't... But unlike the Reyes match, I think JJ got better since then, and will shut up any conspiracy theory of "wrong judging", hence, he will make it as hard as he can to finish Tom in the last round.

 

[shorinryu86]

 

[jmag]

I'll pick Jones being one step ahead in position, up against cage, td and pound. Can also see him catching a missile and getting finished.

 

[Bend NvR Break]

34,440 posts and so clueless
I feel sorry for you.

Im sorry to tell you, but size matters......
Remember when Gus put Jon in hospital? You can check what 39 year old Werdum did to Gus by the way

Do you think Reyes would just beat up 263lb Pavlovich? and 6"8 Volkov?
He wouldnt last a round, the size is way too much

You're talking to a guy who weighed 173 pounds and had a very see successful wedding career at 189 pounds.

Also you completely wiped away figured careers like sakuraba and Frankie Edgar that fought above weight classes they entire careers and were extremely successful.

I could literally sit down with you and spend hours running through a list of lower weight fighters that beat heavier fighters because size isn't the "end all be all" that you're trying to make it. It's just one aspect.

We can talk about how for a solid 5 years or so it was universally thought that Jon, DC and Rumble were the best fighters in the UFC period. Not pound for pound. they just were the best. 3 LHW that would absolutely dog walk whatever heavyweight you put in front of them.

And if you didn't notice Gus looked like dog shit after losing to Jon, Rumble and DC. All his motivation he threw out the window once he finally accepted he'd never look like a champ. I like how you point out that her looked like crap against Werdum but fail to mention he looked even worse against Anthony Smith, WHO WAS A MW WHO MOVED UP AND HAD MORE SUCCESS AT LHW.