Economy The great housing market crash of 2022

[Deleted member 577981]

I think you missed the point of my post. It doesn't matter if someone is on social media or watches the news, it's become so ubiquitous that it intersects people's lives even if they are not actively seeking it out. Re-read the 2 anecdotes I posted regarding kids for examples of how this happens.

i think you missed mine.... i know a lot of people for "reasons" and NONE of them are having these problems. i think its bad parenting that is the problem and you dont see it because you are so wrapped up in the world that you cannot imagine unplugging and living in the real world. i think that's very sad.

to those people that are living outside of false culture created by corporations for profit it seems like a comedy/tragedy to see people keep hitting themselves in the head and complaining that it hurts......

 

[panamaican]

i think you missed mine.... i know a lot of people for "reasons" and NONE of them are having these problems. i think its bad parenting that is the problem and you dont see it because you are so wrapped up in the world that you cannot imagine unplugging and living in the real world. i think that's very sad.

to those people that are living outside of false culture created by corporations for profit it seems like a comedy/tragedy to see people keep hitting themselves in the head and complaining that it hurts......

Sorry but that doesn't actually address what I said. I said that people from your generation and mine do not fully understand how integrated it is in the world of young people today. We can say "just stop using it" but we're not actually addressing that people don't need to be on it for it to affect them.

I'll return to my anecdote with a simple question. A parent keeps their kid off social media. But the kid is being mocked and targeted on social media by other kids. That mockery then affects how people in the school treat that kid in real life. How has ignoring social media actually prevented social media from affecting the child?

John unplugs from the news but his boss is a rabid devourer or the 24/7 news cycle and constantly discusses random events that the boss learned about on the news. How can John avoid the news presented by his boss?.

 

[Deleted member 577981]

Sorry but that doesn't actually address what I said. I said that people from your generation and mine do not fully understand how integrated it is in the world of young people today. We can say "just stop using it" but we're not actually addressing that people don't need to be on it for it to affect them.

I'll return to my anecdote with a simple question. A parent keeps their kid off social media. But the kid is being mocked and targeted on social media by other kids. That mockery then affects how people in the school treat that kid in real life. How has ignoring social media actually prevented social media from affecting the child?

John unplugs from the news but his boss is a rabid devourer or the 24/7 news cycle and constantly discusses random events that the boss learned about on the news. How can John avoid the news presented by his boss?.

you are talking past me and not addressing what im saying. i know a TON of parents and none of them are having this problem with their kids..... there is a world.... a real one... outside of social media and there are lots of kids who are plugged into that real world.

its bad parenting that allows so many children to get caught up in this... bad parenting and addictive tendencies and an inability to have a life outside of pop culture which is a cancer.

you might benefit from watching this short clip with chris hedges taling about the same thing. intelligent people do not allow pop culture and for profit corporations to create their culture for them. i dont and never have and its pretty apparent the benefits.



to the below.... maybe you think the wold is all on off switches... all or nothing... i dont. the families i know and the kids who they raise all have freinds who are not losing themselves online. you cant conceive of another life i think because you yourself dont know another life. i would guess you spend way too much time online on multiple forums. start by unplugging man. the real world awaits you and the real people who are plugged into the real world.


I'll return to my anecdote with a simple question. A parent keeps their kid off social media. But the kid is being mocked and targeted on social media by other kids. That mockery then affects how people in the school treat that kid in real life. How has ignoring social media actually prevented social media from affecting the child?

 

[panamaican]

you are talking past me and not addressing what im saying. i know a TON of parents and none of them are having this problem with their kids..... there is a world.... a real one... outside of social media and there are lots of kids who are plugged into that real world.

its bad parenting that allows so many children to get caught up in this... bad parenting and addictive tendencies and an inability to have a life outside of pop culture which is a cancer.

you might benefit from watching this short clip with chris hedges taling about the same thing. intelligent people do not allow pop culture and for profit corporations to create their culture for them. i dont and never have and its pretty apparent the benefits.



to the below.... maybe you think the wold is all on off switches... all or nothing... i dont. the families i know and the kids who they raise all have freinds who are not losing themselves online. you cant conceive of another life i think because you yourself dont know another life. i would guess you spend way too much time online on multiple forums. start by unplugging man. the real world awaits you and the real people who are plugged into the real world.


I'll return to my anecdote with a simple question. A parent keeps their kid off social media. But the kid is being mocked and targeted on social media by other kids. That mockery then affects how people in the school treat that kid in real life. How has ignoring social media actually prevented social media from affecting the child?

I'm not talking past you. You keep saying "people can unplug". Agreed.

Now, how does that stop them from being affected by people who have not unplugged. The intersection takes place in the real world, not the online world. I'm saying it is a reality for kids today. Simply unplugging does not remove them from the macro effects of social media on their social lives.

Seriously, what part of what I'm saying is confusing you since I already agreed with your simple point that people can unplug. Then there is a second step -- just because someone has unplugged from the online world, they are still part of the real world. And in the real world, they are engaging with people are still plugged in to the online world. And what those people do affects the unplugged people in the real world.

 

[mkess101]

I'm not talking past you. You keep saying "people can unplug". Agreed.

Now, how does that stop them from being affected by people who have not unplugged. The intersection takes place in the real world, not the online world. I'm saying it is a reality for kids today. Simply unplugging does not remove them from the macro effects of social media on their social lives.

Seriously, what part of what I'm saying is confusing you since I already agreed with your simple point that people can unplug. Then there is a second step -- just because someone has unplugged from the online world, they are still part of the real world. And in the real world, they are engaging with people are still plugged in to the online world. And what those people do affects the unplugged people in the real world.

This is unquestionably true. The anecdote used plays out across the country daily.

Social media and electronic communication in general is so interwoven into society that barring "going off the grid" and being isolated, kids can't avoid being affected.

 

[Rand M Arthur]

It's not puzzling. It's ubiquitous.

You go into a waiting room and they have the news on. You're listening to the radio and they constantly give news updates, even on the music stations. It's not all political news but it's still impactful. Even if someone minimizes their personal engagement with the news, the people around them are still consuming it and bringing to the forefront of conversation.

Social media is the same. We can all look down our noses at it but it's a huge driver of social information and people are social. I'll use 2 anecdotes to illustrate how older people simply do not understand how this works for the younger generations.

First, my business partner has a kid. The kid plays video games with his friends. But many of the games they play are online so they talk while they game. So, one kid starts making fun of another kid in the video game chat but the kid being mocked isn't online playing the game, so he doesn't know. Then that mockery goes from the game to a social media platform. Now the kid being mocked is being made fun of by kids he doesn't he even know. And the spread is almost instantaneous because social media. When he goes back to school the next day, he finds himself being mocked by a large contingent of people for reasons that he has no idea about. Why? Because the mockery started on social media but it moved into real life. We didn't have to deal with that growing up, if someone was making fun of you, you either knew who they were or their reach was only their close friends. Now, that reach is everyone with access to that social media account. How does a young person manage that effect? Even if they are not on social media themselves it's going to have a massive impact on their social standing, their sense of self, etc. It's a completely different world.

Second story, I have a friend at my kid's school (smart guy, runs a hedge fund, used to a pretty good athlete so a well rounded normal human). Put his foot down on social media. Complete no go in his house until the kid is 16. But then in middle school, the school organized a dance. Kid needed a date. Problem was, everyone was asking people out on social media. All of the plans about meeting up to get there or what to do afterwards were happening on social media. By not being on social media, his kid was being locked out of the social world for his age group which is horrible for kids at that age. So, he had to choose between his adult opinion on not letting his kid have social media and the kid's social health from being ostracized. Tough balance but he had to accept that he couldn't run a complete ban on social media and still have a socially healthy child. He struck a compromise but the end result is still that the kid is now somewhat exposed to social media...because it has become an essential part of this generation's living and life, for good and for ill.

Our generation gets to pretend that it's easily ignored because all of our similar aged friends grew up in the same way. Either social media was brand new and not what it is now or, for the older people, they went through their formative years and social media didn't even exist. Either way, none of us have the requisite experience to honestly say that this generation can just ignore it like we're choosing.

There is also the third scenario when it comes to stuff like porn or liveleak.

I have told my eldest that he can have a smartphone when they pay for one from their own earnings. That was the line I set down with my wife. When he is 15 or 16 and has saved enough from a part time job, he can use that to buy one. Before that he will have to make do with an old brick that only does phone calls.

And 24 out of 25 kids in his class may have parents that think the same. But it only takes one kid having access to a smart phone, and this access to pornhub or liveleak, and every single kid in that class will be exposed to that content at a young age.

 

[Deleted member 577981]

I'm not talking past you. You keep saying "people can unplug". Agreed.

Now, how does that stop them from being affected by people who have not unplugged. The intersection takes place in the real world, not the online world. I'm saying it is a reality for kids today. Simply unplugging does not remove them from the macro effects of social media on their social lives.

Seriously, what part of what I'm saying is confusing you since I already agreed with your simple point that people can unplug. Then there is a second step -- just because someone has unplugged from the online world, they are still part of the real world. And in the real world, they are engaging with people are still plugged in to the online world. And what those people do affects the unplugged people in the real world.

i addressed this point already. as long as you dont live in an on/off world then there are degrees of the poison. you can keep nearly all of it from people by just unplugging. its that simple.... i can see it in the neighbor kids.... those that are allowed online show a marked difference in attitude and state of mind. its an obvious negative and its pretty stark and the effect seems nearly immediate. those that are not are MUCH better off. yes they will interact but if a person is not feeding that garbage into their heads in a toxic online setting then the effects are pretty negligible. you can teach the kids who are not online about the profound negative effects social media is having on kids and that compassion and love is what they need.

like ive said man..... good parents have already navigated this successfully. and their kids are GLAD they did. im sorry that seems impossible for you to comprehend. you should spend less time online i think.

 

[BIKES!]

This is very liberal of me but I am all for tabling rules around residential investment groups/people. The supply and demand shortage and affordable housing will only get worse.

 

[panamaican]

i addressed this point already. as long as you dont live in an on/off world then there are degrees of the poison. you can keep nearly all of it from people by just unplugging. its that simple.... i can see it in the neighbor kids.... those that are allowed online show a marked difference in attitude and state of mind. its an obvious negative and its pretty stark and the effect seems nearly immediate. those that are not are MUCH better off. yes they will interact but if a person is not feeding that garbage into their heads in a toxic online setting then the effects are pretty negligible. you can teach the kids who are not online about the profound negative effects social media is having on kids and that compassion and love is what they need.

like ive said man..... good parents have already navigated this successfully. and their kids are GLAD they did. im sorry that seems impossible for you to comprehend. you should spend less time online i think.

It's unfortunately not that simple. See the 2 posts above yours that understand this issue quite well. Unless someone is homeschooling and reducing their child's social world to handpicked children, they're being affected by it in myriad ways. And parents who think otherwise probably don't have a real grasp on just how widespread social media is in children's social lives or their kids are still under 7 years old.

Let's take a simpler, more innocent, dynamic - dance crazes. They start off viral and end up in the real world. Are "good" parents telling their kids that they can't learn dances from their friends if the dance craze started on the internet? Are kids turning down learning new dance moves because it started on social media?

 

[mkess101]

i addressed this point already. as long as you dont live in an on/off world then there are degrees of the poison. you can keep nearly all of it from people by just unplugging. its that simple.... i can see it in the neighbor kids.... those that are allowed online show a marked difference in attitude and state of mind. its an obvious negative and its pretty stark and the effect seems nearly immediate. those that are not are MUCH better off. yes they will interact but if a person is not feeding that garbage into their heads in a toxic online setting then the effects are pretty negligible. you can teach the kids who are not online about the profound negative effects social media is having on kids and that compassion and love is what they need.

like ive said man..... good parents have already navigated this successfully. and their kids are GLAD they did. im sorry that seems impossible for you to comprehend. you should spend less time online i think.

I do agree that there are degrees. I'd kind of assumed that went without saying. Kids that are hip deep in the electronic world are absolutely going to have more negative fallout from it than kids who are indirectly affected.

But that still doesn't mean parents can truly insulate their kids from it without also making them extremely isolated. The best parents have to walk a tightrope.

 

[Deleted member 577981]

It's unfortunately not that simple. See the 2 posts above yours that understand this issue quite well. Unless someone is homeschooling and reducing their child's social world to handpicked children, they're being affected by it in myriad ways. And parents who think otherwise probably don't have a real grasp on just how widespread social media is in children's social lives or their kids are still under 7 years old.

Let's take a simpler, more innocent, dynamic - dance crazes. They start off viral and end up in the real world. Are "good" parents telling their kids that they can't learn dances from their friends if the dance craze started on the internet? Are kids turning down learning new dance moves because it started on social media?

i just explained that this can be navigated quite easily. you should watch that video i posted. "dance crazes" are addressed if you are paying attnetion.

i understand where you are coming from but i think you dont understand where i am coming from. i think the world i am discussing is larger more authentic and more meaningful frankly.

you jave always struck me as a person whose mind has been formed by online culture WAY too much btw.

 

[Deleted member 577981]

I do agree that there are degrees. I'd kind of assumed that went without saying. Kids that are hip deep in the electronic world are absolutely going to have more negative fallout from it than kids who are indirectly affected.

But that still doesn't mean parents can truly insulate their kids from it without also making them extremely isolated. The best parents have to walk a tightrope.

i agree with your post. ive seen it done well and it does seem to be pretty easy. you create a home life that is not online and you teach kids about the endless harm online time causes, you point out the struggle, the vulgarity and the shallow behavior and state of mind people who spend time online display.... and you limit online time to a very large extent. like i said i've already seen it done and its pretty easy if you already are free from it yourself as a parent.

 

[panamaican]

i just explained that this can be navigated quite easily. you should watch that video i posted. "dance crazes" are addressed if you are paying attnetion.

i understand where you are coming from but i think you dont understand where i am coming from. i think the world i am discussing is larger more authentic and more meaningful frankly.

you jave always struck me as a person whose mind has been formed by online culture WAY too much btw.

You've never struck me as particularly good at following arguments, so I'm not surprised that you have no idea how my mind is shaped.

As for the topic at hand...

Your video did not address what I said.

 

[Deleted member 577981]

You've never struck me as particularly good at following arguments, so I'm not surprised that you have no idea how my mind is shaped.

As for the topic at hand...

Your video did not address what I said.

did you see the part where everyone was dancing the same while hedges talked about greedy corporations producing culture? it addresses your point if you are thinking deeply about it.

bottom line... dont hit yourself on the head and then complain about blunt force trauma and don't pretend its inevitable to be hurt the way you are..

 

[mkess101]

i agree with your post. ive seen it done well and it does seem to be pretty easy. you create a home life that is not online and you teach kids about the endless harm online time causes, you point out the struggle, the vulgarity and the shallow behavior and state of mind people who spend time online display.... and you limit online time to a very large extent. like i said i've already seen it done and its pretty easy if you already are free from it yourself as a parent.

I don't know if I'd say "easy", and it also probably depends on the kid. It can absolutely be successfully navigated, but it takes vigilance and the ability to communicate effectively. The relationships kids form with friends matter a ton to them, and all parents obviously have different ideas on what's appropriate. There are a lot of moving parts.

You can't eliminate the negative effects of the electronic world on your kids without isolating them. But you can minimize it.

 

[panamaican]

did you see the part where everyone was dancing the same while hedges talked about greedy corporations producing culture? it addresses your point if you are thinking deeply about it.

bottom line... dont hit yourself on the head and then complain about blunt force trauma and don't pretend its inevitable to be hurt the way you are..

I watched your video, it has nothing to do with what I wrote. It only barely has anything to do with social media and children.

If anyone thinks that video is related to the conversation about how social media, children and the social world that kids are growing up in, it tells me that they either they don't really understand that video or they don't understand the real world of kids.

 

[Deleted member 577981]

I don't know if I'd say "easy", and it also probably depends on the kid. It can absolutely be successfully navigated, but it takes vigilance and the ability to communicate effectively. The relationships kids form with friends matter a ton to them, and all parents obviously have different ideas on what's appropriate. There are a lot of moving parts.

You can't eliminate the negative effects of the electronic world on your kids without isolating them. But you can minimize it.

that sounds about right to me and you can minimize it to a very large degree. unplugging from pop culture ought to be a national phenomenon. everyone i know who has done it consciously and for principled reasons.... or who was raised that way is happier and healthier and spiritualy more mature.

its shocking to me when i hear people lament the damage its doing to them or their kids..... i just dont get it. they are not victims... they are volunteers.

 

[Deleted member 577981]

I watched your video, it has nothing to do with what I wrote. It only barely has anything to do with social media and children.

If anyone thinks that video is related to the conversation about how social media, children and the social world that kids are growing up in, it tells me that they either they don't really understand that video or they don't understand the real world of kids.

it speaks specifically about the great plague that pop culture is and how it is a killer of real meaning and purpose. you just are not familiar with hedges or his thought and obviously have not had time to think deeply about what he is saying in that video. its not the kind of thing you just glance at friend. he is absolutely talking about false toxic culture created by corporations (think social media and news outlets music producers and clothing manufacturers) that poison the mind and rob people of authentic meaning.

if you cant see the connection to this topic then that is a personal problem. in fact people coming from this place speak of a "crisis of meaning" in this country and feel we are in a race against social media and culture generating corporations to stop them from destroying peoples minds and snuffing out meaning altogether and that there is a profound need to instill deep meaning and purpose in human beings again and that requires unplugging from toxic media of all kinds (to a large extent).

obviously that is just the beginning but im talking about parents who have already taken the journey or some portion of it and are raising kids embedded in meaning and devoid of cancerous corporate propaganda and addictive media platforms.

 

[panamaican]

it speaks specifically about the great plague that pop culture is and how it is a killer of real meaning and purpose. you just are not familiar with hedges or his thought and obviously have not had time to think deeply about what he is saying in that video. its not the kind of thing you just glance at friend. he is absolutely talking about false toxic culture created by corporations (think social media and news outlets music producers and clothing manufacturers) that poison the mind and rob people of authentic meaning.

if you cant see the connection to this topic then that is a personal problem. in fact people coming from this place speak of a "crisis of meaning" in this country and feel we are in a race against social media and culture generating corporations to stop them from destroying peoples minds and snuffing out meaning altogether and that there is a profound need to instill deep meaning and purpose in human being again and that requires unplugging from toxic media of all kinds (to a large extent).

obviously that is just the beginning but im talking about parents who have already taken the journey or some portion of it and are raising kids embedded in meaning and devoid of cancerous corporate propaganda and addictive media platforms.

Lol, that's not about social media and children and the social world of kids. Frankly no one who is parenting children through this time should be following that video on creating a safe nurturing environment for children. It has nothing to do with kids or their social world.

You can stop telling me about these parents you know because you have yet to tell us what they've done. I gave real life examples of actual circumstances that real parents have to manage, you've posted some guy, without any specific skills in the child-rearing space, randomly going on about his opinion on the intersection of reality and corporate greed (to paraphrase mockingly) and then alluded to some parents without stating a single action or decision made by them.

If you want actual literature on navigating social media for kids, how children form social attachments, the value of children's social networks to themselves, the importance of friend groups over parental approval and why it's a naturally occurring process, I can give you leads. If you want manifestos on anti-capitalism and anti-pop culture, you can do that yourself, just understand that it's not relevant to kids, their changing brains and their innate need for peer acceptance and how social media in the modern world intersects with those things.

 

[Deleted member 577981]

Lol, that's not about social media and children and the social world of kids. Frankly no one who is parenting children through this time should be following that video on creating a safe nurturing environment for children. It has nothing to do with kids or their social world.

You can stop telling me about these parents you know because you have yet to tell us what they've done. I gave real life examples of actual circumstances that real parents have to manage, you've posted some guy, without any specific skills in the child-rearing space, randomly going on about his opinion on the intersection of reality and corporate greed (to paraphrase mockingly) and then alluded to some parents without stating a single action or decision made by them.

If you want actual literature on navigating social media for kids, how children form social attachments, the value of children's social networks to themselves, the importance of friend groups over parental approval and why it's a naturally occurring process, I can give you leads. If you want manifestos on anti-capitalism and anti-pop culture, you can do that yourself, just understand that it's not relevant to kids, their changing brains and their innate need for peer acceptance and how social media in the modern world intersects with those things.

yes that video is talking about the issue through principles... you just haven't thought deeply about it. you are just splitting hairs for no reason because your ego cannot allow you to be agreeable here. these ideas are totally new to you.... you've never heard them before, and you are not humble enough to ask questions that might help you understand them.

pretending i have not posted anything these parents do is realy disingenuous.... first of all you haven't asked and second of all its a lie. ive said they keep their kids off of social media to a very large extent. that is pretty much all you need to know when the subject is the damage social media causes lol.... ill add that if there is any time allowed it is in the living room with a parent sitting with them just like any good parent would do with a pg movie...... and the time spent is very limited. i have already shared that they help kids to frame the toxic and sad addictive pop culture that social media promotes and see through it and not be enamored by it. and ive also already said they educate their kids on the damages that social media does to peoples minds/perspectives and point it out when it is displayed by freinds...

ill add that my daughter has been meditating for 20 to 40 minutes twice a day for years and that in itself has caused her to naturally see through pop culture, pop music, corporate manipulation to get a person brand loyal, social media and many other issues that seem to grow only in an unhealthy and thought addicted mind that has lost touch with its natural compassion and gentleness and stillness. this natural depth causes one to see though empty culture, is progressive, and deepens over time, and is equal to the task at hand i think. but i don't think this is a necessary component as lots of the parents i know who have been successful at this have not taught that skill to their kids.


anyway man..... if you want it to be black and white let it be that for you. that's just not my experience.