Elections James Carville on the state of the Democrat party

[unimackpass]

Fact is, it doesn't matter. Trump is doing a good job and the left has gone full retard. That's the simple reality. The democrat machine is imploding and it would be a very tough sell to the American people in regards to voting for a guy who is seen by most as an aged socialist.

Obama had tried to warn the party and they didn't listen. The left has gone full retard and it's unlikely they can get it together and back an electable opponent before Trump has them firmly crushed

When Obama is warning the left their to far left and their still not listening, what more can one say.

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

Trump doesn't have record deficits. Obama's entire first term had higher deficits, but to clarify, deficits reaching $1 billion under orange man are horrible and the sky is falling, but Bernie adding Trillions to it is good?

This is what I said in post 47 of this thread so hard miss on your orange man schtick.


"To be clear I don't agree with running deficits in a booming economy , it's madness imo but that's where we are ."

Would you acknowledge that economy was a little different during Obama's first term ?

 

[ultramanhyata]

He's right. If you end up with Trump running against Bernie, there are going to be a lot of very reasonable people who feel like they are going to be left without a candidate they feel entirely comfortable voting for.

Aren't you on team Lesser Of Two Evils?

Many on the left were not "entirely comfortable" voting for Hillary Clinton in 2016. But they were told by "very reasonable" guys like Carville that you always vote for the major party presidential candidate that comes closest to your positions.

And those on the left who chose not to follow this advice and either stayed home or voted third party were shamed and derided by these "very reasonable" people following Clinton's loss.

So even if Bernie is 3 miles off your target, as long as Trump is 3.1 or more miles off it, you gots to pull teh trigger and vote democrat! Feel the Bern. Embrace the pain of teh Bern.

 

[ultramanhyata]

When Obama is warning the left their to far left and their still not listening, what more can one say.

Uh... I would say that it proves only Fox News morons considered Barack Obama a radical leftist. As opposed to the centrist corporatist that he actual was.

 

[nac386]

Aren't you on team Lesser Of Two Evils?

Many on the left were not "entirely comfortable" voting for Hillary Clinton in 2016. But they were told by "very reasonable" guys like Carville that you always vote for the major party presidential candidate that comes closest to your positions.

And those on the left who chose not to follow this advice and either stayed home or voted third party were shamed and derided by these "very reasonable" people following Clinton's loss.

So even if Bernie is 3 miles off your target, as long as Trump is 3.1 or more miles off it, you gots to pull teh trigger and vote democrat! Feel the Bern. Embrace the pain of teh Bern.

Oh I will certainly show up on election day to vote for the the better candidate. I don't subscribe to the idea of taking your ball and going home just because your favorite candidate (if there even is one) did not make it through the primaries.

Uh... I would say that it proves only Fox News morons considered Barack Obama a radical leftist. As opposed to the centrist corporatist that he actual was.

Yeah, the attempt to paint Barack Obama as a far left President was ludicrous. But people bought into that misinformation so hard that there really was no going back for them.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Yeah, the attempt to paint Barack Obama as a far left President was ludicrous. But people bought into that misinformation so hard that there really was no going back for them.

It's not about Obama specifically. Opposition propaganda for any party describing any politician will portray them as being an extremist.

 

[nostradumbass]

This is what I said in post 47 of this thread so hard miss on your orange man schtick.


"To be clear I don't agree with running deficits in a booming economy , it's madness imo but that's where we are ."

Would you acknowledge that economy was a little different during Obama's first term ?

OK, so it's not record deficits, and now you're making a different argument.

Great, so should Bernie first destroy the economy so adding TRILLIONS to the deficit would be ok, or can you be honest for one second and admit that he will in fact hike the shit out of everyone's taxes and those taxes will include paying off debts for millennials?

 

[ultramanhyata]

He's not talking about it in any sensible way. His solution to everything is just throwing money at it, and most people are aware it's their money he's talking about.

It's hilarious how guys like you think that "Bootstraps!" is an entirely "sensible" way to address the student loan crisis. But a federal debt relief plan is not.

(Note: I depart from Sanders on his approach to student debt relief. But his plan is 100 times more rational than anything the Trumpublicans have proposed.)

 

[nostradumbass]

It's hilarious how guys like you think that "Bootstraps!" is an entirely "sensible" way to address the student loan crisis. But a federal debt relief plan is not.

(Note: I depart from Sanders on his approach to student debt relief. But his plan is 100 times more rational than anything the Trumpublicans have proposed.)

Who are you quoting? Please include the post where I said "Bootstraps!"

 

[ultramanhyata]

Eat a dick, new guy. And the message is either right or wrong, doesn't matter who's delivering it. If Carville tells you that the sky is red and I say it's blue, I'm still right, despite his credentials.

Carville was a pioneer of the New Democrats movement that Clinton and Gore embodied. And "New Democrat" really just meant pro-capital, pro-market, anti-labor democrat.

Carville can (also) eat a dick.

 

[ultramanhyata]

Who are you quoting? Please include the post where I said "Bootstraps!"

If John Smith went to college, earned a degree, and is now looking at 80K in loan debt, is there any option you (or the GOP) are willing to offer Mr. Smith other than advising him to put his nose to the grindstone, work hard, live frugally, budget wisely and pay off every penny of that debt? (aka, "Bootstraps!")

 

[nostradumbass]

If John Smith went to college, earned a degree, and is now looking at 80K in loan debt, is there any option you (or the GOP) are willing to offer Mr. Smith other than advising him to put his nose to the grindstone, work hard, live frugally, budget wisely and pay off every penny of that debt? (aka, "Bootstraps!")

Uh, why is that different from a mortgage? OMG, you GOP satans actually think people should pay for the houses they bought? That guy shouldn't be expected to actually pay for his house and car. Come on, just pay double taxes so that guy can just keep them and not have to worry about it.

The guy's got a degree, right? Sounds like he doesn't really need "bootstraps", or whatever word you want to use. Why would paying it off himself be unreasonable, but expecting everyone else to pay it off for him be totally reasonable?

 

[nac386]

Sure but people vote for all kinds of reasons. Its possible they voted for Clinton despite liking Sanders more due to the impression that Clinton was more electable. Your claim was that reasonable people would be alienated by Sanders but I think that's an odd thing to suggest when he's more popular than she is. They may not have faith in his chances but I doubt he'd be as alienating as the Ice Queen.

That's not what I meant by that. When I said there'd be a lot of reasonable people left without a candidate they were comfortable with, I did not mean that all reasonable people would be turned off by those candidates. I was actually just using the term "reasonable" to mean that it's not unreasonable to be concerned by both candidates. I think there were plenty of reasonable people who were not comfortable with Hillary Clinton as well.

But I think that the gap between Sanders and Trump (as far as left vs right) is very large, likely the largest in my lifetime. That is what I was trying to highlight.

 

[AnGrYcRoW]

OK, so it's not record deficits, and now you're making a different argument.

Great, so should Bernie first destroy the economy so adding TRILLIONS to the deficit would be ok, or can you be honest for one second and admit that he will in fact hike the shit out of everyone's taxes and those taxes will include paying off debts for millennials?

First , I'm not a Bernie bro but he has made it clear he intends to pay for his proposals by taxing the wealthy and corporations , I haven't seen it costed out but I suspect he , like Trump will continue to run deficits to pay for his policies .

The point I was trying to make is that it's pretty weak for anyone on the right to criticize Bernie's ability to pay for his ideas when they don't seem to care about debt and deficits when one of their " team " is in office .

 

[ultramanhyata]

Uh, why is that different from a mortgage? OMG, you GOP satans actually think people should pay for the houses they bought? That guy shouldn't be expected to actually pay for his house and car. Come on, just pay double taxes so that guy can just keep them and not have to worry about it.

The guy's got a degree, right? Sounds like he doesn't really need "bootstraps", or whatever word you want to use. Why would paying it off himself be unreasonable, but expecting everyone else to pay it off for him be totally reasonable?

Bootstraps: Confirmed.

There is no shame in the 'straps, Nostra. Embrace the 'straps.

 

[AGGAMEMNON66]

He's right. If you end up with Trump running against Bernie, there are going to be a lot of very reasonable people who feel like they are going to be left without a candidate they feel entirely comfortable voting for.

I feel like this is possibly just a trend tho. Like, for a decade extremes are cool but then.. something else comes along. I really don’t see either party being in trouble as much as people claim. People (myself included) said after Obama the right was dead in the water, will struggle to stay relevant.. then last election BOOM -Trump. Now people are predicting doom and gloom for the left but honestly I think it’s going to be business as usual even if they don’t grab this upcoming election.


It’s a distraction. Politics is mastering the art of entertainment. Political theater if you will.

 

[nostradumbass]

Bootstraps: Confirmed.

There is no shame in the 'straps, Nostra. Embrace the 'straps.

"Bootstrap" is your argument, not mine. You think taking care of yourself in even the most basic sense is "bootstrap"? Do you wipe your own ass, or do you need Bernie to do that for you to?

 

[ultramanhyata]

"Bootstrap" is your argument, not mine. You think taking care of yourself in even the most basic sense is "bootstrap"?

The verb "bootstrap" simply means to determinedly do what you need to do, and what it is within your legal power to do, as an individual, to achieve a particular objective.

You want to pretend we have some conflict over the definition to deflect from a clear admission that the "policy" proposal you support to address the student debt crisis is that there be no policy and that Nature simply be allowed to take her course.

Which is your prerogative. But makes you look like a fool when you then attempt to mock Sanders for "not having a real plan".

 

[VivaRevolution]

Here’s the truth about doormat for you @VivaRevolution and that tatamos guy I forgot the name of Edit: @tatanos

He’s a radical who’s been soften up over the years. He hasn’t yet denounced his love for the CCCP, Cuba, Venezuela, etc. He hasn’t denounced his own campaign managers who tout gulags and re-education. He is politician who has done nothing of worth in 30 years. The man starts his “rallies” by letting people come up there and blame race for America’s troubles and call for the banning of CBP and ICE...open borders if you will.....

Lieawatha made the mistake of putting numbers behind the face and her “magic” has faded. Doormat hasn’t yet had the chance to do it, you see when people hear the numbers needed for his lunatic “plans” the tingle you think people get will go away. There’s no “revolution” and no “new voters” will be rallied. Reality is a tough pill to swallow

You simply have a geriatric communist with heart problems who in a sea of lunacy might be the least to lose....against Trump in a general it’s a bloodbath and the DNC is smart enough to know it. It’s funny because it’s people like you who have the DNC between a rock and a hard place. You nominate doormat and half the country doesn’t vote/votes Trump. Doormat gets shafted again and the bros try to destroy the already weak Democratic Party.....what a time

Fight me irl.

 

[AlexDB9]

Fight me irl.

I’ve gotten into fist/machete fights with actual communists who at least walk the walk. You sure?