Donald Trump and the gullible right wing.

[Winded Walrus]

like Donald Trump is the only one politician tricking those "stupid conservatives"

 

[Jack V Savage]

Jack, I'm curious...

Now that the president has nearly completed his second and final term I think we have a full and fair picture of his record, if not his legacy.

If you want to start a thread on what disagreements people have with Obama, I'll contribute. I would tell you off the bat that I don't look at things from the same lenses are you do. "Too far to left" or "too far to the right" are not angles I'd use to evaluate anyone's policy. For example, I don't think that Sanders' TBTF plan is bad because it's "too far to the left." I just think it's a dumb plan that won't help anyone and will hurt the economy. Likewise, I don't object to Trump's immigration "plan" because it's "too far to the right." Again, I just think it's dumb.

 

[ultramanhyata]

If you want to start a thread on what disagreements people have with Obama, I'll contribute. I would tell you off the bat that I don't look at things from the same lenses are you do. "Too far to left" or "too far to the right" are not angles I'd use to evaluate anyone's policy. For example, I don't think that Sanders' TBTF plan is bad because it's "too far to the left." I just think it's a dumb plan that won't help anyone and will hurt the economy. Likewise, I don't object to Trump's immigration "plan" because it's "too far to the right." Again, I just think it's dumb.

Yet you're certainly not shy about throwing the terms "left-wing" and "right-wing" around when someone, from either political perspective, is engaged in debate with you. And you are obviously familiar with the metrics by which certain policies get labeled "liberal" or "conservative" in the national dialogue, as you continual utilize and reference those metrics in your various arguments on policy.

I was just curious to see some of that non-DNC imposed, "independent" thought you've recently been bragging about put on practical display. I was assuming you, personally, might find yourself either more liberal or more conservative than the president on at least one if not more policy positions.

But I understand your desire to deflect. It's all good.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Yet you're certainly not shy about throwing the terms "left-wing" and "right-wing" around when someone, from either political perspective, is engaged in debate with you.

Why would I be? When we're talking about theory that's very different from talking about a politician or about policy.

I was just curious to see some of that non-DNC imposed, "independent" thought you've recently been bragging about put on practical display. I was assuming you, personally, might find yourself either more liberal or more conservative than the president on at least one if not more policy positions.

But I understand your desire to deflect. It's all good.

I see. So you weren't actually interested in discussing anything like an adult. Just more of your creepy stalking me around and attacking me. I should have realized. It's actually pretty funny how I thought you were asking for an opinion because you wanted to start an interesting conversation. I'm a sucker sometimes.

 

[ultramanhyata]

I see. So you weren't actually interested in discussing anything like adult. Just more of your creepy stalking me around and attacking me. I should have realized. It's actually pretty funny how I thought you were asking for an opinion because you wanted to start an interesting conversation. I'm a sucker sometimes.

It was a 100 percent legit question, Jack. If anything, I'm the sucker for having asked it and for having thought that, perhaps, I had legitimately misjudged your political partisanship.

 

[Jack V Savage]

It was a 100 percent legit question, Jack. If anything, I'm the sucker for having asked it and for having thought that, perhaps, I had legitimately misjudged your political partisanship.

I don't believe that you "legitimately misjudged (my) political partisanship." You just pretend to think that I'm a partisan so you can dismiss arguments that make you think too much. It's a transparent and juvenile tactic.

If you seriously want to know where people disagree with Obama, start a thread on it, and don't derail another one with your constant personal attacks just because I embarrassed you some time in the past.

 

[n...not crazy]

He won in 2008 because people were sick and tired of Bush and the Republicans. Any Democrat of any color would

 

[Uchi Mata]

Obama's race had nothing to do with him winning both elections.

I wouldn't say that, but I don't think it's the reason so many white people voted for him.

 

[My Spot]

I guess way more black people than ever showed up to vote because the weather was nice.

"Way" more, you say?

 

[My Spot]

I wouldn't say that, but I don't think it's the reason so many white people voted for him.

I would. Hillary would've smashed McCain in 08 too and it would've had nothing to do with her being a woman.

 

[Jack V Savage]

I guess way more black people than ever showed up to vote because the weather was nice.

Obama's popular vote margin was 9.5 million. The increase in black voters from 2004 to 2008 wasn't even close to that. The statement that any Democrat would have won in 2008 is likely true, and if it's not, it has nothing to do with blacks turning out in greater numbers.

 

[Hollywood Nicky]

unlike libtards who vote for a guy because he's black

Conservatards want so much for this to be the case lol. Obviously some people voted for him because he was black, but more voted against him for that same reason. The majority of people voted for Obama in 08 because he was new, was 100% correct about Iraq, wasn't running with Palin, and wasn't going around singing "bomb bomb Iran" in a country that was so sick of war it was unreal.

 

[Throttlehead]

I would. Hillary would've smashed McCain in 08 too and it would've had nothing to do with her being a woman.

Obama, in his first election, won 43% of the white vote, the second-highest number for a Democrat since Carter. His 39% in 2012 puts him further down the list of Democrats in the last 10 elections, but only slightly below the average 40.6% share for Democrats through the years.

But more significant: the white vote has become less important. The percentage whites make up of the electorate has steadily declined, from a high of 89% in 1976 to a low of 72% in 2012.

WHITE VOTE IN PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS
2012: 72% of electorate, Romney 59, Obama 39
2008: 74% of electorate, McCain 55, Obama 43
2004: 77% of electorate, Bush 58, Kerry 41
2000: 81% of electorate, Bush 55, Gore 42
1996: 83% of electorate, Dole 46, Clinton 44 (Perot 9)
1992: 87% of electorate, Bush 41, Clinton 39 (Perot 21)
1988: 85% of electorate, Bush 60, Dukakis 40
1984: 86% of electorate, Reagan 66, Mondale 34
1980: 88% of electorate, Reagan 56, Carter 36 (Anderson 8)
1976: 89% of electorate, Ford 52, Carter 48

AVERAGE DEMOCRATIC WHITE VOTE SHARE: 40.6%

TOP DEMOCRATIC WHITE-VOTE GETTERS IN PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS

1. Carter (1976) - 48%
2. Clinton (1996) - 44
3. Obama (2008) - 43
4. Gore - 42
5. Kerry - 41
6. Dukakis - 40
7. Clinton(1992)

 

[Hollywood Nicky]

Of course it did

Agreed, if he was white he would have won by an even larger margin.

 

[Hollywood Nicky]

Garbage. The ACA has just doubled down on an insurance based HC system, and screwed millions out of their plans.

And when the idea of single payer and public option came up you conservatards were screaming about socialism, which is why we ended up with the mandate, which was YOUR PARTY'S IDEA!

 

[JDragon]

Obama, in his first election, won 43% of the white vote, the second-highest number for a Democrat since Carter. His 39% in 2012 puts him further down the list of Democrats in the last 10 elections, but only slightly below the average 40.6% share for Democrats through the years.

But more significant: the white vote has become less important. The percentage whites make up of the electorate has steadily declined, from a high of 89% in 1976 to a low of 72% in 2012.

WHITE VOTE IN PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS
2012: 72% of electorate, Romney 59, Obama 39
2008: 74% of electorate, McCain 55, Obama 43
2004: 77% of electorate, Bush 58, Kerry 41
2000: 81% of electorate, Bush 55, Gore 42
1996: 83% of electorate, Dole 46, Clinton 44 (Perot 9)
1992: 87% of electorate, Bush 41, Clinton 39 (Perot 21)
1988: 85% of electorate, Bush 60, Dukakis 40
1984: 86% of electorate, Reagan 66, Mondale 34
1980: 88% of electorate, Reagan 56, Carter 36 (Anderson 8)
1976: 89% of electorate, Ford 52, Carter 48

AVERAGE DEMOCRATIC WHITE VOTE SHARE: 40.6%

TOP DEMOCRATIC WHITE-VOTE GETTERS IN PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS

1. Carter (1976) - 48%
2. Clinton (1996) - 44
3. Obama (2008) - 43
4. Gore - 42
5. Kerry - 41
6. Dukakis - 40
7. Clinton(1992)

 

[LucasWithLidOff]

And when the idea of single payer and public option came up you conservatards were screaming about socialism, which is why we ended up with the mandate, which was YOUR PARTY'S IDEA!

The republicans are not "my party". I just find Obama and this current group of democrats to be the worst option of the 2.

I also love how it was a republican idea, but now that a democrat implemented it, it's the greatest thing since sliced bread to you people.

 

[UpaLoompa]

I guess way more black people than ever showed up to vote because the weather was nice.

The numbers don't, at all, support your position. Any democrat would have beat McCain/Palin in 2008 and Obama's percentage of the African American vote in 2012 wasn't markedly different than many democrats recently. 2012 was surprisingly close in my opinion given actual policy and how things had went, then again the GOP started campaigning against him November 5th 2008.

 

[n...not crazy]

"Way" more, you say?

Just a couple of million more than the last couple of elections. 2 million votes, no big deal.

Notice that red bar is higher than ever before. Enjoying this graph.

 

[UpaLoompa]

The republicans are not "my party". I just find Obama and this current group of democrats to be the worst option of the 2.

Really? Even McCain?

From where I'm sitting and looking at numbers the country's in drastically better shape than it was in 2008 and while some of that is natural some of it would certainly have been different under McCain and not for the better.