Men who took Testosterone but didn't exercise still GAINED MORE mass than men who workout naturally

[jeremyemilio]

The results do also show that those that took the placebo and exercised improved their Squat and Bench Press strength more than those that took test and didn't work out. Taking Test and not working out is pointless, better exercising drug free in that situation, but yeah you get massive improvements taking it and exercising, though even then it depends on the dose.

Nah. All that tells us is that bench pressing is like any other athletic movement. It takes some practice to be efficient in it.

It's like kicking a soccer ball, for example. If I take test, and work out even, and get much, much stronger, but never kick a soccer ball, I'm not going to improve my soccer kick as much as a guy who just spends his days kicking soccer balls. But that doesn't mean I'm not significantly stronger than he is. He's just better at kicking soccer balls.

 

[Pterodactyl]

I'm not surprised. Every once in awhile at my jiu-jitsu gym a meathead would come in for a white belt class and gas during warmups. I always chalked it up to meatheads doing no cardio and having roided up muscles that fill with blood and exhaust themselves too fast but if they're just roiding that would make sense.

Testosterone improves cardio by increasing red blood cell count.

 

[Ryoto Machida]

own experience > any study

I hear ya. You don't wanna talk to a scientist. All they doin is lyin, and makin ya pissed.

Speaking of which, fucking magnets! How do they work?

 

[Saint Of The K]

The critical piece of info here is the dosage. 600mg/wk.

That is an insane dosage of testosterone. For comparison my current TRT dosage is 200mg, which my doctor would prefer I take every two weeks (though I usually take it around 10 days since they let me, for the most part).

I was at 200mg/2 weeks for 2-3 years at a time where I could not do any significant exercise because I had 4 major shoulder surgeries. (The reason I was put on TRT initially was due to high levels of pain meds ruining my natural test levels)

2-3 years should have made me look like Ubereeem right? After all according to many posters in this thread "juice does all the work"....

Not the case. Perhaps I put in a small amount of muscle but I didn't notice. Actually like most of the 30+ year old men who I see at the dr office * with TRT and no major effort, I saw no major difference.

I'm no AAS expert by any means, but if you're on TRT doesn't it mean that your level is low, and that using testosterone only brings it back to a normal level (or maybe above shortly after injection)?
If it is the case, then why would you become Ubereem? No reason, unless you took an even bigger dose to reach uber domain.
So maybe it is just that you were able to keep your muscle or build a bit of it, whereas without TRT your muscle mass would have decreased.

I don't think that "juice does all the work", it's obviously not true, but if it didn't contribute to the extent it does we would not see the abuse we're seeing in bb today.

 

[Eater of Souls]

I'm no AAS expert by any means, but if you're on TRT doesn't it mean that your level is low, and that using testosterone only brings it back to a normal level (or maybe above shortly after injection)?
If it is the case, then why would you become Ubereem? No reason, unless you took an even bigger dose to reach uber domain.
So maybe it is just that you were able to keep your muscle or build a bit of it, whereas without TRT your muscle mass would have decreased.

I don't think that "juice does all the work", it's obviously not true, but if it didn't contribute to the extent it does we would not see the abuse we're seeing in bb today.

In theory TRT brings you back to normal levels.

And no, using just TRT you are not going to become a roided-out monster. And no, juice does not do all the work. To get progressively greater effect, you need to work smarter and harder, and eventually increase the dosage or cycle smarter as well. The point is different for everyone.

 

[King of Fists]

The testosterone-but-no-exercise group was much smaller than the placebo-with-exercise group, so of course they would gain more mass. However, the placebo-with-exercise group gained more strength than the testosterone-but-no-exercise group even though they gained less mass.

In essence, taking steroids alone causes you to gain more weight with less strength than exercise alone. Cool story bro, I think anyone with common sense knows that.

 

[King of Fists]

Seems like you're still not getting it...

What "work" is it that you think you need to put it?

You can literally sit in your chair all day every day, take Testerone ALONE and gain more than a natty whos busting his ass 3-4 times a week.

And if you go out and do 2-3 times of lifting per week while on nothing but T, you'd still gain crazily more than a natty lifting from when he was born til the day he dies

Get it through your head already. Getting big while juicing is the easiest fucking thing in the universe. It LITERALLY happens on its own

Gain more weight, not strength. Size doesn't equal strength. While the testosterone-only group gained more size than the exercise-only group, they gained less strength.

Yet here you are acting like increased size and decreased strength is some kind of advantage, lol.

 

[Saint Of The K]

As someone already said, no training = no CNS adaptation = no increase in strength. Hence why the lazy roiders have lower results as natty active guy.

I'd like to see a study where the goal is to increase strength only, not size, using AAS.

 

[Brit_Brawler]

The source is in the OP:

The New England Journal of Medicine:
(http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJM199607043350101)

The age of the men were between 19-40.
There were fourty three men randomly divided into the groups.

you still got to put the work in, that's pretty clear

you think overeem and brock got big just taking it and sitting on the fucking sofa?

no that's not what I'm saying but it's obvious how much it helps.
Overeem still puts the work in now but just look at him .

 

[Brit_Brawler]

The results do also show that those that took the placebo and exercised improved their Squat and Bench Press strength more than those that took test and didn't work out. Taking Test and not working out is pointless, better exercising drug free in that situation, but yeah you get massive improvements taking it and exercising, though even then it depends on the dose.

You have a point but for purely aesthetic reasons it does serve A purpose for some pathetic lazy bums that want it all but want to put nothing into it.

 

[edirp]

my mate takes test and is built like a thank. doesn't workout.

Very true.
Back in freshmen year in high school, I knew these scrawny Hispanic cholo type who were around 5'2 and probably around 100 lbs. Even though they were not athletes, by our senior year, they were more ripped out and muscular than most of the football players despite not working out often. We thought they would live in a gym but they insisted that they workout as little as a few reps every few days. We all started speculating that they were on something but no one knew about it. About three years ago, one died in a car wreck. Then a year and a half ago, one died of heart failure at the age of 30. Looking back, how can a healthy looking person with no prior heart condition died so young of a heart attack? It was very obvious why.

 

[maxi diablo]

Does fapping count as exercise?

A vigorous beat-off would suffice.

 

[dns2344]

My old college roommate did a cycle of test, didn't workout one time, and gained about 15lbs of mass. Fat mass

I did a cycle of test, worked out 5-6x per week and gained 22lbs of muscle mass.

Whatever that says about this study, I don't know bc I didn't read it.

 

[KillingJoke]

Love how some sherdoggers dismiss this study as if the New England journal of Medicine isn't one of the most prestigious medical journals out there.

 

[giusti825]

As a former AAS user for over a decade I will tell you this is not true! If you take steroids and do nothing you will get FAT and eventually sick. Exercise and diet are 75% if not more. All steroids do is seed up recovery mainly.

This is the bullshit that the whole industry tries to feed everyone else because they've actually convinced themselves that it comes from all the hard work. There are natty guys who exercise well for 10 years and wont have the results a guy can get in 18 months of the same work.

Its all diet, exercise and those protein powders right?

Dont get me wrong. I have no problem with AAS or PEDs. They should probably be studied more for recreational use as i think they could be helpful in both lifestyle and preventative medicine. I think they are actually a net positive when used responsibly. You can get the look and strength that you want without all the cardio work destroying your joints and with a way lower risk of injury. I just cant stand the lying athletes do to others and themselves. It serves society no good.

 

[giusti825]

Why are people still defending that you still need to work hard to gain muscles when your on anabolics? Just accept that the drugs are doing 90% of the work for you. There's peer reviewed studies to make all your anecdotal advice null.

Nothing hardworking or rewarding if you're lifting weights and take anabolics at the same time. Just doing out of vanity sake is pitiful as shit

The study clearly shows you gain WAY more doing both.

 

[Pterodactyl]

Your muscles are constantly being used. Sure, not that hard if you sit behind a desk like my sorry ass is doing right now, but proteins and amino acids are continually being scavenged. So repair is taking place as well. Along with the other factors I mentioned in my post previous to yours.

Can you get "huge" without training? Of course not. Just like there are natural limits to how big and/or strong one can get without drugs, there are limits to what can be done without training. Look at how many people make progress training like idiots. But eventually, to achieve a certain level of results as either an athlete or a bodybuilder, plenty of things need to come together.

Yes, there is the one in a million genetic freak, but outliers do not apply to most people.

Good point man.

 

[Cuauhtemoc]

That's with 600mg per week of testosterone. That is far higher than any trt. Almost 3x as much...That is a cycle. So of course you're going to gain more muscle.

Also remember, these men were "normal" which I assume meaning there weren't gym rats. So you take guys that have never lifted seriously before and suddenly give them 600mg per week. Yes, they will gain more...

That is nothing compared to Vitor's TRT

 

[Kneeuinthenutz]

This is total bullshit to an almost comical level.

 

[giusti825]

Yes your muscles grow to a certain point. But there comes a time where you need to train if you want to grow. That's why I said a natural can gain more muscle than if you are on steroids and not training. Fuck the studies I'm talking from experience of seeing people who took a lot of steroids thinking they would grow quick and be like the other guys. But no those other guys whilst they are on steroids, they do also work hard to! It goes hand in hand. Plenty of guys are on the juice and don't look it my friend.

You can't look at a study as an objective fact. We don't know how the natural guys were training, how much they were training, what their nutrition was like. Wisdom always beats clinical studies.

read the study....that stuff is all there....the guys were on the same diet and the same routine...