If Gane has really improved his TDD and "anti-wrestling"

[mkt]

Then he'd be a tough fight for prime Ngannou and pretty much any HW past or present.

I'm not saying he'd be a GOAT. But he'd be a challenge for anyone.

I'm not ready to say he's made great improvements based on one stuffed TD last night. But he's apparently been focusing on wrestling ever since his fight with Aspinall was announced. We'll see how much he's improved when he has a longer fight with Tom and takes on others (maybe Almeida?) with better wrestling.

I'm posting this because some are comparing Gane's 4 minute fight with Tom to Gane's 25 minute match with Ngannou and concluding Tom is a much worse wrestler than Ngannou. I'm not sure if they were fighting the same Gane. We'll find out sooon enough.

 

[nonoob]

Gane's double eye poke training paid off big time.

Look for it to happen again in the rematch.

 

[mkt]

Gane's double eye poke training paid off big time.

Look for it to happen again in the rematch.

Double eye poke...double-leg takedown defense. Maybe he got a 2-for-1 special with his trainers!

 

[orca]

he would be great
hes literaly the best striker in the HW division

you add up a really good tdd

but hes like 35-36? thats the issue

 

[don't ask]

Fedor's takedowns are an entirely different skillset. I think Fedor would have thrown him several times.

 

[AndrewGolota48]

Gane is an unbelievable freak talent, beyond what Tom is (though Tom is way more talented than most heavyweights). You have to remember this guy had his first Muay Thai fight at 26, a couple years later he gets into MMA and after only 3 fights joins the UFC, goes 7-0 then loses a close fight to Ngannou, arguably the best MMA heavyweight of all time.

Give his talent level, I would say he has underachieved. It's a lack of focus and arrogance that kept him from consistently developing his skills, because he was so talented and everything was coming too easy for him. If he trained like GSP I can't imagine how good he would've become.

The only comparable fighters with such an insanely fast rise would be Ngannou, JDS, and Lesnar (though in his case he had the lifelong wrestling background, whereas the others had no martial arts training until their 20s).

 

[HatKick]

I would think (and hope) Ciryl felt humiliated by the Jones fight to work really hard on his grappling. An athlete of his caliber can surely make a lot of progress in a couple of years if he really commits, even if it's a bit late.

 

[mkt]

Fedor's takedowns are an entirely different skillset. I think Fedor would have thrown him several times.

Maybe, maybe not. Fedor usually did those from the clinch which fighters could try to avoid. Bigfoot Silva was able to bully Fedor and took him down with a mediocre high school football tackle. Dan Henderson was 6 years older and 20 pounds lighter than Fedor and he got the best of him in the clinch.

 

[mkt]

he would be great
hes literaly the best striker in the HW division

you add up a really good tdd

but hes like 35-36? thats the issue

Yeah, Jacare and Werdum did the opposite. They were grapplers who improved their striking in their mid 30s and became better, more complete fighters late in their careers. But they only had a short window of being really well-rounded and then aged out.

 

[mkt]

I would think (and hope) Ciryl felt humiliated by the Jones fight to work really hard on his grappling. An athlete of his caliber can surely make a lot of progress in a couple of years if he really commits, even if it's a bit late.

And the Ngannou fight as well. It wasn't as embarrassing as Jones, but Francis had a clear path to win by wrestling even though they were both strikers and people were expecting a kickboxing war.

 

[Dr. Rose]

Double eye poke...double-leg takedown defense. Maybe he got a 2-for-1 special with his trainers!

He's been hanging out with JBJ

 

[Dr. Rose]

Yeah, Jacare and Werdum did the opposite. They were grapplers who improved their striking in their mid 30s and became better, more complete fighters late in their careers. But they only had a short window of being really well-rounded and then aged out.

Great point, my friend. People argue with me on here, but I do think it is easier for a wrestler to pick up strikes than a striker to pick up grappling (and especially wrestling). That is why you normally see them drill tdd, to help mitigate the lack of overall grappling.

 

[don't ask]

Maybe, maybe not. Fedor usually did those from the clinch which fighters could try to avoid. Bigfoot Silva was able to bully Fedor and took him down with a mediocre high school football tackle. Dan Henderson was 6 years older and 20 pounds lighter than Fedor and he got the best of him in the clinch.

Why would we be talking about a hypothetical, best Gane ever vs a diminished Fedor at the end of his career?

 

[mkt]

Why would we be talking about a hypothetical, best Gane ever vs a diminished Fedor at the end of his career?

Fedor was 34 (younger than Gane is now) and Hendo was 40. That silly propaganda doesn't work any more.

 

[don't ask]

Fedor was 34 (younger than Gane is now) and Hendo was 40. That silly propaganda doesn't work any more.

Oh fuck off, he was clearly on the downward end of his career. I never thought you were a moron before.

 

[chinarice]

Gane is an unbelievable freak talent, beyond what Tom is (though Tom is way more talented than most heavyweights). You have to remember this guy had his first Muay Thai fight at 26, a couple years later he gets into MMA and after only 3 fights joins the UFC, goes 7-0 then loses a close fight to Ngannou, arguably the best MMA heavyweight of all time.

Give his talent level, I would say he has underachieved. It's a lack of focus and arrogance that kept him from consistently developing his skills, because he was so talented and everything was coming too easy for him. If he trained like GSP I can't imagine how good he would've become.

The only comparable fighters with such an insanely fast rise would be Ngannou, JDS, and Lesnar (though in his case he had the lifelong wrestling background, whereas the others had no martial arts training until their 20s).

I mean, that volkov win is one of the biggest robberies I've ever seen.

 

[volcom5]

Oh fuck off, he was clearly on the downward end of his career. I never thought you were a moron before.

Thats a built in excuse, as he mentioned it doesn’t work anymore. We’re seeing fighters fight and be competitive into their late 30’s, oh you’re going to say he had a lot fights? Alexandre Pantoja 30 fights into his career and 33yrs old captures gold, and every single defense he has had, he’s improving and only get better, mine you this in a weight class where you’re “out of prime” by 30, Volkanovski 36yrs old 30 plus fighte in his career recapture gold, only fights he’s ever loss are all time greats and champions. Fedor goes to B leagues in the states and couldnt even put together a 3 fight win streak.

Fedor would have a difficult time with Gane.

 

[M4R5]

Thats a built in excuse, as he mentioned it doesn’t work anymore. We’re seeing fighters fight and be competitive into their late 30’s, oh you’re going to say he had a lot fights? Alexandre Pantoja 30 fights into his career and 33yrs old captures gold, and every single defense he has had, he’s improving and only get better, mine you this in a weight class where you’re “out of prime” by 30, Volkanovski 36yrs old 30 plus fighte in his career recapture gold, only fights he’s ever loss are all time greats and champions. Fedor goes to B leagues in the states and couldnt even put together a 3 fight win streak.

Fedor would have a difficult time with Gane.

But but but his sambo career

 

[nostradumbass]

Thats a built in excuse, as he mentioned it doesn’t work anymore. We’re seeing fighters fight and be competitive into their late 30’s, oh you’re going to say he had a lot fights? Alexandre Pantoja 30 fights into his career and 33yrs old captures gold, and every single defense he has had, he’s improving and only get better, mine you this in a weight class where you’re “out of prime” by 30, Volkanovski 36yrs old 30 plus fighte in his career recapture gold, only fights he’s ever loss are all time greats and champions. Fedor goes to B leagues in the states and couldnt even put together a 3 fight win streak.

Fedor would have a difficult time with Gane.

Fedor didn't lose until his 33rd fight. Volk doesn't even have 33 fights now, and he recently had back to back KO losses and then got dropped by a guy he would have run through and finished a couple years ago.

He had to change his entire style because his knees and back were getting stiff and went from most of his wins by submission to just brawling and not having a single submission in his last 15 years of fighting. He also lost in Sambo the same year as his last sub in MMA.


This is what his own coach, Vladimir Voronov, said like a week before he fought Henderson.

Maybe he’s a little tired of the sport. He trains all the time, since his childhood, and managed to maintain all his human qualities.

 

[TeenageMutantLesnarTurtle]

Its impossible to gauge from this fight really. People assumed that Tom would have a big advantage in the grappling department, but he only attempted one takedown and didnt commit that much to it (to Ganes credit, he did defend it). If Tom is smart he will go grappling heavy right off the bat in the rematch and we will learn a lot either way.