Wrestling Catch Wrestling United

[brollikk]

I disagree with this wholeheartedly. The leg cissor from NS while attacking the Kimura is one of my instructors go to that he teaches a lot. He is a 5 strip BB from Carlson Gracie and is about 160lbs and he crushes you with it.

Maybe your partner just isn't doing it right........

I'm around 155, partner was around 160. I am a brown belt (3 yrs at brown btw, and 5 years of wrestling), and my partner is a black belt. Pretty sure he was doing it right. I am saying that I feel MUCH more threatened in that position when they trap my arm with one leg, and post their foot behind my head with the other.

The head scissors is just annoying, but I can easily explode out of there, while protecting my arm.

 

[German Supplex]

The head scissors is just annoying, but I can easily explode out of there, while protecting my arm.

If you can "easily explode out of there", then the person doing it on you has no idea how to do it properly, black belt or not.

A properly done head scissors from NS while attacking an armbar or kimura simultaneously will neck crank you into oblivion with no room to "easily explode out of there" and will most likely make you scream out rather than tap.

 

[German Supplex]

I've purposely put myself under north south where a guy MY weight tried leg scissors, and whatnot. It really doesn't hurt too bad, and in fact is quite easy to escape because having both knees on the ground takes away from his base. Barnett was hurting Lister because he had like 45++ lbs on him, not because that was an efficient move.

You're telling people who have experience in these moves that they're wrong? lol.

Anyway, guys that have been 135 lbs. (I'm a little over 200 myself) that have caught me with it properly have hurt me (not injured) and tapped me out with it.

Putting your shin across other peoples legs is also common in many other grappling arts including BJJ. We just don't circle jerk about how "painful" and "violent" it is. So fucking cringe-worthy to be honest.

You guys really don't do that and when you do, you don't know exactly where and in what set up or situation to utitlize simple details and it doesn't have the same effect. Crushing someone's heels from turtle can almost tap a person out in its own right. Guys in BJJ don't care for that, they'd rather just throw the hooks in and move directly to the back. Personally I like to attack turtle with leglocks myself, as they are unexpected for the general grappler who expects to have his back taken.

Take a look at this channel to watch a gym full of catch wrestlers compete in no gi tournaments. A lot of them have 5+ years of full time training. I don't know about you guys, but it doesn't look very impressive to me.

I can give you that. Given that CACC is scarce and usually not taught by someone of top quality, you can't expect those kind of practitioners to be amazing. That's like someone taking video of James Parede's school and saying "See, these guys are horrible. BJJ guys don't look very impressive to me." One school doesn't speak for the entire art, although in BJJ what is mostly bashed and disagreed with is what is seen in top competition amongst top, legit competitors.

 

[Title Fight Productions]

I'm around 155, partner was around 160. I am a brown belt (3 yrs at brown btw, and 5 years of wrestling), and my partner is a black belt. Pretty sure he was doing it right. I am saying that I feel MUCH more threatened in that position when they trap my arm with one leg, and post their foot behind my head with the other.

The head scissors is just annoying, but I can easily explode out of there, while protecting my arm.

Well to be fair that is a bit different than what you originally posted. But I do understand the premise of your post. These moves you are hearing about to you are just painful annoyances instead of quality control moves.

What I'm saying is if a 5 strip BB is teaching the move then IMO it's not garbage, ya dig?

 

[brollikk]

Well to be fair that is a bit different than what you originally posted. But I do understand the premise of your post. These moves you are hearing about to you are just painful annoyances instead of quality control moves.

What I'm saying is if a 5 strip BB is teaching the move then IMO it's not garbage, ya dig?

yeah, i gotcha.

There needs to be an IBJJF for CACC and I think we would see higher level competitors

 

[KJGould]

yeah, i gotcha.

There needs to be an IBJJF for CACC and I think we would see higher level competitors

It's possible, but with scholastic wrestling (American Folkstyle) a lot would argue it'd either be too difficult or redundant. Plus it's not like the IBJJF isn't without its issues, and seems to be repeating the mistakes of the IJF, and FILA and the NCAA or AAU before it which caused the stripping down and neutering of catch to begin with.

 

[Andres]

Anybody knows what happenned to the Celtic Dojo in Manhattan ? The website is down.

 

[Crossface9]

Congratulations to Brock Lesnar! The man who got me into WWE and UFC, Barnett now Lesnar!

 

[DanTheWolfman.com]

Not here for drama but thought some might like the vids, I did a lot on my back as bigger, and also was possibly fighting real HWs this Sat


while I am the biggest guy in the room save for the IGF fighter in the beginning that is fighting for Inoki in HW tourament this Sat, please realize I try to not use strength and go loose. Many in vid are Pro Pancrase and Deep fighters. This is one of three gyms I train at Brave Gym. These are subs and transitions I thought were interesting. I;ve gotten a lot of flack on here as everyone is a tough guy and critic on the nets, but my movements and techniques I go for are the same whether they are under 2 yrs grappling or a Pro fighter. I do a lot of subs others do not. You can see my more serious riding style a bit against one of the wrestlers.

Here is another gym I go to once a week for kinda my more pure grappling, Brightness Monma gym. , Monma is a hell of a awesome grappler with a very good MMA record and subs 18-11-4 w 11 subs and faced many big names. His student I call tough guy, trained with Monma I think 4 yrs maybe more but used to train at a Pro-wrestling school owned by a real Olympic wrestling champion, so he really was basically learning Catch type style from the beginning.


I have also been compiling the more exciting action of mine at Wajitsu going against top guys Okami, Akiyama, Kiichi Kunimoto, and Deep HW Champ Ken Hasigawa among others though not ready to post that yet or not sure if I should before these guy fight next UFC and WSOF etc. Not getting subs but these are the best, and the best hard big glove going at in sparring in Japan.

 

[DanTheWolfman.com]

CACC is starting to pickup a bit of a following in China. Next month they're having a nogi sub only competition in Shanghai that they're labeling as a Catch Wrestling competition.

When is this? I have a 5 plus hr layover there coming up, doubt the govt just let me waltz in when I have an ongoing flight but thought I would ask

any website or info?

 

[Big Nasty Edison]

If you can "easily explode out of there", then the person doing it on you has no idea how to do it properly, black belt or not.

A properly done head scissors from NS while attacking an armbar or kimura simultaneously will neck crank you into oblivion with no room to "easily explode out of there" and will most likely make you scream out rather than tap.

I don't know if I am thinking of the same thing but I like to take north/south, and give them some space to think they can escape. When they start to roll to their shoulder, I'll pop up and turn their face towards the ground and squeeze the head between my legs and cross my feet. Once I have the kimura grip you can basically spin right or left on your knees for the neck crank. Is that what you mean?

 

[German Supplex]

I don't know if I am thinking of the same thing but I like to take north/south, and give them some space to think they can escape. When they start to roll to their shoulder, I'll pop up and turn their face towards the ground and squeeze the head between my legs and cross my feet. Once I have the kimura grip you can basically spin right or left on your knees for the neck crank. Is that what you mean?

Close but not exactly. If I have side control on someone, I will step over with the leg thats on the same side as their head and hook it with that leg and then figure four my two legs together (although the crank is usually very tight before even figure fouring the legs, so you might even get a tap right away just by cranking the neck by hooking it deep with one leg) with the persons head inside. Then I will attack with an armbar or kimura and simultaneously crank both submissions (done in a safe manner, of course).

 

[Big Nasty Edison]

Close but not exactly. If I have side control on someone, I will step over with the leg thats on the same side as their head and hook it with that leg and then figure four my two legs together (although the crank is usually very tight before even figure fouring the legs, so you might even get a tap right away just by cranking the neck by hooking it deep with one leg) with the persons head inside. Then I will attack with an armbar or kimura and simultaneously crank both submissions (done in a safe manner, of course).

Ok cool. I'd like to give that a try when I return to training (badly torn meniscus) and have considered doing the stop over but a lot of guys I train with a little older with bad necks so we avoid neck cranks.

 

[Big Nasty Edison]

For anyone interested, here is a PDF of Farmer Burns' book Lessons in Wrestling & Physical Culture.

http://worldtracker.org/media/libra... Culture (Catch Wrestling) - Farmer Burns.pdf

 

[Title Fight Productions]

Here are 10 pretty good gifs of the Barnett/Lister match

http://www.stickgrappler.net/2014/08/catchwrestler-josh-barnett-submits-bjj.html?m=1

 

[OKMS]

Submission-grappling is to Catch what kick-boxing is to Savate. Take out the pin and shoes, add chokes and knees and eventually there is no more Catch or Savate just submission-grappling and kick-boxing.

 

[Title Fight Productions]

Heavily influenced in CACC, Shayna Baszler has a tough fight in the UFC this weekend!

Here is a very interesting quote from her in regards to how BJJ grappling in MMA influences loosing Catch moves. This is something I have never heard anyone mention before and is a bit of an eye opener for me.

The martial artist in me is bummed because there are so many moves that are based on people not wanting to get pinned that are lost because of the guard in MMA.

She wrestled in high school and I believe is a BJJ Brown belt under Amilicar Cipili (a Rigan Machado black-belt) out of Las Vegas, Nevada and Aaron Hullinger (a Rigan Machado brown-belt) in Sioux Falls, South Dakota.

 

[_Glorfindel_]

Heavily influenced in CACC, Shayna Baszler has a tough fight in the UFC this weekend!

Here is a very interesting quote from her in regards to how BJJ grappling in MMA influences loosing Catch moves. This is something I have never heard anyone mention before and is a bit of an eye opener for me.



She wrestled in high school and I believe is a BJJ Brown belt under Amilicar Cipili (a Rigan Machado black-belt) out of Las Vegas, Nevada and Aaron Hullinger (a Rigan Machado brown-belt) in Sioux Falls, South Dakota.

She's wright. In cacc, we dont like to be on our back, so we will create scramble or reversal and there is a lot of fun techniques for that.

 

[ChainFlow]

Wouldn't those catch moves be applicable when you're in MMA trying to keep down a guy who would rather try to stand up than fight from guard? That's increasingly popular.

 

[Title Fight Productions]

Wouldn't those catch moves be applicable when you're in MMA trying to keep down a guy who would rather try to stand up than fight from guard? That's increasingly popular.

What I think she is talking about are holds and chains out of scrambling off your back to come on top on the ground. Holds and flows that open up while you try and turn someone. A lot of those get lost if your opponent is just fine being on his back playing some type of guard.

There are of course plenty of moves vs an opponent scrambling back to there feet, but this is talking more about grappling on the ground, IMO.