“Dragging the fight into the later rounds” = pretending to fight for the first half?

[Sean_wongster_wongmastter]

Fights being exciting are a by product of fighting.


Boring is a matter of perspective. I spoke to a poster yesterday who said Yan vs Merab was one of the worst fights ever. Another poster said they found it to be an action packed affair.


If you think a fight was boring that's only your opinion. I have a friend who only watches NHL hockey, which for my money is the most boring sport ever but he likes it.

We don't watch for entertainment, we watch because we want to see who is the best. When I watch ANY competition at the highest level, even if it's darts or pool or even a videogame, I SHOULD be impressed or entertained. So that's what happens with MMA when two great fighters fight eachother and do whatever it takes to win, that doesn't mean doing something really cool that I think is entertaining, Only what is necessary to win.

It's for entertainment, we all watch for entertainment, watching to see who is the best means you are entertained by seeing who is the best.

No one is watching to be bored. All you are saying is people have different definitions of being entertained.

They fight to entertain fans, end of the story.

Some fans are entertained by seeing a good strategy, some fans are entertained by blood and guts, at the end of the day, they fight to entertain us.

 

[nonoob]

Fights being exciting are a by product of fighting.

Right, when both engage by going for a KO or sub at the same time, that makes the action packed fight we all want to see.

it’s just weird to me seeing someone get praised for stinking out the fight.

Cardio freaks dodging a power puncher early in round one is understood. When it goes on and on with the same guy or gal not engaging, it sucks that a point can't be taken for stalling.

 

[VAfan]

nah. there are cardio machines like merab who can go full out for days. doesn't necessarily mean you're conserving energy early (although it can be the case).

 

[Local Plata]

You could still be fighting, it's just exercising more patience and not taking many risks while your opponent is fresh that it refers to. It's just highlighting a dynamic gameplan rather than a static one.

 

[HuskySamoan]

Strikes are supposed to be purposeful, same for grappling and whatnot too of course. Things like leg kicks or body work tend to pay dividends as the fight goes on much more so than at first, and like a jab, you're supposed to build off of these things. Also for example If you're a compact fighter vs a rangy counter striker you have to pressure, slip off the center line, close distance and be willing to MAINTAIN close range effectively as well. Sometimes the burden of figuring out timing, range, tendencies is much more on one fighter than another. Also knowing roles, explosive punchers even if in great shape won't have the same power and or output as the fight goes on, being more defensive, tying them up, staying out of range and playing matador, clinching etc early is obviously, intelligent. It's a chess match.

 

[TempleoftheDog]

Sometimes weathering the storm is the BEST gameplan available. Many fighters gas badly by the 3rd round. Borz for example.

Get through the first 8-10 minutes. Then pull out all the stops for the rest of the fight. Whether it’s a 3, or 5 round fight. Conor has fuck all after 2 rounds. We all know it. Where as some fighters are cardio machines. Taking your opponent into deep water is one of the best gameplans there is in a lot of sports.

 

[BEATDOWNS]

Go ahead TS get into a brawl with someone like Hector Lombard in the first round and see how that goes. Nah you might actually want to play it safe until the second round.

 

[MRT]

If you can survive the early part of a fight and have your opponent get tired faster than you...that's a rather smart and useful strategy. Why shouldn't it be praised? Cardio is as relevant an ability to have for MMA competition as striking and grappling skills, and should be trained accordingly.

 

[RockyLockridge]

It's for entertainment, we all watch for entertainment, watching to see who is the best means you are entertained by seeing who is the best.

Right thank you for proving my point, Not every fight needs to be conventionally exciting in order to find entertainment.

A really bad movie can be entertaining if your friends are watching it making jokes about it the whole time. Still a boring movie, yet you are Still entertained.

they fight to entertain us.

I disagree I think we watch for entertainment. They fight for their livelihood and to win.

 

[Hunt.]

I keep hearing this terminology. It’s something we’ve grown used to as fans, but in actuality, it’s not something that should be praised, and the fact that it is is down to damage control by the commentators. They’re constantly trying to tell the fans what they’re seeing is more entertaining than it actually is - wmma “barn burners” for example, where people are shadow boxing 5ft away from their opponent.


I’m not saying that every fight should look like Lamas vs Holloway in the pocket, but it’s just weird to me seeing someone get praised for stinking out the fight. If you have one guy surging forward and the other guy waiting, only one guy is trying to be entertaining.

Hermansson v Pyfer a classic example. Sure Hermansson fought “smart”… but what does that actually mean? It means he threw one strike at a time, no combinations, no possibility of a finish. I mean if you hate Pyfer on a personal level it was probably entertaining to see him get gradually snuffed out like that, but for most other impartial fans it kinda sucked seeing an exciting up and comer get handled, and it wasn’t due to any lack of skill or technique, it was simply due to the philosophy and approach to fighting that both men took - one was trying to be entertaining and looking for a finish, the other was trying to score points, to the detriment of the fans.

You brought a terrible example to your arrgument with the Hermansson fight imo. But i do agree with the fact that if we always had fighters trying to fight to get a finish and they didnt care about the winning part we would always have more fun fights. But since the sport has evolved so much fighters need to win for themselfs for their team and families. Hermansson used his abilities - his cardio which in this fight was his biggest weapon. Pyfer was dangerous in the first 2 rounds but started to fade and veterans expected this. About women shadow boxing for 3 rounds ya i agree it gets boring.

 

[DapperDave]

According to Pyfer's face, Hermansson's method of "scoring points" seems to be "punching you hard in the face."

According to Pyfer's leg and post-fight interview, Hermansson's method of "scoring points" seems to be "destroying your leg."

Good fight. Capable fighters. No one quit. No lay and pray. No running. Unanimous decision.

Probably next Thursday, i will feel bitchy. If I can't find anything to bitch about, I will come back here and bitch about this fight.

 

[Tnellie30]

TLDR: I don't blame any fighter for following the path that will lead them to the greatest chance at victory.

You occassionally get the Rock'em Sock'em Robot fights, but this is just like any other sport or game. There is a set of rules, and each competitor utilizes a game plan or strategy that will allow them the greatest chance for victory. Some fighters employ a striking heavy, very offensive strategy. Some are patient counter strikers. Some are grapplers and look for opportunities to take the fight to the ground. Some rely on their cardio. Some look to win decisions and score points. I don't see a problem with any strategy that gets you the win. If you want to improve your pay, however, you best make it interesting for the fans and your promotion. I don't see the issue as you do, necessarily. I will say, however, these aren't bar fights or matches taking place in the Roman Colosseum, with fights to the death (barring Ken Shamrock and Tito Ortiz, of course).

 

[Trabaho]

Go to wshh or snuf sites for your violence wants. This is a sport.
Bu hu he didn't get knocked out bu hu they were using skill and fighting smart.
Bu hu I wanted to see someone hurt bad

 

[Hazuki Ryo]

Hermansson Pyfer was not really a good example of "scoring points" vs "entertaining the crowd". Both have different fighting styles. Not everyone can throw bombs for 5 rounds. Volume fighters have actually an advantage in championship rounds i would say. So it's not a matter of entertaining the crowd, maybe it has to do with pacing yourself for a grueling, hard, intense 25 min potential war.

I am entertained with either a just bleed 3 rounds fest, or a tactital, technical but active 5 rounds

 

[WildShrimper]

So I guess using feints to mentally and physically wear down your opponent is also pretend fighting?

 

[whocares]

I get what you're saying, but the Hermansson fight is a terrible example. He weathered a barrage for a couple rounds then systematically picked Pyfer apart once Pyfer slowed down. There was no stalling or bullshit going on in that fight. Not like many 5 round fights where both fighters take at least one round off, fight overly cautious and then everyone is miffed over the scoring even though everyone knows there wasn't much to judge by. Thats the kind of shit I hate seeing, especially in title fights. And Joe and DC or whoever are going to puff up any fight, thats their job.

 

[PEDRO IVO RUSSO MIRANDA]

WWE figthers figths for entertainment, UFC fighter figths to be the best.
Maybe you're looking for the wrong promotion

 

[Masturbin]

Hermansson v Pyfer a classic example. Sure Hermansson fought “smart”… but what does that actually mean? It means he threw one strike at a time, no combinations, no possibility of a finish. I mean if you hate Pyfer on a personal level it was probably entertaining to see him get gradually snuffed out like that, but for most other impartial fans it kinda sucked seeing an exciting up and comer get handled, and it wasn’t due to any lack of skill or technique, it was simply due to the philosophy and approach to fighting that both men took - one was trying to be entertaining and looking for a finish, the other was trying to score points, to the detriment of the fans.

If you're trully skilled you can easily beat someone unwilling to engage bby just outstriking him, having more volumme and moving forward.

 

[SkinnyClaw]

Some fighters are too powerful to handle in the early stages of a fight, so you need to drag the fight out until they lose their explosiveness and strength. People are built different. Trying to fight an explosive guy when he's fresh and twice as strong as you is stupid, the smart thing to do is bide your time, pick at him, and as he slows down you pick up the pace, its literally how many animals (including humans) take down larger, more powerful prey.

I'm pretty sure 99% of fighters don't give a shit about being entertaining, the entertaining fighters are that way, because that's just how they fight, not because they're trying to put on a nice show for the fans, first and foremost everyone wants to win. Even those guys who talk about putting on a show for the fans are just fighting to win, and if they're losing they will change it up however they have to, to get a win.

 

[r-harper-1]

Hermansson is a boring point fighter