Would Cain crumble if Jon didnt submit to his Alpha?

Jesse aM said:
Bullshit! Fedor > Liddell
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That's because Fedor was undefeated and was seen as more unbeatable, not because of their weight class. If you switched their records, Liddell would have been more revered.
 
Cain has a much better gas tank than DC. Cain would not slow down in the 4th and 5th round. The fight would be very competitive from start to finish. However, because of his size, Cain would take a lot of punishment closing the distance on Jones. He would lose to Jones by decision in the same fashion as DC.
 
I can't see Jones finishing Cain, nor beating him in a war of attrition over 25 minutes. Cormier, well excellent, is not really an attrition fighter. Cormier is a dominant grappler who was unable to implement his game. Cain makes the fight a war in every position, for every second of the fight.

I see the fight looking exactly like Jones/Cormier for the first two rounds. Jones comes out strong and fast, looks pretty good and keeps range but expends a disproportionate amount of energy. Second round Cain begins to get to him, tagging him with punches and laying on the pressure. After that we see the difference between Cain and Cormier, Cain continues with the momentum for 15 more minutes rather than gassing out and feeling content to be held against the cage. Cain will also not get discouraged by bursts of energy from Jones like Cormier was. Cain had JDS trying his hardest to win with brutal flurries during the 3rd fight but was not dissuaded whatsoever. I predict Cain finishes late in the fight or wins a brutal decision.
 
Ace1988 said:
That's because Fedor was undefeated and was seen as more unbeatable, not because of their weight class. If you switched their records, Liddell would have been more revered.
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Are we talking about a fantasy world now?
 
It is topics like this that remind me of why politicians have no respect for the intellects of their constituencies.
 
Ace1988 said:
That's because Fedor was undefeated and was seen as more unbeatable, not because of their weight class. If you switched their records, Liddell would have been more revered.
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HW has always been the toughest weight class, because it's so easy to lose. The other ones may argue about p4p like its Batman vs. Spiderman, but the reality is....it's the toughest. If it was not, people wouldn't cut weight to avoid being in it. It's 205 lbs-265 lbs, there are WW in that range.

That's what makes Fedors accomplishment insane going 30-0 in a division where it's hard to go 4-0.

That said, I want to see the fight. Jones said that he would fight Cain in a heartbeat. But he has cut weight over 10 different times, is larger & Cain has never tried. It's been a lot more than a heartbeat.

Either Jones really enjoys dehydrating himself to fight smaller people(despite being larger than Fedor, Nog or Crocop)...or he is full of bovine deal matter. Actions speak louder than words.

It doesn't matter whether the pressure gets to Jon, Cain will keep coming until the bell rings or the referee stops the fight.
 
thecrosby627 said:
Still sounds pretty gay.

Theres no shame in liking man dick, be yourself, and dont worry about what other people will think. Good luck, homes.
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Ok, you got me pegged. I used Submit and Alpha in the same sentence.. I must be a raging homo.
 
I would like to see Jones beat JDS before we can discuss him vs Cain.
 
Miiiiiiighty said:
Soz

I don't think Jones holds against a healthy Cain.
Cain is too relentless and Jones himself is used to be the Alpha dog and bigger man in fights..
I think Jon would hold his own for a while then mentally crumble. I don't think he would have the mental fortitude to make Cain break mentally.

Also I think if he did, Cain would only continue relentlessly until Jones finally breaks down..
Look at what happened to JDS, arguably one of the fighters with the best chins and heart at HW. Cain grinded him, punished him and eventually broke him

DC is a completely different fighter, even him commented on how hard sparring with Cain is, and how relentless he is..
Cormier in my opinion made a mistake by assuming he would outwrestle Jones easily but he didn't take two things into consideration :

- This is MMA wrestling not pure wrestling, there are strikes and a cage
- Jones isn't 5'10, I know Gatsalov is awesome but sparring with him made DC falsely confident, but didn't prepare him for Jon's leaning and specific wrestling allowed by his size..

Jon broke him mentally when he took him down at will against the cage, especially since it was the " I bet I could take you down " comment that lit the fire up in the 1st place..
I don't see Cain breaking down mentally if he can't smash Jones quickly, he will hust continue to attack until Jon breaks mentally, he has the cardio for it.
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Brilliant post.. Nothing would make me happier if Cain broke Jones down and took his will and avenged his friend, team mate and coach DC!

I agree DC and Cain are much different fighters.. Cain is much more relentless, better cardio, mentally tougher, more fluid in his transitions.

I was rooting hard for DC when he fought Jones it really sucked when he out wrestled and out grappled DC. That "I bet I could take you down" comment immediately came to my mind. lol Poor DC..
 
I think Jones would be able to stuff a few tds, the only thing is Cain doesnt stop just because he didnt get one, Look at the last couple of JDS fights, Jds td defense improved alot, and he stuffed Cain a few times, but he just doesnt stop, he keeps pushing. I thought DC was going to stay in his face more but his footwork looked slow and hesitant almost from the beginning minus round two and three.

Jones fought great.
I dont like the guy, but id never suggest the man is a pushover.
he is beast.

Cain all the way though.
 
ButterStoch said:
HW has always been the toughest weight class, because it's so easy to lose. The other ones may argue about p4p like its Batman vs. Spiderman, but the reality is....it's the toughest. If it was not, people wouldn't cut weight to avoid being in it. It's 205 lbs-265 lbs, there are WW in that range.

That's what makes Fedors accomplishment insane going 30-0 in a division where it's hard to go 4-0.

That said, I want to see the fight. Jones said that he would fight Cain in a heartbeat. But he has cut weight over 10 different times, is larger & Cain has never tried. It's been a lot more than a heartbeat.

Either Jones really enjoys dehydrating himself to fight smaller people(despite being larger than Fedor, Nog or Crocop)...or he is full of bovine deal matter. Actions speak louder than words.

It doesn't matter whether the pressure gets to Jon, Cain will keep coming until the bell rings or the referee stops the fight.
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Spot on post.. Jon has a huge frame and if he didn't cut weight he could easily make 240 and fight for the most prestigious belt in combat sports (The UFC HW strap). He cuts weight for a reason. I've been saying this for about 2 years.. Jones wants no part of Cain! Jones wouldn't have a huge size advantage and he would be fighting a guy who would come at him non-stop with no hesitation or fear. Jones wouldn't be able to handle the pressure.. But what do we know, Maybe Jon will prove us wrong? Time will tell.

PS: I also feel a fight with Jones and DC at HW would be a different fight.
 
Shaddows said:
At this point, I don't know.
I mean, I thought Cain could do what he did to Junior to anyone.
That included Jon. And I was 10000% sure.

But the way Jon dominated and pushed DC against the cage? That sure opened my eyes.

Cain might be able to dominate. But now I am convinced this would not be as easy as people thought!
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Jones did not dominate DC.
 
Shaddows said:
Well, it is obviously different (to think he'd dominate LHW's than to think he'd dominate the HW champ).

If anything, I didn't think he would have much problems at LHW. His size advantage and how well he utilizes it besides his unpredictability was the recipe for him winning.

But I judged HW's to have more power. And until DC crossed over, there was no way to gauge how he would do).
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I don't understand why people wouldn't think he wouldn't have done well at HW before. I didn't say he would dominate the HW champ
 
It is hard to speculate I'm guessing whoever imposes their will wins. I don't think it is a case of someone faltering or anything.
 
Shaddows said:
At this point, I don't know.
I mean, I thought Cain could do what he did to Junior to anyone.
That included Jon. And I was 10000% sure.

But the way Jon dominated and pushed DC against the cage? That sure opened my eyes.

Cain might be able to dominate. But now I am convinced this would not be as easy as people thought!
Click to expand...

It surprised the hell out of me when Jon controlled DC and had him pinned against the cage. If he went up to HW and did that to Cain I would be 5x more shocked!
 
HeexX said:
Jones did not dominate DC.
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Really?


Lets say we forget the judges score cards. How did 17 indepenant MMA media members mostly watching the fight at different locations score this bout?


MEDIA SCORES
Jason Floyd
TheMMAReport.com 49-46 Jones
MMAMania.com 49-46 Jones
Chris Nelson
Sherdog.com 49-46 Jones
Jordan Breen
Sherdog.com 49-46 Jones
MMAJunkie.com 49-46 Jones
Craig Amos
BleacherReport.com 49-46 Jones
Sean Smith
BleacherReport.com 49-46 Jones
Rob Tatum
CombatPress.com 49-46 Jones
Tim Burke
BloodyElbow.com 49-46 Jones
CagePages.com 49-46 Jones
SevereMMA.com 49-46 Jones
T.P. Grant
BloodyElbow.com 49-47 Jones
Dallas Winston
BloodyElbow.com 49-47 Jones
Nathan McCarter
BleacherReport.com 48-47 Jones
TJ DeSantis
Sherdog.com 48-47 Jones
Chuck Mindenhall
MMAFighting.com 48-47 Jones
MMABrasil.com.br 48-47 Jones
Wrestling Observer
 
deviake said:
No - Cain doesn't give in. He does not yield. And he will not stop, ever, until you are dead. Cain would unleash the savagery. He's a different animal from Cormier.
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Cains whole style is to dominate and be in control. I honestly think he enjoys beating the fuck out of his opponents rather than going for the finish. Didn't he tell Lorenzo something like "I wanted to make JDS pay, I didn't want the finish" (After Cain-JDS 2)
Cain has some venom in him. I think it will be in Jons best interest to keep cutting weight..
 
bubbleboyjones said:
Really?


Lets say we forget the judges score cards. How did 17 indepenant MMA media members mostly watching the fight at different locations score this bout?


MEDIA SCORES
Jason Floyd
TheMMAReport.com 49-46 Jones
MMAMania.com 49-46 Jones
Chris Nelson
Sherdog.com 49-46 Jones
Jordan Breen
Sherdog.com 49-46 Jones
MMAJunkie.com 49-46 Jones
Craig Amos
BleacherReport.com 49-46 Jones
Sean Smith
BleacherReport.com 49-46 Jones
Rob Tatum
CombatPress.com 49-46 Jones
Tim Burke
BloodyElbow.com 49-46 Jones
CagePages.com 49-46 Jones
SevereMMA.com 49-46 Jones
T.P. Grant
BloodyElbow.com 49-47 Jones
Dallas Winston
BloodyElbow.com 49-47 Jones
Nathan McCarter
BleacherReport.com 48-47 Jones
TJ DeSantis
Sherdog.com 48-47 Jones
Chuck Mindenhall
MMAFighting.com 48-47 Jones
MMABrasil.com.br 48-47 Jones
Wrestling Observer
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If you actually think that proves Jones dominated (key word) DC, then I don't know what to tell you.
 
That Idiot Tibor said:
Jones has been the favorite in every fight since he was recognized as a top talent outside of Shogun and Cormier. so no.

Even then he was still the favorite against Cormer outside of Sherdog.
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He was a -200 favorite over Shogun, bud.
 
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