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Pavlik water-cooler talk

Discussion in 'Boxing Discussion' started by MC Paul Barman, Jun 11, 2008.

  1. Seano Hands of bone

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  2. a jessup Blue Belt

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    I think some people were confused because of this:

    Can you see how these specific words might be misconstrued? Regardless of what you meant, the tone of this passage suggests that Pavlik's a hype job who is propped up by racist fans. Thanks for clarifying your opinion, though -- I now understand what you're saying.

    So your real problem lies with nitwit journalists who inject race where it doesn't belong.
     
  3. Seano Hands of bone

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    So are you telling me that you think its a rarity in boxing that when a good fighter loses, many of his fans go as well? You've never seen that happen? Tyson? One loss and he was boxings biggest joke. Sam Peter got dropped by Jameel McCline and now he has a soft chin and is overrated.

    part 2- I'm really not sure why this is so controversial. I have repeatedly heard Pavliks race brought up. I've linked several stories. I said nothing especially controversial. I just believe that will be one of the knocks on Pavlik, tat he was overhyped for what color, not what he is.

    I think Pavlik will eventually be exposed. Are you saying no one will ever beat him in a devastating manner?

    Are you saying that with the hype about his color, no one is going to say that perhaps we got overexcited about it?

    I guess I'm not as big a fan as some of you guys. Sorry.
     
  4. Seano Hands of bone

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    I said "the HYPE I HEAR." Not "the hype that every person reading this hears."
    who are you to tell me what I hear and what I don't in broadcasts? If you didn't hear it, fine. Its not my fault you weren't paying attention.
     
  5. prontostar Gymmy TUNDAH!

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    If an undefeated pink guy lit miranda up like Pavlik did he could've gotten a title shot. It's hard not to like the guy especially now that we know he's no fluke.
     
  6. Seano Hands of bone

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    Its funny, this thread does sound like water cooler talk.
     
  7. a jessup Blue Belt

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    And if you had left it at this, nobody would have complained. However, you went on to assert that his former fans would subsequently realise that they had rooted for his race, and not his skills. Not a very flattering opinion of his fans, and predictably, some of them objected.

    But that's not quite all, is it? You added that Kelly would be brutally knocked out SOON. This wasn't a casual opinion, you repeated it several times, and even claimed that a short reign was endemic to his style of fighting. That's not an irrational position, but it's also subject to criticism.

    Yet this "hype", according to you, is an artifact of unprofessional journalism. It seems that you should focus on them rather than Pavlik's fanbase.

    And no, I think you're wrong; I suspect that Kelly will retain most of his fans just like Hatton has. Why? Because the qualities that draw them -- Pavlik's power, excitement, humility, etc -- won't be erased by a loss, no matter how brutal.

    Oh, I've heard plenty of snarky comments, but I attribute them to embarrassment. After all, Pavlik spoils a lot of whiteboy jokes that are coin of the realm among sports writers.
     
  8. prontostar Gymmy TUNDAH!

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    right power, right skills, right chin...and so forth and so on. Pavlik has made the jump to legit champ, he's no John Duddy.
     
  9. Seano Hands of bone

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    1. Meh. I think its true. I do think people are going to question if their hype was warranted, or was it something else.

    2. I do think Pavliks style sets him up for an unexpected KO loss.

    3. Fans get their info from the press. Press directly influences the publics perception. Most people don't actuall know Kelly Pavlik.

    4. Well I disagree. The hardcore fans are always there. I still root for Holyfield and still wonder if Gatti really made weight for his fight with Gamache. But right there are two fighters that absolutely prove this particular point. When youre on top, everyone loves you. Lose one and the fair weather fans are done with you.

    5. I wouldn't know that. YOu may be right. If you and I hear it. Many others hear it as well.
     
  10. Cracky Fanny Pack

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    I dunno.. it's not like he's some ?? prospect. He's fire tested by one of the hardest punchers in the world..Miranda. I dont think he'll be ko'd.. He may lose.. but I think it will be by decision if he does..though his "keep on trucking" style will make that feet a walk through hell for anyone.
    I said before that he reminds me of JC Chavez. He always has pressure on his opponent and trusts in his style to eventually work. That style takes a lot of faith in yourself, but it's really effective.
     
  11. prontostar Gymmy TUNDAH!

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    i don't see that KO loss coming in the near future. I think his arms are too long and his chin is too good.
     
  12. Seano Hands of bone

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    I guess we've all forgotten how badly Pavlik was hurt in that fight with Taylor?
     
  13. Cracky Fanny Pack

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    No..didnt forget. Taylor can punch. That shot would have rocked anyone. Not many could have gotten up and kept on trucking after taking it though.
     
  14. Seano Hands of bone

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    But Taylor had failed to hurt any of his previous 5 or 6 opponents.
     
  15. a jessup Blue Belt

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    Sometimes you get caught.

    Taylor did land some flush bombs in the rematch and Kelly took them well. Kelly also ate Lockett's Sunday best with no complaint.
     
  16. Cracky Fanny Pack

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    If Taylor hits anybody clean like that, they react. He fought a series of defensive fighters leading up to the pav fight.
     
  17. Mr.pain Brown Belt

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    Pavlik is the new Monzon, I don't see him getting ko'd anytime soon.

    He's the truth and is the most exciting champion to come in awhile, his skin color has nothing to do with it.
     
  18. AtomicPope Blue Belt

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  19. AtomicPope Blue Belt

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    I remember the Buzz around Tyson back when it was time for him to face Bruno. I was a kid back then and it's all anyone was talking about. All over the news. Every channel. People like power punchers.

    Then again. Beano might be on to something. Tyson hung out with a lot of white guys in the 80's.
     
  20. MC Paul Barman Gold Belt Platinum Member

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    Yeah, because you turned a simple post about some people at my working talking about Pavlik into a socio-political commentary on your perception of race relations.

    What a fun guy to have around you are.
     

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