Is Stipe overrated?

[Aurelian]

Lol at that. Even JDS has a much better resume than him and beat him in his prime...

JDS lost to Overeem after that and then Stipe beat Overeem. Then Stipe avenged his loss to JDS. Their resumes are comparable.

Stipes best wins:
Werdum
Overeem
JDS
Francis
DC x2

JDS best wins:
Carwin
Cain
Mir
Stipe
Werdum
Mirko

The biggest difference is JDS lost twice badly to Cain and went 4-6 after the first Stipe fight.

 

[Aurelian]

Definitely overrated. The first JDS fight shows Stipe's true ceiling - a very good fighter but a small step below the real greats.

Remember that JDS did this after the extraordinary beatings from Cain and was clearly not the same. A subsequent Overeem TKO and another two years finished JDS off for good before Stipe got to rematch his corpse.

His entire title run was him playing Turok, except when he caught a green Francis. Francis eventually showed how lucky Stipe was.

Very good fighter. But feasted on carcasses, which has inflated his record a lot.

The JDS Stipe first fight was very close. It probably could have went either way iirc. Also you mention the Overeem loss for JDS so can we mention Stipe beat Overeem 9 months after that?

 

[Skarsgard]

i think if anything, stipe is underrated.

hes not the flashiest fighter, he has zero charisma, he has a nerdy looking face, he has hipster hair, but he lays down beatings in a workman like fashion. this is the reason ppl overlook him.

theres no denying his resume and the fact that he has the most heavyweight defenses in UFC history.


nnganou didnt solve him, he was rocked bad about 2 seconds before stipe rushed in to try and finish him but got caught himself on a counter. theres no shame in losing to a viscious killer like nnganou who blitzed other great heavys such cain, jds, overeem etc etc.

Rocked badly? He took a step back and then violently knocked him out. No stanky leg. No wobble.

 

[pamirec]

It doesn't really matter who was or is the best. It's not a high bar to attain. There are many very good skilled hws but if title defenses is your only criteria ( it isn't that important to me ) then there's not much there.

No, not just number of title defences, but overall resume. At hw the biggest problem is consistency.

 

[HHJ]

JDS lost to Overeem after that and then Stipe beat Overeem. Then Stipe avenged his loss to JDS. Their resumes are comparable.

Stipes best wins:
Werdum
Overeem
JDS
Francis
DC x2

JDS best wins:
Carwin
Cain
Mir
Stipe
Werdum
Mirko

The biggest difference is JDS lost twice badly to Cain and went 4-6 after the first Stipe fight.

Also that first Stipe/Jds first fight was super competitive and some ppl thought Stipe won. Id like to re watch that one soon tbh

 

[Pequeño Corey]

Stipe landed a good shot on him and he looked hurt so Stipe got reckless going for the finish but Francis has recovered quickly and countered him on the way in.

Yea to this day I'm not sure if Franc did half a stanky leg, or if it was just a good shot that put him off balance. Either way, Stipe rushed in and got obliterated. Too bad we'lll never get the rubber match.

 

[Clark Rogers]

Most of what is being said about Stipe now never gets said if the Jones fight is never announced. There are a few decent, supportable points in the common gripes, but it's all far more about Jones hate. People love to shit on his opponents legacies to make Jones look worse.

 

[HHJ]

Yea to this day I'm not sure if Franc did half a stanky leg, or if it was just a good shot that put him off balance. Either way, Stipe rushed in and got obliterated. Too bad we'lll never get the rubber match.

I don't blame Stipe. You in there with Big Frank, gotta do him before he does you

 

[HHJ]

Most of what is being said about Stipe now never gets said if the Jones fight is never announced. There are a few decent, supportable points in the common gripes, but it's all far more about Jones hate. People love to shit on his opponents legacies to make Jones look worse.

I agree that Stipe was a great fighter. It's just that the hopes for this fight being worth the wait is very low

 

[Aurelian]

Also that first Stipe/Jds first fight was super competitive and some ppl thought Stipe won. Id like to re watch that one soon tbh

That's how I remember it too. I'm pretty sure that scorecard could have went either way. Might need to rewatch it myself. It's been a long time.

 

[Fedora Millionankles]

His best accomplishment is surviving 5 rounds against Ngannou

And Francis lost because he was gassed

Once Stipe was figured out, he was demolished (second fight)

How weak his punch is? Francis ate the best Sitpe's shots smiling, but almost fell unconscious when Joshua barely touched him

Today Stipe is moving like 60 yo Hollyfield

“When Joshua barely touched him?”
Maybe the dumbest thing I’ve read on here.

 

[Dr Fong]

I think Stipe's prime started a couple years after that and it was a very close fight, I remember thinking that he may have won at the time. He was definitely an up and comer to watch

So Stipe himself was already 32 in that fight. I agree he wasn't in his MMA prime yet but his improvement in skills has to be balanced against the fact that he himself was no longer in his athletic prime. And everyone else was a carcass compared to him.

Basically it was an old man division, where Stipe was always younger than his opponent (except green Francis and post Cain-JDS), with much less miles on him. He is an enigma because of his own late start in MMA.

Absolutely nobody he beat after that first JDS fight was in their prime.

Hunt - 41
Arlovski - one month from 37, 17 years in, 8 times KOd
Werdum - one month from 39
Overeem - 36, 17 years in, 13 times KOd (in both MMA + K1)

JDS - Younger than Stipe. But no serious MMA fans thinks JDS was the same fighter after Cain 1 + 2, Overeem KO and Stipe 1 war. There's a reason JDS opened as a massive betting favorite in first Stipe fight yet a significant underdog in the 2nd despite winning the first time.

Ngannou - As discussed. You can argue the 2nd Stipe fight was as much Stipe out of his prime as Ngannou was green in the first fight. But the fact Stipe got destroyed by a non-green Frank doesn't give him much credit for the first fight.

Cormier - 40/41 (39 when Cormier beat him)

Stipe's entire UFC record vs people younger than him is 4-3. His record against people older than him is 10-0.

His legacy is a Turok lie.

 

[HHJ]

So Stipe himself was already 32 in that fight. I agree he wasn't in his MMA prime yet but his improvement in skills has to be balanced against the fact that he himself was no longer in his athletic prime. And everyone else was a carcass compared to him.

Basically it was an old man division, where Stipe was always younger than his opponent (except green Francis and post Cain-JDS), with much less miles on him. He is an enigma because of his own late start in MMA.

Absolutely nobody he beat after that first JDS fight was in their prime.

Hunt - 41
Arlovski - one month from 37, 17 years in, 8 times KOd
Werdum - one month from 39
Overeem - 36, 17 years in, 13 times KOd (in both MMA + K1)

JDS - Younger than Stipe. But no serious MMA fans thinks JDS was the same fighter after Cain 1 + 2, Overeem KO and Stipe 1 war. There's a reason JDS opened as a massive betting favorite in first Stipe fight yet a significant underdog in the 2nd despite winning the first time.

Ngannou - As discussed. You can argue the 2nd Stipe fight was as much Stipe out of his prime as Ngannou was green in the first fight. But the fact Stipe got destroyed by a non-green Frank doesn't give him much credit for the first fight.

Cormier - 40/41 (39 when Cormier beat him)

Stipe's entire UFC record vs people younger than him is 4-3. His record against people older than him is 10-0.

His legacy is a Turok lie.

Hating ass bullshit

 

[TITS]

His best accomplishment is surviving 5 rounds against Ngannou

And Francis lost because he was gassed

Once Stipe was figured out, he was demolished (second fight)

How weak his punch is? Francis ate the best Sitpe's shots smiling, but almost fell unconscious when Joshua barely touched him

Today Stipe is moving like 60 yo Hollyfield

Nice attempt at trolling, turkeyhead.

 

[Dr Fong]

The JDS Stipe first fight was very close. It probably could have went either way iirc. Also you mention the Overeem loss for JDS so can we mention Stipe beat Overeem 9 months after that?

See my long post above about Stipe being a slightly younger, fresh man in an broken down old man's division. That's the true story of Stipe's legacy.

Not that he wasn't a great fighter and a quick learner for getting into MMA so late. But that he was the beneficiary of fortuitous circumstances.

 

[Dr Fong]

Hating ass bullshit

A 3 word response to my detailed breakdown of Stipe's title run is what I expect. But facts do not care about your feelings.

 

[Fedora Millionankles]

So Stipe himself was already 32 in that fight. I agree he wasn't in his MMA prime yet but his improvement in skills has to be balanced against the fact that he himself was no longer in his athletic prime. And everyone else was a carcass compared to him.

Basically it was an old man division, where Stipe was always younger than his opponent (except green Francis and post Cain-JDS), with much less miles on him. He is an enigma because of his own late start in MMA.

Absolutely nobody he beat after that first JDS fight was in their prime.

Hunt - 41
Arlovski - one month from 37, 17 years in, 8 times KOd
Werdum - one month from 39
Overeem - 36, 17 years in, 13 times KOd (in both MMA + K1)

JDS - Younger than Stipe. But no serious MMA fans thinks JDS was the same fighter after Cain 1 + 2, Overeem KO and Stipe 1 war. There's a reason JDS opened as a massive betting favorite in first Stipe fight yet a significant underdog in the 2nd despite winning the first time.

Ngannou - As discussed. You can argue the 2nd Stipe fight was as much Stipe out of his prime as Ngannou was green in the first fight. But the fact Stipe got destroyed by a non-green Frank doesn't give him much credit for the first fight.

Cormier - 40/41 (39 when Cormier beat him)

Stipe's entire UFC record vs people younger than him is 4-3. His record against people older than him is 10-0.

His legacy is a Turok lie.

So by this logic, Jon Jones is a scrub because he was younger than almost everyone he fought.
HW is the division where dinosaurs go into extinction. It’s always been this way.

 

[WillyWill]

Definitely not the most compelling HW of all time (Fedor) or biggest curiosity (Brock) or best back story (Randy) or baddest man OTP(Francis for a minute) but the most succesfull HW in the modern era. I feel bad because we're both midwesterners, but he's never done it for me. H'es never occupied that "The GOAT" category in my own mind. But i will admit he's been successful as hell and he knows how to win a HW MMA fight.

What i think the TS is trying to hint at though, a question of legacy, is firmly written. No matter how ubnimpressive he is, he has a legacy, and beating him would be the perfect last hurrah for Jones.

 

[deadshot138]

Slap yourself

 

[Dr Fong]

That's how I remember it too. I'm pretty sure that scorecard could have went either way. Might need to rewatch it myself. It's been a long time.

It was a very close, great fight - that JDS clearly won.

Unanimous decision + 11 media members + 70% fan scoring for JDS, 5% draw, v 5 media members and 26% fans for Miocic + 1 draw.

Having roughly a quarter of media members and a quarter of fans thinking Miocic won is just a standard amount of people who can't score fights for shit. 3/4s of people and all 3 judges scored it correctly.