If NFL is A level athleticism

[ermac88]

Yeah and the same Silva but with 10 more IQ points would beat that Silva too. Whats your point?

that example doesn't represent the same level of skill

 

[KeyboardFighter]

I suppose you can, but most verticals aren't measured from your legs as was shown in that video. They are measured by first measuring the standing athletes height and combined reach toward the sky. Than the athlete is supposed to jump as high as possible and reach marker. The the height/reach is subtracted from the height reached. This is how most verticals are measured.

But you can reach lower at the start right? And just lie thats your maximum stretched reach. And you also leave your feet on your toes, so you get a couple of inches.

 

[KeyboardFighter]

that example doesn't represent the same level of skill

So IQ is a skill now?

 

[Takamine86]

But you can reach lower at the start right? And just lie thats your maximum stretched reach. And you also leave your feet on your toes, so you get a couple of inches.

I'd imagine if they were trying to get the best results, they would at least try to do those things. lol
But I'm not in the room for those measurements so I can't really say. But there is a lot of money involved in these combine results for draft pick potential so the combine officials and scouts would probably be as strict as possible.

 

[Takamine86]

Do you actually believe it was Miocic level of athleticism that was the reason he didn't make it in baseball? Is this what they teach you in Amerilards?

Baseball is a skill sport sure, the point is better athletes pursue higher paying sports here. I can't speak for other countries though. But here, that is how it is.

Dominick Reyes is another guy, he came from Football

He was a decent college Safety who was trying to make it into the NFL. When he didn't get drafted into the NFL, he turned to MMA. A few years of training and now he is the current #1 LHW contender.

 

[KeyboardFighter]

I'd imagine if they were trying to get the best results, they would at least try to do those things. lol
But I'm not in the room for those measurements so I can't really say. But there is a lot of money involved in these combine results for draft pick potential so the combine officials and scouts would probably be as strict as possible.

Yeah I just love picking stuff like this apart. Because people have such a blind faith in stats, measurments and numbers like these because it appears so scientific. People need to use their common sense more today and be sceptical of everything.

 

[KeyboardFighter]

Baseball is a skill sport sure, the point is better athletes pursue higher paying sports here. I can't speak for other countries though. But here, that is how it is.

Dominick Reyes is another guy, he came from Football

He was a decent college Safety who was trying to make it into the NFL. When he didn't get drafted into the NFL, he turned to MMA. A few years of training and now he is the current #1 LHW contender.

As I stated before, here in Sweden you just pick a sport or 2 when your young and stick to those. So changing late in life to other sports is a completly foreign concept for me. Although many people start with MMA pretty late in age here, because of the self defense factor.

And I agree that the level of athletes are probably higher in NFL than in MMA right now but I can see that changing. It's more of a global sport than footlard after all.

 

[ermac88]

So IQ is a skill now?

Fight iq is an element of skill and not physical athleticism

 

[Khaiser]

Only thing dunking requires is the ability to hold a basketball and a vertical to reach the rim. In other words, what the basketball player is doing when he jumps is much harder. He has to be wary about defenders, he has to control the basketball, and he has to jump and slam the ball through the hoop. So the basketball player is jumping and doing extra, which would be more difficult than a standard vertical leap.

I don't understand the point you're trying to make.

The point I’m making is that if you want to test someone’s vertical leap, using their ability to slam dunk is a poor method. It would be akin to testing their sprint speed by asking them to dribble a football.

You need a good vertical leap to dunk just as you need running speed to dribble quickly, but both require a degree of skill. Imagine asking Ronaldo to dunk a basketball. Unless he had practiced, there’s little chance he could do it. He would clean out any similarly sized NBA player in a aerial
Duel to header a football because he’s been doing it for decades.

There is literally no advantage of using someone’s ability to dunk a basketball as a measure of their vertical leap over just using a straightforward vertical leap test, without a ball of any sorts.

 

[Khaiser]

As I stated before, here in Sweden you just pick a sport or 2 when your young and stick to those. So changing late in life to other sports is a completly foreign concept for me. Although many people start with MMA pretty late in age here, because of the self defense factor.

And I agree that the level of athletes are probably higher in NFL than in MMA right now but I can see that changing. It's more of a global sport than footlard after all.

This is definitely one of the things that separated Europe and the US.

You want to ‘pick’ real football because it’s the most lucrative sport on the planet and you’ve just realised you’re a decent natural athlete? Too late if you’re older than about 7 years old.

You ‘pick’ sports because they’re accessible, your peer group do them, or your parents want you to do them. Money doesn’t even enter most people’s heads.

 

[Khaiser]

Do you truly believe that in a fist fight Arthur and Chandler Jones can beat Jon? Families say all sorts of things to compliment each other and if Jonny's saying his bros, who just play football and do a little 'rasslin' in the off-season for cross-training purposes, can beat the GOAT in a fight you absolutely have to realize that this is an untrue statement. I've never seen Jonny say this either. He stated that his bros were better athletes (I would disagree, but whatever) and he said his big bro Arthur used to beat him up when they were kids as all big bros worth their salt do. I have never seen Jonny say that this could still happen because there is no way that pear-shaped, Grimace-looking blob Arthur would do anything but get pieced up for as long as that fight lasted.

If you honestly believe that they can then I have to question your breadth of knowledge regarding MMA.

You can immediately tell when someone’s not been in a decent mma/boxing gym when they make statement like those suggesting Jones’s bro’s could beat him up. It’s laughable.

But he has no evidence to base his decision on apparently. Other than Jones being a world class fighter and his brothers having never fought....

 

[Khaiser]

Hold on, you guys count baseball as an athletically demanding sport???! <45>

 

[dmwalking]

How did Greg Hardy do so well with lifelong exercise induced asthma?

https://www.google.com/search?q=olympians+with+asthma

 

[FrontNakedChoke]

How did Greg Hardy do so well with lifelong exercise induced asthma?

Because he's an A-level athlete despite his disadvantage.

 

[ConorFacts]

https://www.google.com/search?q=olympians+with+asthma

show me a HW with a few years exp + asthma.

You can immediately tell when someone’s not been in a decent mma/boxing gym when they make statement like those suggesting Jones’s bro’s could beat him up. It’s laughable.

But he has no evidence to base his decision on apparently. Other than Jones being a world class fighter and his brothers having never fought....

they already beat him.

they even said that they are more natural fighters.

jones word >>> random sherdog.


LOL

 

[dmwalking]

show me a HW with a few years exp + asthma.



they already beat him.

they even said that they are more natural fighters.

jones word >>> random sherdog.


LOL

not sure what your point is. I’m pointing out that plenty of A level athletes have had asthma.

 

[Khaiser]

show me a HW with a few years exp + asthma.



they already beat him.

they even said that they are more natural fighters.

jones word >>> random sherdog.


LOL

World class fighter > bloke that never fought

 

[Takamine86]

The point I’m making is that if you want to test someone’s vertical leap, using their ability to slam dunk is a poor method. It would be akin to testing their sprint speed by asking them to dribble a football.

You need a good vertical leap to dunk just as you need running speed to dribble quickly, but both require a degree of skill. Imagine asking Ronaldo to dunk a basketball. Unless he had practiced, there’s little chance he could do it. He would clean out any similarly sized NBA player in a aerial
Duel to header a football because he’s been doing it for decades.

There is literally no advantage of using someone’s ability to dunk a basketball as a measure of their vertical leap over just using a straightforward vertical leap test, without a ball of any sorts.

Well no duh.

So now you are agreeing with me. Yet when you were saying that soccer/futbal players can run faster than American Football players, you were posting videos of them dribbling the ball downfield as a measure of their speed.

Someone's ability to Dunk is a display of their vertical leap. Just like running downfield is a display of their speed. They aren't measured in real time, but with today's technology, they can be measured in replay. Which is why I accepted the video you posted as a display of the soccer players speed since you couldn't find any actual measured time like a 40 or 100 m dash.

You say there is no advantage of using someone's ability to dunk as a measure of their vertical leap over a vertical leap test without a ball. I can tell you, that is factually incorrect. In Basketball, there are advantages of seeing a player dunk over seeing his vertical leap tested. I'll give you 2 examples of that.

1) Vertical leaps are tested in place without any momentum. Most dunks in the NBA are not in place. A basketball player's ability to elevate is increased when the player is in motion. So for example, Dr.J isn't going to jump from the free throw line and dunk in place, but he can with a running start.

2) Dunking show a players ability to control the ball. It is more difficult to dunk the ball than to just do a standard vertical leap. & because the game requires you to handle the ball, you get more information from seeing Dunks in basketball than from a standard vertical leap. Dunking is basically a display of an athletes vertical elevation with the added work of controlling the basketball and being able to dunk while defenders are trying to stop you.

So yes, Dunking is an excellent way to see an athlete's ability to elevate. It is literally a display of an athlete's vertical prowess. Players who are dunking the basketball tend to surpass the elevations of their tested vertical leap. In other words, they jump even higher when they are dunking.

 

[ermac88]

You can immediately tell when someone’s not been in a decent mma/boxing gym when they make statement like those suggesting Jones’s bro’s could beat him up. It’s laughable.

But he has no evidence to base his decision on apparently. Other than Jones being a world class fighter and his brothers having never fought....

Incorrect again.
2 critical points not processing here-

1) These were the jones brothers words, not mine

2) I have never seen Arthur fight (only play wrestle handling his lighter, younger brother)

It also appears a couple rudimentary factors escaping you, which are further confusing you

-Arthur trains mma at Jacksons (with Jon) in the off season
-Arthur was a more axcomplished wrestler
-Arthur outweighs Jon by 100lbs
-Arthur is the Superior athlete

Even considering those factors, without actually seeing Arthur fight (other than play wrestle Jon) its impossible to draw a conclusion how well he can actually fight in a mixed martial setting

 

[TRYHARD 2001]

Incorrect again.
2 critical points not processing here-

1) These were the jones brothers words, not mine

2) I have never seen Arthur fight (only play wrestle handling his lighter, younger brother)

It also appears a couple rudimentary factors escaping you, which are further confusing you

-Arthur trains mma at Jacksons (with Jon) in the off season
-Arthur was a more axcomplished wrestler
-Arthur outweighs Jon by 100lbs
-Arthur is the Superior athlete

Even considering those factors, without actually seeing Arthur fight (other than play wrestle Jon) its impossible to draw a conclusion how well he can actually fight in a mixed martial setting

Just between us, do you personally believe that if Jon were to fight Arthur that Arthur would win or even do well? For starters, the weight difference is almost entirely fat, Arthur has no actual fight experience, and Jones is the GOAT. Whatever he did to Jon as children is irrelevant (unless Jon's carrying some psychological baggage with him from back then or conversely some serious motivation to whoop his bro's fat ass). Play wrestling means nothing. Jonny was a JuCo national champ, Arthur was a high school state champ in New York. He trained at Jackson-Wink for a little over a month during the 2011 lockout and visited sporadically after that for a couple years but he has not returned in years and is not on the same level as Jon in terms of fighting skill. Or even close. And at 33 he never will be. Arthur is shorter, fatter, and has been retired from football for 2 years and is in no way, shape, or form the better athlete. Jon can big both his brothers up as much as he wants, as family members always seem to do, but the cold hard reality is that if Jon wants to whoop either one of them it's gonna happen. Or at least that's by far the most likely scenario.

That's my take.