Heavyweight is the most overrated division of all time.

[revoltub]

I don't even see why this is up for debate. Jon Jones, who is pretty much hailed as one of the greatest MMA fighters of all time and the best currently fighting has gone on record saying he's waiting for the right opponent before he moves up to HW (never gonna happen, he's been saying it for years) and that he would not do well against HW's that have 40 lbs on him (and Jones is a guy who can absolutely fight at HW with his size)

People like Couture had success at HW in the UFC when it was dogshit

People constantly put their body through trauma to cut 10-20 lbs in MMA/UFC to gain advantages on fight night, it's not unusual to see 20-40 lb discrepancies between HW fighters

a well rounded HW like Barnett, Werdum, Reem, Cain, etc are the greatest fighters in the sport..they're as skilled as people in lower divisions and hit like trucks

P4P lists are dumb marketing tools, HW division is the pinnacle of fighting..you won't see better fighters, but you may be entertained more from other divisions

Hw was dog shit yet 3 guys from that era (hunt, barnett, arlovski) are still top 10

 

[revoltub]

Jones

cormier

 

[Redhawks100]

It's the least evolved division in MMA history

Still fun to watch tho

 

[RandomHero86]

Rumble got destroyed by rich Clementi and Josh Koscheck. They fucking stomped him.

He clearly functions better at a heavier weight, arlovski was also cheated in that fight. You clearly haven't watched it. Not to mention Arlovski is handily finished by HW that can connect clean. Rumble doesn't have that vicious HW power that Stipe or Overeem have. Rumble would get destroyed at HW. There is a reason he cuts to avoid that division. It's not because he enjoys dehydrating his body.

Cormier fought jones dehydrated and at LHW, not at HW.

Overeem is obviously much better at 265 when not dehydrating himself to make 205.

There's a reason guys fight at 205 and not 265. Because they don't want 6'5, 250 Werdum's foot in their throat or 300lbs Mark Hunt smashing their face in.

You don't dehydrate yourself to fight in a lower division because you're a hero. You do it because you are afraid of competing at a higher weight class because you have a higher chance of losing.

Rumble doesnt avoid that division because the competition is better, he avoids it because he's an undersized heavyweight. Guys who fight at HW these days cut from like 300 lbs in some cases. Rumble probably walks around at like 230. That's a massive size difference when talking about natural walk around weight.

Fighters cut to lower divisions because they want to be as big as possible in a division in order to try to gain a size advantage. And since everyone cuts, fighters are forced to perpetuate the cycle or come in undersized against an opponent.

As far as competition goes, I think both the HW and LHW divisions are weak. A few top guys, but I'd say most of the rest of the top 10 in each division are massively overrated. 5-10 in each of those divisions are miles behind 5-10 in the lower weight classes in the lighter divisions IMO. I'm judging this on the idea that, in the lighter divisions I'm not surprised at all if a top 20 guy beats a top 5 guy because the skill level of the division as a whole is so high. When I look at LHW and HW, I think watching a top 5 guy against anyone ranked outside of the top 5 really highlights the skill difference.

 

[Cooliox]

Everyone from MW and LHW are obviously cutting weight for fun

 

[Fyreborn]

Rumble is a top 3 LHW. Arlovski is not a top 3 HW. And that was a very competitive fight.

Vitor was a legit roided out of his mind HW back then. He shrunk a lot.

DC could potentially be HW champ, so that's a good example. There are HWs he'd be the underdog too - JDS, Cain, Werdum, Stipe. But he might be a bigger underdog to Jones than to any HW. Though I have to add that JDS can KO DC, while Jones is quite unlikely to.

Horsemeat Reem is so far from LHW Reem it's crazy. You think skinny LHW Reem would do well at HW??? He'd get killed.

LHW is only "better" than HW in a P4P sense. Most divisions are better than HW.

But HW is still where the large majority of the top dogs fight.

 

[revoltub]

Everyone from MW and LHW are obviously cutting weight for fun

they are cutting weight for a perceived advantage that doesnt exist.

by your logic, pettis should be fw champion, yet he has his only loss by strikes was to max who is a FW.

Fedor has only ever been knocked out cold by a MW.

Hunts first time getting KO'd cold was from A mw (manhoef)

 

[revoltub]

Rumble is a top 3 LHW. Arlovski is not a top 3 HW. And that was a very competitive fight.

Vitor was a legit roided out of his mind HW back then. He shrunk a lot.

DC could potentially be HW champ, so that's a good example. There are HWs he'd be the underdog too - JDS, Cain, Werdum, Stipe. But he might be a bigger underdog to Jones than to any HW. Though I have to add that JDS can KO DC, while Jones is quite unlikely to.

Horsemeat Reem is so far from LHW Reem it's crazy. You think skinny LHW Reem would do well at HW??? He'd get killed.

LHW is only "better" than HW in a P4P sense. Most divisions are better than HW.

But HW is still where the large majority of the top dogs fight.

reem is a small HW.

ARLOVSKI IS TOP 10

 

[opie]

nobody overrates heavyweight. it is a joke. heavyweight fighters (boxing and mma) are losers that werent athletic enough for real sports.

 

[Cooliox]

they are cutting weight for a perceived advantage that doesnt exist.

by your logic, pettis should be fw champion, yet he has his only loss by strikes was to max who is a FW.

Fedor has only ever been knocked out cold by a MW.

Hunts first time getting KO'd cold was from A mw (manhoef)

That's fucking stupid. By my logic?

My 'logic' is stating that weight-cutting is the most brutal part of camp, and these guys aren't cutting weight for an easier fight. "perceived advantage that doesn't exist" - yea, obviously all these guys have been fools for as long as weight cutting has existed in the UFC, and obviously you know better.



lol, man stfu.

 

[Fyreborn]

Rumble doesnt avoid that division because the competition is better, he avoids it because he's an undersized heavyweight. Guys who fight at HW these days cut from like 300 lbs in some cases. Rumble probably walks around at like 230. That's a massive size difference when talking about natural walk around weight.

Fighters cut to lower divisions because they want to be as big as possible in a division in order to try to gain a size advantage. And since everyone cuts, fighters are forced to perpetuate the cycle or come in undersized against an opponent.

As far as competition goes, I think both the HW and LHW divisions are weak. A few top guys, but I'd say most of the rest of the top 10 in each division are massively overrated. 5-10 in each of those divisions are miles behind 5-10 in the lower weight classes in the lighter divisions IMO. I'm judging this on the idea that, in the lighter divisions I'm not surprised at all if a top 20 guy beats a top 5 guy because the skill level of the division as a whole is so high. When I look at LHW and HW, I think watching a top 5 guy against anyone ranked outside of the top 5 really highlights the skill difference.

Rumble avoids HW because the competition IS better - better in an absolute sense, rather than a P4P sense.

You have the depth thing totally backwards. Due to HW power, the #20 HW has a *vastly* better shot against the #1 HW than the #20 flyweight has against the #1 flyweight.

 

[Fullmount Triangle]

who the FUCK rates heavyweight highly? I feel like everyone has always been aware that heavyweight division sucks, but the fact is that heavyweights are more popular. If you find a marketable heavyweight, it's equatable to gold.

LHW right now is way worse than heavyweight has maybe ever been.

 

[revoltub]

That's fucking stupid. By my logic?

My 'logic' is stating that weight-cutting is the most brutal part of camp, and these guys aren't cutting weight for an easier fight. "perceived advantage that doesn't exist" - yea, obviously all these guys have been fools for as long as weight cutting has existed in the UFC, and obviously you know better.



lol, man stfu.

okay, explain how pettis lost to holloway.

explain how cowboy is doing better at WW than he ever did at FW or LW.

explain how rumble is doing better at LHW than he did at WW or MW.

explain how reem is doing better at HW than he ever did at LW.

Ill wait

 

[phys_therapy]

Even the worst HWs can KO their opponent. That's enough appeal to me, although there's more to it than that.

 

[Fyreborn]

reem is a small HW.

ARLOVSKI IS TOP 10

You were talking about skinny LHW Pride Reem. Not current Reem.

Arlovski is top 10, but not too 3. Arlovski vs. Rumble is not an even comparison. How the hell do you not get that?

 

[revoltub]

You were talking about skinny LHW Pride Reem. Not current Reem.

Arlovski is top 10, but not too 3. Arlovski vs. Rumble is not an even comparison. How the hell do you not get that?

it's still reem. he's still the same person. he didn't magically change into a natural HW. he lifted weights and became a HW. he is still clearly a small HW.

and arlovski was almost close to a title shot before losing to reem. who cares if he's only top 10? that just feeds to my point.

if HW is such an untouchable division, rumble would have been ko'd by andrei with one punch

 

[tkotom]

Rumble doesnt avoid that division because the competition is better, he avoids it because he's an undersized heavyweight. Guys who fight at HW these days cut from like 300 lbs in some cases. Rumble probably walks around at like 230. That's a massive size difference when talking about natural walk around weight.

Fighters cut to lower divisions because they want to be as big as possible in a division in order to try to gain a size advantage. And since everyone cuts, fighters are forced to perpetuate the cycle or come in undersized against an opponent.

As far as competition goes, I think both the HW and LHW divisions are weak. A few top guys, but I'd say most of the rest of the top 10 in each division are massively overrated. 5-10 in each of those divisions are miles behind 5-10 in the lower weight classes in the lighter divisions IMO. I'm judging this on the idea that, in the lighter divisions I'm not surprised at all if a top 20 guy beats a top 5 guy because the skill level of the division as a whole is so high. When I look at LHW and HW, I think watching a top 5 guy against anyone ranked outside of the top 5 really highlights the skill difference.

Rumble avoids HW because he would get knocked dead. He got completely dominated and tapped by 5'11 Cormier at LHW.

Size has little to nothing to do with it. He cute to LHW because he's avoiding HW.

It's simple.

 

[BigMuffler]

okay, explain how pettis lost to holloway.

explain how cowboy is doing better at WW than he ever did at FW or LW.

explain how rumble is doing better at LHW than he did at WW or MW.

explain how reem is doing better at HW than he ever did at LW.

Ill wait

What about the opposite examples?

Lawler being a mid tier MW and becoming WW champion

Yoel being a mid tier LHW and becoming the hottest MW contender

Chael going up to LHW and being destroyed by Rashad

Barao going up to FW and being a nobody

MM dropping to FLW and becoming #1 P4P

all the small SW/natural AW girls who can't cut it anymore with all the FLWs and BWs cutting down

?

 

[Fyreborn]

it's still reem. he's still the same person. he didn't magically change into a natural HW. he lifted weights and became a HW. he is still clearly a small HW.

and arlovski was almost close to a title shot before losing to reem. who cares if he's only top 10? that just feeds to my point.

if HW is such an untouchable division, rumble would have been ko'd by andrei with one punch

Hahaha holy crap. Skinny Pride Reem is different than Ubereem and they are different than current Reem. Even a 4 year old could tell the difference between those three. Get the fuck outta here, are you trolling?

How does a top 3 LHW beating a top 10 HW feed your point?

No division or fighter is untouchable. Are you a child?

 

[Merman]

if HW's are the best fighters in the world how come couture won the HW title as a natural HW.

how come fat cormier did better at HW than at LHW?

So you are asking if HWs are the best then why did a natural HW win the title??? You answered it...BECAUSE HE IS A NATURAL HW artard!