Guys who train, is it even possible to compete at this level w/o PEDs?

[lefthighkick01]

Oh lawd, the steroid conspiracy nuts are out in full force.

oh Lawd, the posters that think nothing illegal ever happens in sports are out in full force...

betcha you're the same bunch that wont ever believe that fixed fights ever happen...

 

[Vintersorg]

With the news out about Anderson, I'm wondering if it's even possible to compete at this level w/o PEDs at some point.

I'm not talking about being natural for a fight or two. I'm talking about enduring the grind of year in, year out. Drug free.

It just does not seem possible that a human body can withstand the kind of intense training in all areas that these athletes require.

So, I'm interested to hear from guys who've actually trained intensely in these sports. Is it possible to be drug-free, at or near the top, and still have a long career.

I don't think so. Some guys are probably not using anything, but that's like less than 1% of people who not only have crazy fucking genetics, but great work ethic, focus and technique/skill. Many guys are physically gifted, but some start partying, some focus more on their family life and so on. It's very hard to find people with great genetics, complete dedication, willingness to learn and train hard every single day, will power, competitiveness etc. Like I said, less than 1%. Probably a certain amount of people tries to stay natural for a while, then they see everyone is using and they turn to the dark side as well. So yeah, I'd say that the large majority of pro athletes are on something.

 

[grimballer]

With the news out about Anderson, I'm wondering if it's even possible to compete at this level w/o PEDs at some point.

I'm not talking about being natural for a fight or two. I'm talking about enduring the grind of year in, year out. Drug free.

It just does not seem possible that a human body can withstand the kind of intense training in all areas that these athletes require.

So, I'm interested to hear from guys who've actually trained intensely in these sports. Is it possible to be drug-free, at or near the top, and still have a long career.

lets put it like this

body/muscles need between 48 to 72 hours to recuperate after a workout.

most of these elite guys train everyday, sometimes twice a day n do strength n conditioning on top of that.

they do that year long.

so you do the math.

even gsp said in one of the ufc countdown shows he cant have a diet of a regular person n needs extra supplements. now of much of a difference vitamin c n e supplements n protein powder really make?

 

[gevoudane]

I use to train with a lot of the team Quest guys and only a few I know for a fact where on something, the problem is there are only a few members of team quest that are the top upper echelon. To group them as a whole I would say PEDS are hardly used, but in the top of the top I have no comment.

 

[Jkaylor]

ITT: a lot of guys who don't train

 

[Jkaylor]

Oh lawd, the steroid conspiracy nuts are out in full force.

Oh lawd, i know that you need to be a thug for her, but this ain't what she mean when she said you should open up more

 

[Legendary]

2-3 high intensity workouts, 5-6 days a week is immediately a red flag.

After lifting really heavy, like when maxing out, I am useless in terms of being competitive in grappling for atleast 2 days. I have to tone back lifting to twice a week if I want to be able to do BJJ at all. I could lift 3 times a week, and do a little bit of running , but I wouldn't have the energy to grapple

I use to do 5x5 three times a week, was way to much If I wanted to incorporate any sport specific conditioning. I rolled it back to 3x5 (Starting Strength with assistance stuff) and I am much better in terms of recovery. Work outputs are possible to increase, but imagine lifting in the morning, then going to your gym for hard sparring for 1-2 hours, then repeat this , or vary similar intensities , 6 days a week. Its pretty much impossible naturally.

Rory says once a day 5 days a week is MORE then enough. He says he is always sore, and low on energy unless he gets frequent massages . I am sure he does cryothrapy, and etc.

 

[giusti825]

They're training up to 3x per day. The body can't do it. They're all suspicious.

Look at Weidman, Cormier, Jones. They all have testosterone levels that are lower than a 80 year old cancer patient. This isn't accusing. It's just pointing out a cold hard fact which is there for anyone to see.

You can draw your own conclusions from some pretty obvious data.

cormier's t was in a normal range for someone his age.

 

[Beastman09]

lets put it like this

body/muscles need between 48 to 72 hours to recuperate after a workout.

most of these elite guys train everyday, sometimes twice a day n do strength n conditioning on top of that.

they do that year long.

so you do the math.

even gsp said in one of the ufc countdown shows he cant have a diet of a regular person n needs extra supplements. now of much of a difference vitamin c n e supplements n protein powder really make?

1.) Who says they do it "year long" ?

2.) Not every "training day" is the same. Its not like they are going to the gym and maxing out every single day.


America: Anyone in good shape must be on steroids.

 

[NaziHunta]

Not after about 25 years old.

 

[Source]

I know about 3 elite guys whom I don't suspect of any butt needles. The rest. Questionable.

If everyone else are using then those 3 probably are as well. There aren't any fighters I would be sure are clean. Unfortunately anyone considered elite are on the suspect list automatically.

 

[Metallicalabran]

so people here is saying pro fighters must be on something because they have amazing cardio and amazing strenght

no one tought about how some people is genetically gifted ?? born to be stronger, faster, etc. Most of those people who are genetically gifted turn pro athlete because since early age they were gettin better results in sport with equal or sometimes LESS training compared to another kids who were not genetically gifted. ITS NOT CRAZY !!!!!!!!

So, if you are telling pro fighter must be FOR SURE on steroids because they are stronger and have better cardio than someone is not a pro fighter.... MAKES NO SENSE AT ALL.

there is a reason beacuse if we all train very hard Usain Bolt still gonna run faster than us, and believe me, is not because he uses peds and we dont

 

[snizzar]

Amen. Between competitive soccer through college and kickboxing I have an arthritic hip at 30, carpel tunnel in both hands, no ACL on my right knee and a long list of joint/tendon issues. No doubt I was a silly f#ck as a youngster and could have taken better care of myself, but I also wasn't the worst. Yoga and clean eating are pretty much the only things that keeps my body from falling into sudden-60yrold-syndrom .

I too have had a somewhat similar experience, though I'm still young. Spent a year and a half going to my mma gym pretty hard, consistent 4-5 days a week with some days doing grappling/striking back to back. In that short span I managed to accumulate a dislocated knee and torn labrum. Granted in hindsight I ate like shit and wasn't treating my body optimally in terms of health, but I can't imagine working out ~5 hours a day 6 days a week, with a lot of that being hard rolling/sparring. There's a reason why fighters like Nog/Wanderlei who are still relatively young look 10 years older than they should. Or Shogun having broken knees at age 30 something.

Not to mention that, but a lot of these up and coming pros can't make a living on fighting alone. So on top of those 5hr training sessions they probably work full time. It's just not feasible to do that without the aid of some extra "supplements".

 

[Beastman09]

I too have had a somewhat similar experience, though I'm still young. Spent a year and a half going to my mma gym pretty hard, consistent 4-5 days a week with some days doing grappling/striking back to back. In that short span I managed to accumulate a dislocated knee and torn labrum. Granted in hindsight I ate like shit and wasn't treating my body optimally in terms of health, but I can't imagine working out ~5 hours a day 6 days a week, with a lot of that being hard rolling/sparring. There's a reason why fighters like Nog/Wanderlei who are still relatively young look 10 years older than they should. Or Shogun having broken knees at age 30 something.

Not to mention that, but a lot of these up and coming pros can't make a living on fighting alone. So on top of those 5hr training sessions they probably work full time. It's just not feasible to do that without the aid of some extra "supplements".

No disrespect but...



I just don't think you can compare your training(and "eating like shit") to the training of a professional atheletes who have their nutrition planned, training schedule planned, and all of the other things that come with being a fighter for a living

 

[Malthian]

I think we have to remember the tremendous pressure that most fighters are operating under. Aside from the factors of putting food on the table and a short career span, the gap between the true genetic freaks the run of the mill joe is vast.

I've rolled with guys that I know for a fact never took a thing in their lives and they were still so ridiculously stronger, faster and more explosive that I knew for a fact I could work out for 10 years and I'd still never touch them.

You see the same thing in every sport.

There's a very small handful of genetic freaks who then compete at the higher levels and the vast majority suddenly realize that they're up against athletes that are even more freakish and now have to face the reality that they could never, ever compete with them without help.

And then you have the guys that are facing father time and want to extend their careers and paydays. The window for top line competition is pretty narrow in terms of the hours of punishment your body can take, especially when you're grappling or taking hits in actual fights.

The ones I find the most suspicious are the guys that have engaged in multiple wars, or who are fighting deep into their careers and still operate at a very high level but aren't highly technical, or who have very minor athletic backgrounds and are keeping up with fighters with very deep athletic backgrounds.

One thing I should note, the shifts in advanced legal treatment has changed the playing field substantially. Hyperbaric chambers, cryo chambers, massage, advanced nutrition, blood cell platelet injections and stem cell therapies are radically changing the sport in terms of recovery times. For the fighters that can afford it, it's increasingly becoming easier and easier to recover and train without the use of banned substances.

I do think we're going to see some serious changes in training practice. I believe that 2 a days will still happen, but I suspect the shift will increasingly be towards lower intensity workouts vs the all out wars in training that some camps seem to favor.

That and we'll start seeing fights where athletes gas sooner, lose mass, don't hit as hard, and suddenly don't seem as dominant in terms of strength versus their competitors. That and we may start seeing some of the fighters who have struggled a bit in the lower tiers suddenly start looking better and more competitive.

 

[Average]

Not after about 25 years old.

I trained and fought till I was 30 (just over two years ago) and everyone went crazy over how good my cardio and endurance were.

But there are athletes like my dad who are way more durable than I was. In his mid forties he still had a 90 mph + fast ball. He's one of those rare breeds.

Some people have freak genetics. They do exist

 

[Steiger]

1.) Who says they do it "year long" ?

2.) Not every "training day" is the same. Its not like they are going to the gym and maxing out every single day.


America: Anyone in good shape must be on steroids.

Go to bed, you little snot.

 

[therealnod]

so people here is saying pro fighters must be on something because they have amazing cardio and amazing strenght

no one tought about how some people is genetically gifted ?? born to be stronger, faster, etc. Most of those people who are genetically gifted turn pro athlete because since early age they were gettin better results in sport with equal or sometimes LESS training compared to another kids who were not genetically gifted. ITS NOT CRAZY !!!!!!!!

So, if you are telling pro fighter must be FOR SURE on steroids because they are stronger and have better cardio than someone is not a pro fighter.... MAKES NO SENSE AT ALL.

there is a reason beacuse if we all train very hard Usain Bolt still gonna run faster than us, and believe me, is not because he uses peds and we dont

This is almost identical to the argument being put forth by baseball fans ten years ago. It wasn't insane to think that someone could really be just that damn good. Of course we found out the truth...

 

[Givvee]

At the highest level, it is possible to cheat without getting caught. for a normal person, the T/E ratio should be 1:1, but Nevada at one point allowed 6:1, that means you can do testosterone without getting caught.

BJJ as well has a huge PED problem.

 

[lorenzofertatta]

SARMs, PPar agonists, blood doping, growth hormone secretagogues, peptides, designer steroids.... You guys have no idea how much modern, undetectable, stuff is out there. They work wonders for an athlete, trust me, there is no reason a top UFC fighter would stay natural when there is money involved.