Everybody will downplay Izzy’s KO win over Jan in the future for being a weak champ in a weak era

[ejlarson249]

Everybody will downplay Izzy’s KO win over Jan in the future for being a weak champ in a weak era

I hadn't even considered that, but thanks to you I will do that for sure now. Neato!

 

[Ch31ck]

it doesn't though. same reason why nobody says mcgregor or dc is the goat. it's impressive and absolutely shows you're a cut above the goat, but doesn't mean shit if you cant defend the belt you jst won.

Plenty of people (including myself) consider DC to be in the GOAT conversation because he defended both belts. Conor hasn't defended any belt he has won, so he's not in the conversation. If Israel wins the LHW belt and defends it, he should be in the conversation IMO.

 

[GoshiShun17]

mate beating Jan, is like Silva beating griffin, it is cool, but it aint legacy making stuff ... Jones is the LHW champion, now if izzy beat that, then yeah that's a real double champ.

This is a BS analogy for two reasons.
Number 1: Silva's performance against Griffin IS a huge part of his legacy.

Number 2: Jan is a much more dangerous fighter and a much bigger threat than Forest EVER was. Griffin had no power and no wrestling to thread Anderson. And his striking skills were light years behind.

Jan has better striking, more power, and he can wrestle. Not to mention that he isn't coming off a KO loss, but rather a vicious KO win streak and he's actually the champion. Silva NEVER challenged the active champ. Plain and simple.

mike koed the lineal champ , jan didn't . simple ...

Means nothing at all. Jan is just as legit a champ as Mike was and an even more dangerous fighter. Not Jan's fault Jon left.

If you discredited GSPs win over Bisping then this is the same situation. Jan is an upset champ just like Michael was. Jan has only been the favorite in 2 fights in the UFC. Hes not a dominant fighter and i think many view many LHWs as better than him even if hes holding the title (Nemkov, Jiri, Ankalaev, Santos etc) much like how many saw many MWs (Whittaker, Yoel, Saucy etc) as better than Bisping

Not even. GSP had been in the UFC for YEARS and never challenged any of the 185 champs. He cherry picked Mike who hadn't looked incredibly dangerous other than KOing Luke.

Adesanya is barely 3 years in and is already challenging the champion above who is also looking incredible lately, KOing opponents left and right.

 

[Asako]

Izzy winning is good for the UFC. A lot of intriguing matchups at LHW.

 

[CaptHANDSUP]

Pump the breaks, pump the breaks.

He's got to win the fight first.

 

[KillerIsBack V2]

This is a BS analogy for two reasons.
Number 1: Silva's performance against Griffin IS a huge part of his legacy.

Number 2: Jan is a much more dangerous fighter and a much bigger threat than Forest EVER was. Griffin had no power and no wrestling to thread Anderson. And his striking skills were light years behind.

Jan has better striking, more power, and he can wrestle. Not to mention that he isn't coming off a KO loss, but rather a vicious KO win streak and he's actually the champion. Silva NEVER challenged the active champ. Plain and simple.

Means nothing at all. Jan is just as legit a champ as Mike was and an even more dangerous fighter. Not Jan's fault Jon left.

Not even. GSP had been in the UFC for YEARS and never challenged any of the 185 champs. He cherry picked Mike who hadn't looked incredibly dangerous other than KOing Luke.

Adesanya is barely 3 years in and is already challenging the champion above who is also looking incredible lately, KOing opponents left and right.

Never seen anybody defend a paper belt holder so hard.. i was kidding in the OP when I said he has fans..

that intrem hair clip could have been given to the winner of Santos/Glover and it’d be worth exactly the same. He won a mini lottery.

Jan’s streak? The one where he won a close SD to Jacare’s 40 year old corpse? Prime Jacare was on a much more impressive and longer streak and didnt get a title shot. Same Jan streak that started with beating Rockhold’s retiring MW ghost?

also, Jan is not a better striker than griffin or Bisping

 

[GoshiShun17]

Never seen anybody defend a paper belt holder so hard.. i was kidding in the OP when I said he has fans..

that intrem hair clip could have been given to the winner of Santos/Glover and it’d be worth exactly the same. He won a mini lottery.

Jan’s streak? The one where he won a close SD to Jacare’s 40 year old corpse? Prime Jacare was on a much more impressive and longer streak and didnt get a title shot. Same Jan streak that started with beating Rockhold’s retiring MW ghost?

also, Jan is not a better striker than griffin or Bisping

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What does Jacare not getting a title shot have to do with Jan??? Extremely weak argument there. Besides Jacare was the one stalling in their fight.

And you are ridiculous to claim Griffin is a better striker. Bisping may beat a bit more technical in some aspects but he never got the consistent results Jan has been getting. When have you ever seen Bisping landing vicious body kicks like Jan vs Reyes.

Stop the bullshit you are speaking. The main person trying to discredit the merit of this fight is YOU. Smh, Forest a better striker, GTFO
I hope you were joking.

 

[Kono dio da!]

I mean its cute that he suddenly has fans and all but lets be real. He was KO’d last year by Thiago pretty easily. Who is riding a boring loss to Jone’s bored skeleton same as Dom.

I was wrong about Jan, He is a G. However the Izzy fight, at least to me, isn't as appealing. Jan doesn't match up well with him in my humble opinion. Also their styles don't meld in a way that interests me. Jones vs Adesanya, for instance poses questions (Izzy's wrestling, they're both long, wiry, excellent kickers, can izzy use his boxing advantage? Can he close the range? Can he survive Jones' clinch? Will Jones beat him at his own game like he's done to everyone? Jones is still young enough, Jan is 37. How long is he still gonna be kicking ass. Can Jon deal with Izzy's speed? etc etc). Jan vs Izzy just doesn't pose the same questions. Also it doesn't help that, as good as jan is, his striking isn't as smooth, he lunges forward with flurries etc.

So if Izzy does win, it just won't hit as hard as him vs Jones. I'm sorry for hating on the fight, but that's just how I feel about it. As a casual, who hates trash talk and stuff, I have to be honest and say that the history Jon and izzy have makes the fight more compelling. There's nothing between Jan and Izzy, no beef, no common thread, no rematch, no common opponents nothing. It's random and feels like they're using Jan as a sacrificial lamb. It's like Conor vs Eddie. I know Conor was trying to fight RDA. But life happened. When he beat Nate, I thought he'd go back to featherweight. But instead the Eddie fight was announced. It felt forced and random. Same vibe. It's just a bullshit excuse for Izzy to become double champ. Izzy vs Jones imo is better. It means more, Jones is a better fighter and if he wins he can then go on and challenge the winner of Glover vs Jan. Lastly the reason people will think he's a weak champ, which isn't true per se, is that, as i mentioned earlier, stylistically, he doesn't pose a threat to Izzy, at least in the striking realm of things. So it's all just weird and imo misguided.

 

[orca]

he should fight jon jones first. to test himself if he is worthy of the title shot.. no more ducking

 

[Kono dio da!]

Yep, it's pretty obvious that's what will happen. Adesanya haters are already making threads about how winning a second belt doesn't put you in the goat conversation.

Look, let's be real here, it doesn't put you in goat discussion. What Izzy has BEEN doing, calling out the scariest guys IN HIS DIVISION and beating them does. When you do so, you're putting your belt, reputation, livelihood and life's work on the line. If you lose to a champ in a higher weight class "Oh well x was bigger, no biggie". It's little risk, huge reward. Many other champs in history would have claimed a second belt, given the opportunity. Dana only offers that to fighters he likes or to eviscerate fighters he hates (Cyborg and Stipe, as evident from his unwillingness to give them rematches). I mean you think Aldo couldn't have beaten Edgar, Pettis or Bendo circa 2012-13? Also these smaller champs moving up aren't fighting their way up they're just being gifted these shots on reputation only.

What would be more impressive is if a smaller champion took a series of fights in the class above to earn the title shot and then defend said belts in both weight classes. That's some baller ass shit. Not this shit. I'll watch and give him his props if he wins, at least unlike conor and cejudo he actually defended his belt before moving up. Just wish he'd earn the 205 belt, for example by taking the Jones fight, now that there isn't a new contender at 185 he hasn't beaten. Because some of us can see through the BS. Like you can clearly see that they're trying to make him a double champ for marketability. And the way it's done in the UFC, the way rankings and lines are skipped just make the belts and double champ status feel cheap. Nunes, at least defends both belts, as did David Branch back in the PFL days.

 

[GoshiShun17]

Look, let's be real here, it doesn't put you in goat discussion. What Izzy has BEEN doing, calling out the scariest guys IN HIS DIVISION and beating them does. When you do so, you're putting your belt, reputation, livelihood and life's work on the line. If you lose to a champ in a higher weight class "Oh well x was bigger, no biggie". It's little risk, huge reward. Many other champs in history would have claimed a second belt, given the opportunity. Dana only offers that to fighters he likes or to eviscerate fighters he hates (Cyborg and Stipe, as evident from his unwillingness to give them rematches). I mean you think Aldo couldn't have beaten Edgar, Pettis or Bendo circa 2012-13? Also these smaller champs moving up aren't fighting their way up they're just being gifted these shots on reputation only.

What would be more impressive is if a smaller champion took a series of fights in the class above to earn the title shot and then defend said belts in both weight classes. That's some baller ass shit. Not this shit. I'll watch and give him his props if he wins, at least unlike conor and cejudo he actually defended his belt before moving up. Just wish he'd earn the 205 belt, for example by taking the Jones fight, now that there isn't a new contender at 185 he hasn't beaten. Because some of us can see through the BS. Like you can clearly see that they're trying to make him a double champ for marketability. And the way it's done in the UFC, the way rankings and lines are skipped just make the belts and double champ status feel cheap. Nunes, at least defends both belts, as did David Branch back in the PFL days.

You are being ridiculed here. Adesanya is a champion and proven. It's silly to say he should have to work his way up in the next division as an active champ.

I don't know how long you've been following combat sports but never in history has a champ been asked to do that so why all of a sudden it's necessary for Adesanya. No one at 205 has looked more impressive than him as of late.

It's already impressive that he is challenging for the 205 belt, something NO middleweight champion has ever done in history, let alone win. There is NO BS about it. Jan is a very dangerous fighter who earned the title. He's just as much of a threat or more as any of the contenders at 185.

You act as though Adesanya beating Jones is the only thing that can impess you but when he does that, you'll make excuses too. "Why didn't Jon wrestle?" Lol.

 

[Kono dio da!]

You are being ridiculed here. Adesanya is a champion and proven. It's silly to say he should have to work his way up in the next division as an active champ.

I don't know how long you've been following combat sports but never in history has a champ been asked to do that so why all of a sudden it's necessary for Adesanya. No one at 205 has looked more impressive than him as of late.

It's already impressive that he is challenging for the 205 belt, something NO middleweight champion has ever done in history, let alone win. There is NO BS about it. Jan is a very dangerous fighter who earned the title. He's just as much of a threat or more as any of the contenders at 185.

You act as though Adesanya beating Jones is the only thing that can impess you but when he does that, you'll make excuses too. "Why didn't Jon wrestle?" Lol.

You're twisting my words. I'm not saying that's a requirement unique to him. What i'm saying is I don't respect the idea of champ champ, the way it's done in the UFC, periodt. Smaller champs are allowed to skip the queue and never have to earn their way to the top. Who's to say that Cejudo wouldn't have lost to Sterling on the way up? Or Conor wouldn't have lost to Khabib if he had to work his way up. What Izzy is doing at 185 is impressive. If he does beat Jan, what's next? Will he defend both belts? Will he be a diva and refuse to fight? etc. That's why I would have preferred Jones. It doesn't hold up any division. It doesn't spit on meritocracy, it's a genuine beef, it's a draw and it's a fight that i know YOU would personally love. The Jan fight is just weird to me.

Last point/question, True or False: Izzy vs Jan is much much more hype if Izzy beats Jones and Jan beats Glover first. (You know it is)

 

[GoshiShun17]

You're twisting my words. I'm not saying that's a requirement unique to him. What i'm saying is I don't respect the idea of champ champ, the way it's done in the UFC, periodt. Smaller champs are allowed to skip the queue and never have to earn their way to the top. Who's to say that Cejudo wouldn't have lost to Sterling on the way up? Or Conor wouldn't have lost to Khabib if he had to work his way up. What Izzy is doing at 185 is impressive. If he does beat Jan, what's next? Will he defend both belts? Will he be a diva and refuse to fight? etc. That's why I would have preferred Jones. It doesn't hold up any division. It doesn't spit on meritocracy, it's a genuine beef, it's a draw and it's a fight that i know YOU would personally love. The Jan fight is just weird to me.

Last point/question, True or False: Izzy vs Jan is much much more hype if Izzy beats Jones and Jan beats Glover first. (You know it is)

FALSE!!! Izzy vs Jon would have waaaaay more hype if Adesanya captures the belt from Jan first. Waaaay more hype.

Hell, Adesanya just might be the betting favorite. I've been telling you for a while now.

 

[Kono dio da!]

FALSE!!! Izzy vs Jon would have waaaaay more hype if Adesanya captures the belt from Jan first. Waaaay more hype.

Hell, Adesanya just might be the betting favorite. I've been telling you for a while now.

Nah. You're bugging. Now is the time yo make izzy vs jones is the fight to make right now. Wouldn't say favourite but it's more competitive than i would've imagined it, say two years ago. It's compelling I'll tell you that. Jones wins though not a flawless victory, but fatality for sure.

 

[KillerIsBack V2]

I was wrong about Jan, He is a G. However the Izzy fight, at least to me, isn't as appealing. Jan doesn't match up well with him in my humble opinion. Also their styles don't meld in a way that interests me. Jones vs Adesanya, for instance poses questions (Izzy's wrestling, they're both long, wiry, excellent kickers, can izzy use his boxing advantage? Can he close the range? Can he survive Jones' clinch? Will Jones beat him at his own game like he's done to everyone? Jones is still young enough, Jan is 37. How long is he still gonna be kicking ass. Can Jon deal with Izzy's speed? etc etc). Jan vs Izzy just doesn't pose the same questions. Also it doesn't help that, as good as jan is, his striking isn't as smooth, he lunges forward with flurries etc.

So if Izzy does win, it just won't hit as hard as him vs Jones. I'm sorry for hating on the fight, but that's just how I feel about it. As a casual, who hates trash talk and stuff, I have to be honest and say that the history Jon and izzy have makes the fight more compelling. There's nothing between Jan and Izzy, no beef, no common thread, no rematch, no common opponents nothing. It's random and feels like they're using Jan as a sacrificial lamb. It's like Conor vs Eddie. I know Conor was trying to fight RDA. But life happened. When he beat Nate, I thought he'd go back to featherweight. But instead the Eddie fight was announced. It felt forced and random. Same vibe. It's just a bullshit excuse for Izzy to become double champ. Izzy vs Jones imo is better. It means more, Jones is a better fighter and if he wins he can then go on and challenge the winner of Glover vs Jan. Lastly the reason people will think he's a weak champ, which isn't true per se, is that, as i mentioned earlier, stylistically, he doesn't pose a threat to Izzy, at least in the striking realm of things. So it's all just weird and imo misguided.

I’ll answer all that when i’m on the toilet. Sheesh, how do people complain about essay word count yet come here unfolding novelettes.

 

[KillerIsBack V2]

What does Jacare not getting a title shot have to do with Jan??? Extremely weak argument there. Besides Jacare was the one stalling in their fight.

And you are ridiculous to claim Griffin is a better striker. Bisping may beat a bit more technical in some aspects but he never got the consistent results Jan has been getting. When have you ever seen Bisping landing vicious body kicks like Jan vs Reyes.

Stop the bullshit you are speaking. The main person trying to discredit the merit of this fight is YOU. Smh, Forest a better striker, GTFO
I hope you were joking.

... wow the blind fandom is worse than I thought.. the fuck has Jan ever done to deserve all this praise. That belt is paper, other have done more than him and not hold any belt is my argument. Thats why i mentioned jacare.