Do you actually believe this was unintentional?

[Aurelian]

Who is weeping?

This was a perfect result for me.
I would have missed the fight working on Saturday.


This was absolutely best case scenario for me.

It's not really about the eyepoke.

It's a battle of fanbases talking shit to each other. Keep that in mind when reading this kindergarten grade discussion surrounding the fight.

 

[jeff7b9]

Why can't we find some middle ground. You guys have to admit that Gane looked WAY better than people thought he would(most people thought it would be an aspinall first round finish) . Aspinalls vision was impaired. There will be a rematch.

Gane looked great.

That sucked.

Tom was under no obligation to fight compromised because Gane can't follow the rules.

Run it back.

People trying to talk and act tough about another man getting a finger jammed in his eye are fucking idiots.


All of the above.

 

[WoozyFailGuy]

No but the framing it as intentional rather than an accident is what I'm disputing.

Gane fouls in almost every fight he is in, it isn't a stretch to call him a dirty fighter. JDS called him dirty, Jon Jones said Gane was a dirty fighter, Jon of all people.

Gane has hit Tuivasa in the back of the head, kick Jones in the dick, pawed at Tom's eye a minute before the poke, gouged Tom's eye, elbowed JDS in the back of the head.

Gane is at the very least on the border of being a dirty fighter, it isn't controversial and has been said by multiple fighters he's faced.

 

[Aurelian]

Gane fouls in almost every fight he is in, it isn't a stretch to call him a dirty fighter. JDS called him dirty, Jon Jones said Gane was a dirty fighter, Jon of all people.

Gane has hit Tuivasa in the back of the head, kick Jones in the dick, pawed at Tom's eye a minute before the poke, gouged Tom's eye, elbowed JDS in the back of the head.

Gane is at the very least on the border of being a dirty fighter, it isn't controversial and has been said by multiple fighters he's faced.

I definitely agree Gane is a dirty fighter. It's not hard to picture this as being intentional.

But looking at it, and taking in the context that what you're seeing in that gif is commonly taught on some kicking techniques in Muay Thai, it's not hard to label it as probably an accident and not intentional. He intentionally used a technique, but the eyepoke itself was probably accidental.

 

[Fedorgasm]

From what I understand, fights that end due to illegal moves should end in a DQ. But it seems they just decide randomly if it should be DQ or a NC?

Is there any pattern or logic to this?

If it comes to intention, you can claim anything to be unintentional.

Kick to the nuts - just wanted to tickle his nuts with my toes...
Punch to the back of the head - just want to make sure he was awake...
Eye poke - just wanted to see how far he was...

Agreed. Maybe harder penalties for things that couldn't possibly be unintentional, like biting, but things that could maybe be accidental, like headbutts, still need to be penalized at least a point.

Because it's too easy to commit a foul and make it look accidental. I mean Gane's poke looked accidental but when you see that he was swiping Tom's eyes a few other times, it certainly looks like he was trying to create an "accidental" poke

 

[WoozyFailGuy]

I definitely agree Gane is a dirty fighter. It's not hard to picture this as being intentional.

But looking at it, and taking in the context that what you're seeing in that gif is commonly taught on some kicking techniques in Muay Thai, it's not hard to label it as probably an accident and not intentional. He intentionally used a technique, but the eyepoke itself was probably accidental.

When a fighter has a history of committing fouls, commits this foul, and the minute before that foul he was pawing the same way with his hand up but fingers curled forward?
Hard not to call it intentional.
Benefit of the doubt, Hanlon's razor and all that, but I personally think Gane does this shit on purpose.

Most Aspinall fights end up in 1-2 minutes, going 4:30 minutes with him and winning has to mean something.

Outside of Gane's very first strike to Tom's nose, the round was even.
I picked Tom by TKO in round 2 expecting Gane to look good in round 1.

The issue with your logic is that is just further elevates Tom, even from a haters standpoint.

A guy surviving two minutes is now something we measure as impressive? In a title fight? Where the guy then immediately fouls and ends a title fight in a NC for the first time in history?

If that's the way we're going, then why the fuck is Gane in a title fight at all?

 

[Aurelian]

When a fighter has a history of committing fouls, commits this foul, and the minute before that foul he was pawing the same way with his hand up but fingers curled forward?
Hard not to call it intentional.
Benefit of the doubt, Hanlon's razor and all that, but I personally think Gane does this shit on purpose.

Fair, but I don't think usually when you're intentionally committing fouls you're in the process of throwing a kick at the same time.

 

[WoozyFailGuy]

Fair, but I don't think usually when you're intentionally committing fouls you're in the process of throwing a kick at the same time.

Well, it seems like a great way to hide it, isn't it, since you're expecting your opponent to close distance on a kick?
Just hypothetically thinking "How would i poke a guys eyes and make sure it seems accidental?"
First thing I think is he would have to be coming in to me. If you're moving forward poking, that shit would be obvious from a mile.

 

[Aurelian]

Well, it seems like a great way to hide it, isn't it, since you're expecting your opponent to close distance on a kick?
Just hypothetically thinking "How would i poke a guys eyes and make sure it seems accidental?"
First thing I think is he would have to be coming in to me. If you're moving forward poking, that shit would be obvious from a mile.

It kind of seems like you're forcing your opponent to defend the hand coming at your face or the kick coming at your ribs. I'm not an expert though so don't take me serious. Tom defended the kick. But I'm quite certain in this moment Gane was focused on the kick instead of thinking hey I'm going to rake this guy's eyes out.

 

[fractal]

Gane was winning in my opinion so hard to see why he would intentionally cause the foul.

He didn't expect the fight to get stopped. I believe he understood what he was doing and figured a small poke here and there will be ignored, given a warning, or worst case lead to a point deduction.
It's also the threat of a poke that prevents the opponent from moving forward freely. Jones started this, and due to the lack of penalties fighters understand they can get away with this.

 

[WoozyFailGuy]

It kind of seems like you're forcing your opponent to defend the hand coming at your face or the kick coming at your ribs. I'm not an expert though so don't take me serious. Tom defended the kick. But I'm quite certain in this moment Gane was focused on the kick instead of thinking hey I'm going to rake this guy's out.

Fair, only Gane really knows. End of the day, might just be an issue with the gym and not Ciryl himself.

 

[fractal]

It kind of seems like you're forcing your opponent to defend the hand coming at your face or the kick coming at your ribs. I'm not an expert though so don't take me serious. Tom defended the kick. But I'm quite certain in this moment Gane was focused on the kick instead of thinking hey I'm going to rake this guy's out.

I'd understand if he was new to the sport, but given his experience I'll be surprised if he is not able to process what his leg and hand are doing simultaneously.

And if that was a punch I'd understand his opponent needing to defend it. But they shouldn't have to defend against eyepokes.

 

[jitzmonkey]

While he didn’t have a long career, his combat base is Muay Thai.
An open gloved push or face mushing action from the lead hand is a common tactic.

Definitely needs to be more cautious in MMA; but..,

 

[Chagaev]

If this were a punch instead of fingers to the face, would there even be a question about intent?

 

[fractal]

Fair, only Gane really knows. End of the day, might just be an issue with the gym and not Ciryl himself.

I'd blame both the gym and the fighters, unless the fighters are amateurs and don't know any better. This just seems like a case of weaponized ignorance.

 

[Caio]

Intentional of course. I rewatched and he tried the same thing before, feint a mid kick and hand in the face. It should've been a DQ.

 

[WoozyFailGuy]

I'd blame both the gym and the fighters, unless the fighters are amateurs and don't know any better. This just seems like a case of weaponized ignorance.

Yea, if you can't understand how not to foul you maybe shouldn't be on your third title fight.

 

[fractal]

Yea, if you can't understand how not to foul you maybe shouldn't be on your third title fight.

I don't get how people are using Gane's incompetence to execute a basic move as an excuse to justify the foul.

It's like excusing someone who didn't know how to reverse a car, but letting them drive anyway.

 

[wrb]

Somebody who fights: Would you practice with someone who was using his fingers and coming forward like Gane was ? Would a coach allow a 4 time contender to continue this "habit" if it was something he picked up when he was younger, I imagine it would be a massive priority to make the fighter stop.? Did this even happen on the contender this year, it seems like the fighters are too afraid of doing fouls so they just don't do them?

 

[Bagatur]

His hand had no business being in Tom's face with fingers outstretched. This was 100% intentional. Gane is a dirty fighter.