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Cuban Boxing Fundamentals

Discussion in 'Standup Technique' started by AndyMaBobs, Jun 12, 2018.

  1. Dexter Orange Belt

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    As I wrote earlier, the Soviet boxing school is very prone to standardization in the development of technical actions. If you remember, it was in this that Soviet specialists helped the Cubans during the formation of their amateur boxing school. Therefore, Lucas, yes, this is indeed one of the standard elements. Soviet boxing school = standard base for all + individualization (selection) based on this base. Each novice boxer studies side-steps, but the fighter decides whether or not to use them in bouts, based on individual preferences or personal style.

    It's the basic/main movement style in soviet school, called "chelnok".
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2019
  2. Dexter Orange Belt

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    Russian national team 19-22







     
  3. colby25 Brown Belt

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    100% agree. Bumping an old message/thread.

    But I came from an MMA gym - coach was a boxer and probably pretty well known striker in these forums and we use to try and kill each other all the time. We had a guy from Team Quest come out to visit and he said he'd never come back to spar and spar too hard. I laughed it off...but 10 years later I see the point.

    I do believe you can learn just as much if not more from flow sparring. I think hard sparring is necessary if you want to compete but not in the amount/doses the U.S. tends to do it at. Robbie Lawler went yeaaaars without sparring he claims and seems to have improved and come back and win the WW champ. I think once you know how to respond under pressure from fighting then necessity of hard sparring is taken away- personally.

    My .02 cents and if I could go back and change one thing that would have been it.
     
  4. Dexter Orange Belt

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    We have exactly the same situation in Russia with some thai-boxing gyms. Several clubs in each city have very bad reputation based on sparrings 101%. If I go to spar there, I am preparing in advance for the fact that it will not be sparring, but a slaughter, as in competitions.
     
  5. Beijing Power Yellow Belt

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    The education system in general.

    Unfortunately, I don't have any experience with the govn't sponsored sports. But from appearances, they are doing pretty great in certain Olympic sports. It would be a cool thing to study for sure.
     
  6. Dexter Orange Belt

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    RBNT 19-22

     
  7. TeeVeee com Yellow Belt

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    Tried a hook palm down like the Cubans the other day and I guess from never trying before, I landed funny and it did not feel good at all on my wrist.
     
  8. Sinister Doctor of Doom Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Its not palm down, its knuckle first.
     
  9. Dexter Orange Belt

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    I don’t know whether the topic of the position of the fist during a hook was discussed in English-speaking forums as often as in Russian-speaking forums (but judging by the fact that we have practically the same topics in the "practice" sections, I think that it WAS discussed <45>), therefore, I will omit the arguments and proceed to the conclusion of the collective mind of the eastern bloc fighters (of course, there were some renegades, but their miserable opinions will not be taken into account <{silvanormal}>):

    - for boxing-style gloves - best variant of hook is with vertical fist aka "mug" or "glass" (this approach is characteristic of the Western boxing school and some Soviet schools (for example, from Leningrad/Saint-Petersburg). This position of the fist provides maximum structural rigidity upon impact, the fighter spends less effort due to the lack of the need to twist the fist, less risk of damage to the thumb. Thus, this option can be recommended as standard for training beginners, and horizontal position - only as an option for some types of hooks.



    - for mma-type gloves/bareknuckle - inverted fist as in old-school bareknuckle boxing, lethwei and some self-defense systems. The greatest safety for the striker in terms of "fist safety":



    1:32 by Dave Leduc


    P.S. Guys, i have some PMs from you. The answer for your questions is very straightforward - such excessive attention to the structuring of material in the Soviet school of boxing was caused by the fact that boxing was considered primarily a mass sport for workers and army sport groups (youth 18–20 years old), so the training was "chewed" as much as possible so that they will easier and faster understood the material being studied, even if the coach is not very good or educated (village club, army garrison in the ass of the world and so on).
    Roughly speaking, unlike Western boxing schools, when a person moved to another city and went to the local boxing gym, he could be sure that his new trainer would give him exactly the knowledge that he needed depending on his level - the whole sequence of presentation of material was clearly and
    diligently spelled out "by weeks" in numerous textbooks, brochures and manuals. This is an excellent approach specifically for mass sports, in contrast to sports of the highest achievements, where the main emphasis is on the individualization of the training approach.

    P.P.S. I am wondering - an exercise with a tire in which both fighters put their front leg in and start practicing inside fighting (like in the movie Creed 2), is a standard for western boxing? I saw this drill in Thai, and in some YT videos.

    We have a slightly different option called “gypsy boxing”:



    or we tie the fighters to each other with belt so as not to let them break the distance.
     
  10. Dexter Orange Belt

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    One-two

     
  11. kenji goh Blue Belt

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    You said that he is Isaev's student right?
    This style of punching that he and Frolov teach is advanced stuff in the soviet boxing curriculum?
    In the training videos you posted of the Russian national team most guys don't move and punch like that. They punched more like the boxers in the fighting anatomy channel I posted in the previous page.
    Is Isaev's style more old school and now gradually becoming more rare to find people teaching it
    like it's happening with some old school styles in the west?
     
  12. Lucas Coradini Blue Belt Professional Fighter

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    Another thing about hand position on the hook is that tipically we are stronger in anatomical position, so if aiming for power I would say palm facing in.

    But since in boxing nothing is as black and white regarding technique, I would also say to practice both. Palm facing down or out is very effective and maybe more deceptive.
     
  13. Lucas Coradini Blue Belt Professional Fighter

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    I also want to share this brazillian channel called Ciência do Boxe (Boxing Science or Science of Boxing) with you all. This dude went to college in Cuba and specialized in boxing. I reached him offering to translate his content to english but so far he didn't answered.
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6y2zj8iHJ4FeFoB6HBucpQ
    Here's his tutorial on the hook


    There are lots of good content on his channel, all in portuguese, though. He goes about technique, tactics, periodization, physical prep and so on. If there's any particular video any of you would like me to translate I can work on that​
     
  14. Dexter Orange Belt

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    He WAS Isaev's student, yes, but what he teaches on YT is his OWN interpretation of Nikolai Petrovich style :). Isaev is quiet unique.

    If we speak about russian school in soviet boxing, it has two main variations: majority - the way the guys in Fighting Anatomy channel do, minority - like in Frolov's school.
    For example, the boxing team of my university, in which I trained in my youth as amateur, was taught by two regular coaches - the first (the one that lived in Cuba) was a tall light heavyweight , he gave boxing in the spirit of the Frolov school; the second was a short and stocky middleweight, he was more inclined to all kinds of ducking, pivoting, slipping etc. Since with a weight of 62 kg I was 180 cm tall, all my opponents in a weight category 63.5 kg were much shorter, but more powerfully build, so willy-nilly, I developed primarily straight punches, uppercuts, and work on counter-attacks as a "second number ". My other colleagues also took from our trainers what suited them best.

    Thank you very much for sharing, Lucas. Lots of interesting content by this guy!
     
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2019
  15. Sinister Doctor of Doom Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Theres also this shitty old video by some clown in Vegas, hooks are covered:

     
  16. spacetime Yellow Card Yellow Card

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    I don't get this. You use a thumb attachement of some sorts in gloves anyway, so why do you emphasize bare knuckle configurations? Even elite boxers do all kinds of sloppy things shadow boxing (tweak their joints, half open fist, etc.
     
  17. Sinister Doctor of Doom Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    I dunno
     
  18. spacetime Yellow Card Yellow Card

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    This aint pretty but I wouldn't tell him _20191213_235739.JPG
     
  19. Dexter Orange Belt

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    Quod licet lovi, non licet bovi :). For regular guys good form and technique are a must.
     
  20. Dexter Orange Belt

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    Some hobbyists... from Moscow...
     

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