Cuban Boxing Fundamentals

[Dexter]

i never liked the european style of punching doesnt seem to flow as well as the western way like we do in the states where we are more out of a hunch than standing tall

On the expanses of the former USSR there are many different schools, each of which has its own way of punching/footwork/stance/etc. Germany, UK - all have their distinctive approach to boxing. So there is no such thing as “European style of punching”. Or you don’t consider these countries as Europe?

 

[tekkenfan]

On the expanses of the former USSR there are many different schools, each of which has its own way of punching/footwork/stance/etc. Germany, UK - all have their distinctive approach to boxing. So there is no such thing as “European style of punching”. Or you don’t consider these countries as Europe?

i went to ireland in 2012 was coaching at a mma gym and thats when i noticed the way people boxed was much different than the us i think austrailias style is the closest resembling the way we do in the us

 

[Reyesnuthugr]

On the expanses of the former USSR there are many different schools, each of which has its own way of punching/footwork/stance/etc. Germany, UK - all have their distinctive approach to boxing. So there is no such thing as “European style of punching”. Or you don’t consider these countries as Europe?

It refers more to Western Europe, where they may have some different trainers and methods but as a whole, they are used to fighting mostly each other, and retain a lot of the same idiosyncrasies (Even Eastern Europe)-- they don't do certain things the US does and vice versa. They DO tend to stand up a lot straighter in most of Europe. The US likes to crouch more. Mexico REALLY likes to hunch over because they like to fight in close and do shots to the body.

The US has always been situated directly above Mexico and it has had a large impact on how we fight (among other things). We don't fight exactly like them but we do incorporate and focus on things that Europe doesn't, as a result. The US tends to fight and train somewhat as a hybrid style between Europe and the Spanish Colonies, but that's a gross oversimplification. There definitely are differences by region, even noticeable by large, generalized regions.

 

[Sinister]

^The athleticism of black men changed how we fight. And I don't think anyone has yet to translate it into a workable style that makes anyone who learns it savvy. Roy Jones Sr. Was trying to, D'Amato as well. They'd never say that's what they were trying to do because I dont think they were conscious of it. But that's what they were working with.

 

[SandisLL]

D'Amato

I maybe wrong but I think his style was good for athletes that have fast muscles in legs, ass and spine & core.
Prime Tyson before fired coaches and chaged them, was enough mobile even for modern CW.
Later he wasn't able to close distance at previous speed and change angles that fast.
Anyone is able to evalue his speed in 1987, 1988 and compare with later bouts…

Or Gerald year before bout with Nigel and bout with Nigel.
Nigel didn't handled out full possible extension in famous uppercut. I think just cos he wasn't that evil.
Because anyone with mediocre training ( non pro ) was able to" lift" it 1 - 1, 5 inches more. Nigel had reserve to do it too.

Cardio too, rare athletes have amazing cardio, I think this is partially determined by genetics too, so called God's gift.

 

[RabbitPunch36]

I doubt Nigel Benn was showing any mercy to Gerald in the fight of his life.

 

[kenji goh]

^The athleticism of black men changed how we fight. And I don't think anyone has yet to translate it into a workable style that makes anyone who learns it savvy. Roy Jones Sr. Was trying to, D'Amato as well. They'd never say that's what they were trying to do because I dont think they were conscious of it. But that's what they were working with.

There is also the other side of the coin. The technique that also makes USA boxing unique right?
You can't find people with the defence of Floyd, Toney, Benton in Europe. Maybe in Latin America,
but again not the same built-in stance layered defence.

 

[Sinister]

There is also the other side of the coin. The technique that also makes USA boxing unique right?
You can't find people with the defence of Floyd, Toney, Benton in Europe. Maybe in Latin America,
but again not the same built-in stance layered defence.

That is waning, or has waned. No one looks like anyone like that anymore

 

[RabbitPunch36]

^The athleticism of black men changed how we fight. And I don't think anyone has yet to translate it into a workable style that makes anyone who learns it savvy. Roy Jones Sr. Was trying to, D'Amato as well. They'd never say that's what they were trying to do because I dont think they were conscious of it. But that's what they were working with.

Interesting I think I understand what your saying but I am not 100 percent sure. Are you saying Black fighters like Ray Robinson, Jersey Joe, Charley Burley, Joe Gans, Roy Jones Jr, Joe Louis, Jack Blackburn, Mike Tyson, etc influenced boxing to be more dynamic and that trainers have struggled to replicate this type of style of boxing with all athletes? Also it seems like hyper athletic men like Shane Mosley and Terry Norris struggled mightly to box defensively without sacrificing offense againest elite fighters unlike the boxers I mentioned earlier. Do you think Brendan Ingle was doing the same thing as Roy Jones Sr and Cus D'Amato?

 

[tekkenfan]

^The athleticism of black men changed how we fight. And I don't think anyone has yet to translate it into a workable style that makes anyone who learns it savvy. Roy Jones Sr. Was trying to, D'Amato as well. They'd never say that's what they were trying to do because I dont think they were conscious of it. But that's what they were working with.

i do agree kinda hard to say cause people r such pussie sin 2019 but yeah black fighters do fight dif from white fighters same with emxican we all have different attributes id say most white fighters fight more like aussies do from what i seen

i much prefer the american style i feel its the most fundamentally sound the way the punches flow

 

[Sinister]

Interesting I think I understand what your saying but I am not 100 percent sure. Are you saying Black fighters like Ray Robinson, Jersey Joe, Charley Burley, Joe Gans, Roy Jones Jr, Joe Louis, Jack Blackburn, Mike Tyson, etc influenced boxing to be more dynamic and that trainers have struggled to replicate this type of style of boxing with all athletes? Also it seems like hyper athletic men like Shane Mosley and Terry Norris struggled mightly to box defensively without sacrificing offense againest elite fighters unlike the boxers I mentioned earlier. Do you think Brendan Ingle was doing the same thing as Roy Jones Sr and Cus D'Amato?

I'm not sure if I'd include the elder fighters because their skill had systemic integrity. They were taught systems and I dont think their specific systems catered more to athleticism than technical ability. In other words they didnt depend solely on how fast or hard they could do a thing, but how good they could. As time progressed and many instructors died without passing on HOW to teach what they knew, something had to be substituted.

I dont think Ingle was doing the same thing because he wasnt working with the same pool of potential fighters. Though it is interesting that aside from Naseem Hamed, his most notable fighters are black or mixed. Or I should say that if that's what Ingle was doing, he was even less aware of it than coaches in the States who particularly value black and Hispanic fighters as a priority.

The main reason I dont have this specific problem is because I attract pretty much everybody. So I've already had a couple white kids who could scrap and the foundation of my instructing included them, it wasnt just full of athletic black kids or tough kids of Mexican heritage. Plus I factored the Scandinavians I worked with. This isn't a thing that happens specifically on purpose due to prejudice or racism (though I have seen a lot of that)...its more of like a product of where you are and who wants to box. It's easy for a teaching method to become favorable to a small demographic

 

[Sinister]

i do agree kinda hard to say cause people r such pussie sin 2019 but yeah black fighters do fight dif from white fighters same with emxican we all have different attributes id say most white fighters fight more like aussies do from what i seen

i much prefer the american style i feel its the most fundamentally sound the way the punches flow

Then why aren't we winning Gold medals anymore?

Even when our fighters make it to the World Level as amateurs, they're inconsistent at best. It didnt used to be like this, and it's not improving. All that's happening is kids are more apt to turn Pro without much world level amateur experience.

 

[pwforgotlolol]

Then why aren't we winning Gold medals anymore?

Even when our fighters make it to the World Level as amateurs, they're inconsistent at best. It didnt used to be like this, and it's not improving. All that's happening is kids are more apt to turn Pro without much world level amateur experience.

deontay wilder was americas last great hope

 

[patos]

Then why aren't we winning Gold medals anymore?

Even when our fighters make it to the World Level as amateurs, they're inconsistent at best. It didnt used to be like this, and it's not improving. All that's happening is kids are more apt to turn Pro without much world level amateur experience.

Do you feel like this could also have to do with culture in addition to the coaching? I've heard in the US everybody spars really hard and that it's the bulk of their technical work. I would imagine in the shorter term (say, first couple years) this would make you way better way faster, but development would fall off later on compared to elsewhere in the world who, I imagine, do a lot more controlled contact drills and/or lighter sparring and have room to experiment and to practice things that they fail alot with until they get it right, instead of just trying to survive by spamming the things you're already good at all the time. Plus I imagine it would give a shorter career hence why Americans rush to turn pro (just speculating).

I mean, I know nothing about boxing really, I'm just curious what more qualified people's opinions are on this thought.

 

[tekkenfan]

Then why aren't we winning Gold medals anymore?

Even when our fighters make it to the World Level as amateurs, they're inconsistent at best. It didnt used to be like this, and it's not improving. All that's happening is kids are more apt to turn Pro without much world level amateur experience.

i feel our style is more geared towards professional boxing tbh i dont know the ins and outs but lots of countries do well in the amateur scene but not in the pro scene usa seems to dominate in the pro scene even though yes we do host the major fights here but still

 

[Sinister]

i feel our style is more geared towards professional boxing tbh i dont know the ins and outs but lots of countries do well in the amateur scene but not in the pro scene usa seems to dominate in the pro scene even though yes we do host the major fights here but still

Flooding the Pro ranks, and dominating the Pro ranks are two different things. Right now Wilder is one of our most dominant Americans, also happens to be one of the last ones to win an Olympic medal, same with Ward. Who else is there? Crawford is one. Then theres, what...you gonna say Spence? Considering he struggled against Porter I'm not so sure, and I thought Porter lost to Ugas. Charlo Brothers? Eh, I thought they both showed they weren't killers against Harrison and Korobov and Korobov is an old version of himself.

The Eastern Bloc is flooding the Pro ranks right this second. Every division just about has at least one that people cant beat, or dont want to fight at all.

 

[Sinister]

Do you feel like this could also have to do with culture in addition to the coaching? I've heard in the US everybody spars really hard and that it's the bulk of their technical work. I would imagine in the shorter term (say, first couple years) this would make you way better way faster, but development would fall off later on compared to elsewhere in the world who, I imagine, do a lot more controlled contact drills and/or lighter sparring and have room to experiment and to practice things that they fail alot with until they get it right, instead of just trying to survive by spamming the things you're already good at all the time. Plus I imagine it would give a shorter career hence why Americans rush to turn pro (just speculating).

I mean, I know nothing about boxing really, I'm just curious what more qualified people's opinions are on this thought.

Something like that. Those are all factors, but the heart of it is industry greed. Rushing fighters is all about people who want to make money off their blood.

 

[tekkenfan]

Flooding the Pro ranks, and dominating the Pro ranks are two different things. Right now Wilder is one of our most dominant Americans, also happens to be one of the last ones to win an Olympic medal, same with Ward. Who else is there? Crawford is one. Then theres, what...you gonna say Spence? Considering he struggled against Porter I'm not so sure, and I thought Porter lost to Ugas. Charlo Brothers? Eh, I thought they both showed they weren't killers against Harrison and Korobov and Korobov is an old version of himself.

The Eastern Bloc is flooding the Pro ranks right this second. Every division just about has at least one that people cant beat, or dont want to fight at all.

tbh i havent really paid much attention at all to boxing for last 8 years or so i feel that its not near as popular with kids getting into it as it once was also with competition with mma today the gym i came up in with open over 70 years is dead practically now than what it was a decade ago for example kids today just dont wana get into it unless its their father who coaches them from what i see

 

[pwforgotlolol]

tbh i havent really paid much attention at all to boxing for last 8 years or so i feel that its not near as popular with kids getting into it as it once was also with competition with mma today the gym i came up in with open over 70 years is dead practically now than what it was a decade ago for example kids today just dont wana get into it unless its their father who coaches them from what i see

are you from us? not surprised.

world wide its still big. not as big as prime boxing, but still ridiculous big.

 

[Sinister]

tbh i havent really paid much attention at all to boxing for last 8 years or so i feel that its not near as popular with kids getting into it as it once was also with competition with mma today the gym i came up in with open over 70 years is dead practically now than what it was a decade ago for example kids today just dont wana get into it unless its their father who coaches them from what i see

Greed, laziness, and sub-par practices make for a struggle of industry. Boxing is like old shopping malls, impressive to look at but failed to update the experience to make it palatable for generations riddled with convenience and laziness, which foster much more the desire to pretend to know how to fight as opposed to actually fighting. And competing with MMA as opposed to capitalizing on the increased need for fighting with the hands.

The market changes, but boxing is populated by people whose mantra is resistance to change.