Movies AVENGERS: INFINITY WAR v.12

[LuchaBear]

If Vision is indeed sentient then you can assume he has developed an appreciation for his existence. So anything that threatens his existence could be construed as fear to him and felt as something akin to pain.

Mr Data used to explain this that while he was not afraid per se, he did not want to die or cease to exist.

Remember when Vision took Ultron off the internet, had an orgasm and then passed out right in the middle of a huge battle?

Something's not right with this weirdo

 

[KnightTemplar]

Ok now this I now for certain is incorrect. In the comic it is specifically mentioned that after the Soviets found him they checked his blood for the serum, he didn't have any, and they didn't have any to give to him.


Looking young comes from having been frozen for many years.

edit: the most concrete information is that he was given unspecified "treatments", not sure who stated this in the movies. Not the super serum though, because they didn't have any. The combination of training, the arm, and whatever these "treatments" are was meant to pick him on the same level as Captain.

Here's a good post about it I found.

"Buckys case is very unique and interesting. But in most cases it can be broken down simply. In comics bucky is peak human and his metal arm solely gives him superhuman strength. In the MCU the dynamic is actually quite similar. He is enhanced to some extent but his metal arm is stronger than the rest of his body.

Unlike what many people say Bucky did not receive a recreation of the super soldier formula. In fact it's left very vague what happened to him that enhanced him. We just know that the experiments allowed him to survive the fall in the first movie at the cost of his arm. And afforded him some degree of superhuman strength and ability.

Shown here when he manages to evade a car and drop down from an incredible height without damage:

Aside from that buckys arm itself is incredibly strong even vastly stronger than both of caps arms. Shown here where buckys arm overpowered Steve with little to no difficulty

Aside from that Steve is incredibly strong too and was able to curl a helicopter.

So in summary, yes bucky’s physicality is similar to that of steve’s but his arm is greatly stronger."

When Bucky was captured by Hydra, Zola experimented on him by injecting him with his version of the Super Soldier Serum. While not as powerful as the serum that gave Cap his powers, it still boosted Bucky's strength and durability to the point where he could survive the fall into the river Cap thought killed him. Albeit at the cost of his arm.

After being recovered by Hydra, Zola continued to experiment on him, including enhancing his strength, speed, stamina and durability until they were low Superhuman. Not quite as powerful as Cap(apart from his metal arm, which is actually more powerful)but still much stronger, faster and tougher than any human.

 

[LuchaBear]

I didn't read the comic Pride mentions, here, but I think many viewers are overlooking the rock-paper-scissors dimension of the MCU that is always at play.

For example, in the forest of Sokovia, where he destroys Ultron, what does he use? He focuses the power of the mind stone. Ultron is a computer. The rest of the Avengers struggled greatly against Ultron, obviously, but being the synergy of pure synthetic algorithm, what defense did Ultron have against Vision and the Mind Stone? Vision literally unraveled him in a moment; because that's all Ultron was. He had no flesh, no conscience, no soul. It was like The Matrix. We were little more than a virus to him, but ironically, he was little more than a virus himself to Vision, so destroying him was little different than zapping a computer virus. He may have been overwhelmingly powerful, but he was also overwhelmingly one-dimensional.

Thanos suffers no such weakness.

Yes, he does.

He jumps off a bridge and lands over three stories below on the top of a car like he was hopping off a curb. A normal human being cannot sustain a fall like that. Remember the first time Cap throws his shield at him not knowing it's Bucky after chasing him across the rooftops following Bucky's assassination attempt on Fury? That shield throw would have cut the normal human in half. That's like catching a bullet the size of a sled. Your arm doesn't absorb that force. He throws the shield himself so hard at Cap at one point that when it misses it lodges itself halfway into a nearby Van. He knocks Captain America around. He clearly has super strength. He also has super durability. He takes shots from Captain America that would kill the normal man (ex. running knee to the chest into that van).

Where in the hell do you get these ideas? They make his extraordinary strength and durability so obvious.

I think it's because ever since being on the good side, they haven't shown much of his enhancements. He's just another dude.

 

[LuchaBear]

Yeah although they didn't explain well WHY he is as strong and durable as Cap, I felt like every single time he appeared it was made quite clear he is on that level.

They both need to hit the gym and do a weight lifting competition. This is the only way we can really know.

 

[KnightTemplar]

They both need to hit the gym and do a weight lifting competition. This is the only way we can really know.

Wouldn't work. Cap lifts Raw, Bucky uses Gear

 

[LuchaBear]

@chickenluver

http://marvelcinematicuniverse.wikia.com/wiki/Winter_Soldier

Artificially Enhanced Physiology: Barnes was one of many prisoners of war used in Zola's quest to recreate the Super Soldier Serum and received an alternate formula variation. There were no apparent effects at the time of his rescue by Steve Rogers, but the changes brought on Barnes' body were sufficient to let him survive plunging into an icy river at the bottom of a fall that should have killed him. Zola further refined Barnes' body in the Winter Soldier Program, ultimately creating an enhanced soldier with physical abilities equal to the Captain America, and without mental enhancements or psychological instabilities which continue to plague similar programs into the 21st century. Like Captain America he too has early levels of superhuman conditioning, due to his Super-Soldier physiology.

• Enhanced Strength: As the Winter Soldier, Barnes's physical strength is immensely enhanced to the early levels of superhuman condition by a series of treatments performed on him by HYDRAscientists. He has used his legs and right arm to strike enemies with tremendous force and his physical might is easily on par with Captain America.
  • Bionic Arm: HYDRA also removed the remnants of his severed left arm and replaced the missing limb with a cybernetic one. The bionic arm gives him extraordinary superhuman strength superior equal to that of Captain America, though not quite on par with that of Spider-Man. Winter Soldier was able to rip open a S.H.I.E.L.D armored SUV, rip apart Falcon's EXO-7 suit, and smash concrete by punching it. With his bionic arm supporting his already enhanced natural strength, the Winter Soldier was shown to be able to overpower Captain America in a fight.
• Enhanced Durability: Winter Soldier's bones and muscles are apparently vastly denser and more resilient than a normal human's. He even managed to survive a fatal fall from immense heights into Daube River in the Swiss Alps. Arnim Zola's further experiments greatly fortified his physique to the extent that he routinely leaps from significant heights onto hard surfaces and lands without any apparent injury.
• Enhanced Speed: Winter Soldier's speed is tremendously enhanced beyond the peak of human potential, moving into the early levels of superhuman condition. Bucky's speed is equal to both Black Panther and Captain America, as he was able to stay ahead of them with a slight head start. In combat, he can easily keep up with the extremely agile Black Widow and Black Panther.
• Enhanced Agility: Winter Soldier's vastly enhanced agility is superior to even Olympic gold medalists. He could quickly leap on top of midsize cars in a single bound and do complicated acrobatic flips to avoid gunfire into cover.
• Enhanced Stamina: Winter Soldier's musculature produces far less fatigue toxins during physical activity than the musculature of an ordinary human, allowing him to exert himself at peak capacity for hours before tiring. Hence, he could endure the Clash of the Avengers and the later showdown at the HYDRA Research Base without showing signs of fatigue.
• Enhanced Reflexes: Winter Soldier's reflexes are enhanced to extraordinary levels. His reflexes are responsive enough to catch Captain America's shield being thrown at him at a high velocity. He was also able to catch enemy grenades thrown at him, dodge fire from Falcon's Steyr SPPs, and leap on top of a moving car accelerating towards him with pinpoint accuracy.
• Regenerative Healing Factor: Winter Soldier's body is able to heal with extraordinary speed and efficiency, that are beyond of a regular human being, though he is unable to regenerate missing limbs. This may be one of the factors of his survival from the Swiss Alps. Also, the injuries he had received during his battle with Iron Man healed in a matter of days without bruises or scars.

So Zola did pretty much create an identical serum like Cap's and he made it around the same time.

This makes Cap's serum not as special anymore.

 

[KnightTemplar]

So Zola did pretty much create an identical serum like Cap's and he made it around the same time.

This makes Cap's serum not as special anymore.

As I understand it, Zola's serum wasn't quite as effective as Erskine's, but still good enough to make Bucky almost as powerful as Cap. Hydra would later use Zola's Serum to create the Super Soldiers seen in Civil War, but it appears a side-effect was uncontrollable aggression and blood lust, which is why they were frozen in much the same way Bucky was between missions.

 

[Clippy]

I thought Bucky had some kind of enhancements beyond just the arm. I mean, the whole plot of Civil War was that Zemo made them think he was going to wake up five more Buckies minus the arm.

Still say that's the most disappointing ever, it sets up an epic finale

Bucky: There's 5 guys worse than me

OH FUCK!!

Later:

They're all dead and there's some guy hiding being a glass window

Guy: k you guys fight each other now

 

[Mike]

Still say that's the most disappointing ever, it sets up an epic finale

Bucky: There's 5 guys worse than me

OH FUCK!!

Later:

They're all dead and there's some guy hiding being a glass window

Guy: k you guys fight each other now

I liked the ending. "I brought more strong dudez for everyone to punch a lot!" just wouldn't have been interesting imo. Those guys had no development, there would have been very little reason to care. Instead, we get that awesome Cap and WS vs Iron Man fight. That Zemo was very different from comics Zemo, but I liked that for once the plan wasn't to punch the other guy a lot. He had a pretty clever plan to undermine the team from within psychologically, and ultimately he kinda won.

Maybe a unified Avengers actually stop Thanos.

 

[Clippy]

I liked the ending. "I brought more strong dudez for everyone to punch a lot!" just wouldn't have been interesting imo. Those guys had no development, there would have been very little reason to care. Instead, we get that awesome Cap and WS vs Iron Man fight. That Zemo was very different from comics Zemo, but I liked that for once the plan wasn't to punch the other guy a lot. He had a pretty clever plan to undermine the team from within psychologically, and ultimately he kinda won.

Maybe a unified Avengers actually stop Thanos.

I know but it was still cheap and annoying

They set up 5 badass dudes with nothing to do.

Don't do that

I'm also still bitter at the third Lord of the Rings where the evil wreath king or whatever said he would deal with the wizard ... I wanted to see that ... they never fought ... a hobbit and a girl beat him instead???

Don't fuck with me movie!!!

 

[Mike]

I know but it was still cheap and annoying

They set up 5 badass dudes with nothing to do.

Don't do that

I'm also still bitter at the third Lord of the Rings where the evil wreath king or whatever said he would deal with the wizard ... I wanted to see that ... they never fought ... a hobbit and a girl beat him instead???

Don't fuck with me movie!!!

I thought it was cool. It took our expectations, and subverted them. One could say.



And I love LOTR but it's kind of a giant cocktease that you hear over and over how awesome Sauron is, but you never get to see him DO anything. Except one 10 second flashback where he gets owned fighting like a tard.

Sigh.

 

[LuchaBear]

@Clippy

If Cap dies....

Spoiler

WE RIOT!!!

Spoiler

 

[Clippy]

I thought it was cool. It took our expectations, and subverted them. One could say.



And I love LOTR but it's kind of a giant cocktease that you hear over and over how awesome Sauron is, but you never get to see him DO anything. Except one 10 second flashback where he gets owned fighting like a tard.

Sigh.

Yeah even if he got the ring and got physical form someone just has to wildly swing a sword in his general direction and cut his finger off... again

 

[Clippy]

By the way, anyone who thinks The Winter Soldier, a man who can go toe to toe with Captain F'n America and believes Bucky didn't use performance enhancing drugs ... is fuckin stupid

 

[Clippy]

@Clippy

If Cap dies....

Spoiler

WE RIOT!!!

Spoiler

Cap has to die, dude's contract is up and his character arc isn't one that is deserving of a tropical island retirement home. Dude will always want to bang so has to get his candle burnt out.

He's 100% dead

Other chars like Tony stark will live on to enjoy retirement

 

[LuchaBear]

Cap has to die, dude's contract is up and his character arc isn't one that is deserving of a tropical island retirement home. Dude will always want to bang so has to get his candle burnt out.

He's 100% dead

Other chars like Tony stark will live on to enjoy retirement

You don't take on the role of Cap, pull it off perfectly and then just leave after a few films. I still really want to see Cap go on adventures out in space and other planets. Imagine a team up movie with Drax or Rocket, or better yet Dormammu.

This isn't right...

 

[Clippy]

You don't take on the role of Cap, pull it off perfectly and then just leave after a few films. I still really want to see Cap go on adventures out in space and other planets. Imagine a team up movie with Drax or Rocket, or better yet Dormammu.

This isn't right...

These people can't play these roles forever dude

Give it 10 years when the MCU runs out of characters and visits alternate dimensions through Dr. Strange to reintroduce characters with different acters

Kind of like Xmen revamping characters but with alternate dimensions instead of time travel

 

[LuchaBear]

These people can't play these roles forever dude

Give it 10 years when the MCU runs out of characters and visits alternate dimensions through Dr. Strange to reintroduce characters with different acters

Kind of like Xmen revamping characters but with alternate dimensions instead of time travel

Let's blackmail him.

 

[Clippy]

Let's blackmail him.

CHRIS EVANS / CAPTAIN AMERICA FOREVER!!!

 

[LuchaBear]

CHRIS EVANS / CAPTAIN AMERICA FOREVER!!!