International WTF is going on in China?

[Zazen]

I think we have to be honest

In the US, we've had a growing and tremendous wave of anti-intellectualism for some time.

Its distinctly anti-intellectual, anti-science and anti-academia. Almost to a fevered level.


To make it worse our current political party has embolden and promoted anti-intellectualism and anti- education

Trump administration to take steps to defund Education Department​

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-advisers-weigh-plan-dismantle-department-education-wsj-reports-2025-02-03/

And now we're getting rid of the one truly big advantage we had over China and that is immigration. If we keep badmouthing immigrants and scaring them off eventually they'll choose not to come here. China has major demographic problems and despite their progress in the tech field there's a chance that they may never pass us in terms of GDP output. Countries like Japan , South Korea, and China face a lot of the same problems with their declining population. Without immigrants USA would probably be facing the same crisis. I really hope the new administration understands this.

 

[Hdfi]

And now we're getting rid of the one truly big advantage we had over China and that is immigration. If we keep badmouthing immigrants and scaring them off eventually they'll choose not to come here. China has major demographic problems and despite their progress in the tech field there's a chance that they may never pass us in terms of GDP output. Countries like Japan , South Korea, and China face a lot of the same problems with their declining population. Without immigrants USA would probably be facing the same crisis. I really hope the new administration understands this.

The US has worse demographic problems. Not only is your population older on average but you are experiencing ethnic replacement of whites that will result in a majority-minority structure. History shows us that this type of situation is very volatile and dangerous.

 

[Zazen]

The US has worse demographic problems. Not only is your population older on average but you are experiencing ethnic replacement of whites that will result in a majority-minority structure. History shows us that this type of situation is very volatile and dangerous.

I disagree with this. USA is not the same as other nations. Most people that aren't white are still American and identify as such culturally. They speak the same language, celebrate the same holidays, share the same interests, etc. You have more in common with a black American than a white German.

 

[BowserJr]

Last flailing for relevance. Their population is about to fall off a cliff and then they're fucked

 

[nostradumbass]

yeah the western poverty line where you have to pay $1700 a month to live somewhere.

mao inherited a feudalist hyper-capitalist system where might meant right and life was morose for almost everyone in the country. he increased life expectancies by 32 years, increased literacy rates from 20% to 70%+, and increased industrial output by 11%+ year over year for multiple decades with full ownership over means of production for workers. additionally, in the years since, the continual effort of the CCP to put workers first brought the 80% of the population in poverty (after mao's death where previously the number was a good amount better) to a 9% number as of 2011. the number of americans under the poverty line as of 2023 is 11%.

Serve the People: The Eradication of Extreme Poverty in China

This study looks into the process through which China was able to eradicate extreme poverty as a fundamental step in constructing socialism.

thetricontinental.org

National Poverty in America Awareness Month: January 2025

The Current Population Survey Annual Social and Economic Supplement reports the official poverty rate in 2023 was 11.1%, not statistically different from 2022.

www.census.gov

yeah if you believe everything abject retards who wanna steal your money tell you about china, it probably sounds pretty bad.

Yeesh, doesn't sound like you have any idea what you're talking about. China's huge poverty decrease happened after mao died and they had enough sense to start opening up private owenership. It was 70/30 publicly owned, and has inverted to 70/30 privately owned because the publicly owned stagnated while the privately owned continued to grow, which lifted people out of the poverty they were in while Hannibal Lecter was running the country and killing their people. They now have more billionaires than the US.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

Yeesh, doesn't sound like you have any idea what you're talking about. China's huge poverty decrease happened after mao died and they had enough sense to start opening up private owenership. It was 70/30 publicly owned, and has inverted to 70/30 privately owned because the publicly owned stagnated while the privately owned continued to grow, which lifted people out of the poverty they were in while Hannibal Lecter was running the country and killing their people. They now have more billionaires than the US.

and what were the numbers before mao's revolution? lol mao's policies made lifespans and literacy rates skyrocket, and vastly improved the level of poverty in china. yes, the decision to switch from state communism to mostly-state-capitalism has proven fruitful in trade, but raising the value of the yuan and the cost of living (the two biggest factors of that graph) doesn't inherently mean what the graph suggests.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

And now we're getting rid of the one truly big advantage we had over China and that is immigration. If we keep badmouthing immigrants and scaring them off eventually they'll choose not to come here. China has major demographic problems and despite their progress in the tech field there's a chance that they may never pass us in terms of GDP output.

their GDP is growing twice as fast as the US's. 2.5% to 5.2%. i suppose "there's a chance" but not with trump starting a trade war with the rest of NA and leaving a massive trade vacuum to be filled.

 

[nostradumbass]

and what were the numbers before mao's revolution? lol mao's policies made lifespans and literacy rates skyrocket, and vastly improved the level of poverty in china. yes, the decision to switch from state communism to mostly-state-capitalism has proven fruitful in trade, but raising the value of the yuan and the cost of living (the two biggest factors of that graph) doesn't inherently mean what the graph suggests.

You can see the graph, right? If the rural poverty rate was still like 95% after he died, on what grounds would the nearly 30 years he was in charge be considered a success? Lol, he was in charge from the late 40s to the mid 70s. Every country's life expectancy went way up and poverty went way down from the late 40s through the 50s and 60s. In fact, China did worse than the US, Canada and Europe in that time, and China's life expectancy increased more in the 5 years before Mao than it did in the first 15 years of him in charge.

Cool, literacy rates increased at the same time they banned everything but state propaganda. Kind of defeats the purpose of learning to read if everybody is still poor and aren't allowed to read anything, no?

I mean if they were just crushing it, seems a little strange that there would be almost no immigration to China, and tens of millions of Chinese moving basically anywhere else.

 

[nostradumbass]

their GDP is growing twice as fast as the US's. 2.5% to 5.2%. i suppose "there's a chance" but not with trump starting a trade war with the rest of NA and leaving a massive trade vacuum to be filled.

And someone who weighs 600 lbs is losing weight twice as fast as someone with 4% bodyfat. Their GDP per capita is like $12k, the US over $80k.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

You can see the graph, right? If the rural poverty rate was still like 95% after he died,

dude it's based on a fixed rate of $2.15 per day and the graph starts almost 40 years into his reign with no guide on what it was beforehand. that's manipulated stats.

on what grounds would the nearly 30 years he was in charge be considered a success? Lol, he was in charge from the late 40s to the mid 70s.

and yet you post a graph that starts in 1981 and doesn't adjust for inflation lol

Every country's life expectancy went way up and poverty went way down from the late 40s through the 50s and 60s. In fact, China did worse than the US, Canada and Europe in that time, and China's life expectancy increased more in the 5 years before Mao than it did in the first 15 years of him in charge.

this is just blatantly false.

China: life expectancy 1850-2020 Statistic | Statista

Life expectancy in China was just 32 in the year 1850, and over the course of the next 170 years, it is expected to more than double to 76.6 years in 2020.

www.statista.com

China Life Expectancy 1960-2025 | MacroTrends

Life expectancy at birth indicates the number of years a newborn infant would live if prevailing patterns of mortality at the time of its birth were to stay the same throughout its life.

www.macrotrends.net

Cool, literacy rates increased at the same time they banned everything but state propaganda. Kind of defeats the purpose of learning to read if everybody is still poor and aren't allowed to read anything, no?

surely something like that would never happen in the west. oh wait it's been happening constantly since 2012 and the literacy rates dropped by almost 10% from 2020 to 2022.

I mean if they were just crushing it, seems a little strange that there would be almost no immigration to China, and tens of millions of Chinese moving basically anywhere else.

China Immigration Statistics 1960-2025 | MacroTrends

International migrant stock is the number of people born in a country other than that in which they live. It also includes refugees. The data used to estimate the international migrant stock at a particular time are obtained mainly from population censuses. The estimates are derived from the...

www.macrotrends.net

what was that?

 

[nostradumbass]

dude it's based on a fixed rate of $2.15 per day and the graph starts almost 40 years into his reign with no guide on what it was beforehand. that's manipulated stats.

and yet you post a graph that starts in 1981 and doesn't adjust for inflation lol

this is just blatantly false.

China: life expectancy 1850-2020 Statistic | Statista

Life expectancy in China was just 32 in the year 1850, and over the course of the next 170 years, it is expected to more than double to 76.6 years in 2020.

www.statista.com

China Life Expectancy 1960-2025 | MacroTrends

Life expectancy at birth indicates the number of years a newborn infant would live if prevailing patterns of mortality at the time of its birth were to stay the same throughout its life.

www.macrotrends.net

surely something like that would never happen in the west. oh wait it's been happening constantly since 2012 and the literacy rates dropped by almost 10% from 2020 to 2022.

China Immigration Statistics 1960-2025 | MacroTrends

International migrant stock is the number of people born in a country other than that in which they live. It also includes refugees. The data used to estimate the international migrant stock at a particular time are obtained mainly from population censuses. The estimates are derived from the...

www.macrotrends.net

what was that?

And where did the literacy rates drop in the US? Oh that right, DC, NY, and CA, and it isn't even goddamn close. I wonder why literacy would drop at the exact same time the democrat party stop enforcing the border and let in every poor person who doesn't even speak the language.

If you're going to call something "blatantly false", maybe don't include 2 sources that both say I'm correct. It went from 33 to 40 in the 5 years before Mao took over, and went from 40 to 44 in Mao's first 15 years. Care to guess why the sudden big jump in Chinese life expectancy in the mid 60s? Was it Mao's "policies" finally kicking in 16 years later, or was that end of the biggest mass famine in world history that Mao cause with his "policies" that starved tens of millions to death? BTW, they were still 12 years behind US life expectancy the year Mao died.

Lol, are you one of the people dragging down the US literacy rate? It literally says right on the top of the goddamn graph "this data is adjusted for inflation". Really not sure what your point was with "the graph starts in 1981". Are you thinking there was some huge spike in poverty from 1977 to 1981 to start the graph? It starts in 1981 because that's when they drastically reduced the communist horse shit and actually did start drastically reducing poverty. They were lagging way behind the developed world before that.

 

[Dalarna3]

We give them way too much access to our tech industries. They aren't great at inventing, but very good at perfecting. Trump is right that we need to get some separation between us and them.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

And where did the literacy rates drop in the US? Oh that right, DC, NY, and CA, and it isn't even goddamn close.

oh, where all the people are? gotcha.

I wonder why literacy would drop at the exact same time the democrat party stop enforcing the border and let in every poor person who doesn't even speak the language.

do you think illegals are rubbing off on legal american citizens? because that's who's accounted for in the stats.

If you're going to call something "blatantly false", maybe don't include 2 sources that both say I'm correct. It went from 33 to 40 in the 5 years before Mao took over, and went from 40 to 44 in Mao's first 15 years.

even if you were correct, what does it say that you would draw a line at 15 years lmao

Care to guess why the sudden big jump in Chinese life expectancy in the mid 60s? Was it Mao's "policies" finally kicking in 16 years later, or was that end of the biggest mass famine in world history that Mao cause with his "policies" that starved tens of millions to death?

yeah his policies were starving people to death *checks notes* before he was in office and before the great famine.

BTW, they were still 12 years behind US life expectancy the year Mao died.

Lol, are you one of the people dragging down the US literacy rate? It literally says right on the top of the goddamn graph "this data is adjusted for inflation". Really not sure what your point was with "the graph starts in 1981". Are you thinking there was some huge spike in poverty from 1977 to 1981 to start the graph?

no, you absolute goober. the graph doesn't account for anything even two years before his death lmfao

It starts in 1981 because that's when they drastically reduced the communist horse shit and actually did start drastically reducing poverty. They were lagging way behind the developed world before that.

and what were they before mao's revolution? you still won't answer lol

 

[italiamusica]

So if they did it for a lot less money, then the people in the US asking for $500 billion to develop AI are clearly a massive money grab for them all to get more rich.

 

[SuperAlly]

The "West" literally did not exist when China first came into contact with the ancient Greeks. Furthermore, they are extremely pragmatic (another great Chinese trait) and have no problem copying what they think is good and rejecting what is bad. This flexibility is one of the reasons they have survived for so long..

lol

 

[Scerpi]

and what were the numbers before mao's revolution? lol mao's policies made lifespans and literacy rates skyrocket, and vastly improved the level of poverty in china. yes, the decision to switch from state communism to mostly-state-capitalism has proven fruitful in trade, but raising the value of the yuan and the cost of living (the two biggest factors of that graph) doesn't inherently mean what the graph suggests.

Hahahaha!

Tell that to the almost hundred million Mao murdered

By your rational Hitler was great for Germans because the trains ran on time

 

[SuperAlly]

Hahahaha!

Tell that to the almost hundred million Mao murdered

By your rational Hitler was great for Germans because the trains ran on time

He is a massive fan of Hitler and the nazis

He has demonstrated that repeatedly on this forum

 

[Cole train]

To my understanding chinas economic rise is thanks to deng who came after mao

Mao was a great military commander but horrible country leader

 

[Lycandroid]

Hahahaha!

Tell that to the almost hundred million Mao murdered

By your rational Hitler was great for Germans because the trains ran on time

This Kaz guy is the left wing Bryce Mitchell I swear

 

[nostradumbass]

oh, where all the people are? gotcha.

do you think illegals are rubbing off on legal american citizens? because that's who's accounted for in the stats.



even if you were correct, what does it say that you would draw a line at 15 years lmao

yeah his policies were starving people to death *checks notes* before he was in office and before the great famine.



no, you absolute goober. the graph doesn't account for anything even two years before his death lmfao

and what were they before mao's revolution? you still won't answer lol

Yeah, it's "where all the people are", which is why Kamala Harris is president.

They are the solid blue areas that spend the most on education and some of the highest taxes in the country with the worst results.

Um, it says that Mao spent the first 15 years of his dictatorship killing tens of millions of his own people. You really couldn't piece that one together? Nothing makes "life expectancy skyrocket" quite like finally ending your policies of starving your people to death, and it "skyrocketed" to still well behind every capitalist western country.

There is no starting number in the 30s and 40s "before Mao's revolution" that would make still having a 95% percent rural poverty rate a success after 30 years of his dictatorship. Those are straight up dog shit results even if the starting number was 100%, which it wasn't. This wasn't in a vacuum either, capitalist western countries saw massive increases in living standards and basically completely eradicated poverty by global standards at the same time China's big improvement was that Mao finally stopped starving his people to death and these bozos want a cookie for poverty going from 97% to 95% over 30 years. Lol, we had poor people flocking here from all over the world to come and flourish within a generation while they were telling their own people to drown their kids in a river because they couldn't afford it. You're all still dirt poor and living in mud huts, but at least a few more of you can read the state propaganda pamphlets after everythign else was banned.