What can be done to rival UFC?

[Tokoloko]

I think most of us agree that UFC has gotten watered down, stale and is declining. What can another promotion do to rival or out do the UFC?

Pride was able to in part because UFC was in the dark ages but aside from that they got talent from Rings and did crossover with K1. Another thing that brought a ton of hype were their tournaments.

Strikeforce got a number of good TV deals and somehow secured tons of good talent too.

Bellator did ok for a while, especially with Rizin cross promo, but ultimately it sounds like they were going bankrupt.

I think One could potentially do it if they did more crossover matches with their muay Thai or grappling fighters with compelling mma fighters (ie. Mma high level striker v Thai fighter or grappling champ v high level mma grappler)

They're in Asia so they could probably do Pride style tournaments too.

For the American market IMO the only way to explode would be
1. Get good TV deals like Strikeforce/Elite XC got
2. They need some sort of reality show. This is really the only thing that saved the UFC.

A reality show that allows people to get to know fighters and get invested in their story is probably the most important part.

GFL could potentially do well using many of their old fighters as coaches of teams similar to TUF

What say you sherbros?

Would any of this work or is BowserJr in fantasy land?

Oktagon did exactly what u said in multiple European countries- tv deals, reality shows... first Czech vs Slovak.... It worked. Same with Germany....because markets were basically empty. Then they tried same in English and it didnt work as they planned... Its simply too hard enter market where someone is already established because he will simply overshadow u. Ur only one chance to "beat" UFC is do not create organisation as bussines but be already billionaire ready to throw away big, big money to over pay local stars and get attention...

Why i mentioned Oktagon as example? They invested into promising guys from UK and tried to create stars...no one cared. If they overpaid MVP for example (which they could have) Their expansion into UK would be almost 100% succesfull - not profitable, but succesfull...

 

[skylolow]

I think an organization needs to bring in K1 Heavyweights, some of the heavier weight classes. To me I think most people and even people not in mma love seeing two big dudes slug it out.

Pride was great because they had all the mismatch "freakshow" fights and some of the most memorable fights in mma history. We just need another Pride like organization but it seems like that is now just a memory. Also back then it wasn't always about money, these guys truly loved to fight, they would fight 3 times in one night. Just my two cents, hello sherdog haven't posted here in a while. I am still here!

Well to be fair, Pride was playing to their audience, Japan more so than anyone else in the world. We also as fans look back at history and paint a much greener pasture in our heads than reality usually. It was also a very different time in the world of MMA. Fighting was fighting for pride back in the day and nice little paycheck. Most fighters back then worked a real job. Today MMA is approached as being a professional athlete and making a career out of it at the UFC level for the most part.

Pride in their hay day struggled to get media deals.. The biggest media deal they ever signed was 20M a year. Pride was only selling anywhere between about 10,000 to 30,000 in PPV buys according to most reports. At that time the UFC was getting over 30M a year from SPIKE and adding more shows along with TUF. While doing 300K to 800K in PPV each month by 2006. UFC was making bank and leaving Pride in the dust in the revenue department.


Other people in this thread think these media companies are just waiting to write a fat check. No doubt media deals are the main key of making money for MMA today but the only org getting them to open the check book is the UFC. All the other orgs struggle year to year of getting anything worth while and some basically giving it away or paying for the time. Everybody thinks some billionaire could come along and just go wild(keep in mind billionaires aren't in the business to lose money). True, and maybe they would gain some traction on main world stage. But is that sustainable, probably not. It is similar to what the WCW ran into. Made a splash for a period of time, but it really wasn't sustainable. Eventually your org has to stand on its own. Look how much money has been invested in ONE over the years and you could argue ONE was bigger in the minds of fans 5 years ago than it is today. PFL apparently has 2M minimum fee to fight Francis and in 2 years not one single HW worth anything has left the UFC for that offer. Just having money to spend doesn't seem to do much in MMA. You attract prospects and twilight of a fighters career with few solid signings here and there. But nothing to the level that seems to matter in eyes of most fans of MMA.

 

[colorles]

$0.90 of every dollar the sport rakes in, belongs to the UFC. For the vast majority of fans, mma=UFC.

lol. LMAO even.

In America. Do you really think that if, magically UFC ceased to exist tomorrow, that mma worldwide would just stop existing and stop having a fanbase? Of course not. What would actually happen is all the UFC fighters going to the highest bidder over seas - be it ACA, ONE, KSW etc.

The so called "region" that ACA dominates, is roughly the size of the entire western hemisphere. The organization is successful, stable, pays well and attracts many of the best fighters in the former eastern bloc and surrounding areas. Western sanctions will keep if from being well known in the west; but it doesn't matter because it's own "region" is roughly the size of the entire western hemisphere and has the most combat oriented culture on earth.

 

[leto1776]

In America. Do you really think that if, magically UFC ceased to exist tomorrow, that mma worldwide would just stop existing and stop having a fanbase? Of course not. What would actually happen is all the UFC fighters going to the highest bidder over seas - be it ACA, ONE, KSW etc.

The so called "region" that ACA dominates, is roughly the size of the entire western hemisphere. The organization is successful, stable, pays well and attracts many of the best fighters in the former eastern bloc and surrounding areas. Western sanctions will keep if from being well known in the west; but it doesn't matter because it's own "region" is roughly the size of the entire western hemisphere and has the most combat oriented culture on earth.

You ACA weirdos are something else.
1. It’s region is the caucus. Not all of Russia.
2. It’s a plaything. A vanity project. It was a vanity project of an oligarch robber Baron, and now it’s Kadyrov’s vanity project.

1. ONE is unsustainable.
2. KSW is strictly European, and to this day plays mostly to Polish audiences only.
3. UFC fighters, especially the fighters who leave it and are still good, are expensive. Every promotion that plays the “let’s gobble up ex-UFC fighters” game goes broke.

 

[colorles]

You ACA weirdos are something else.
1. It’s region is the caucus. Not all of Russia.
2. It’s a plaything. A vanity project. It was a vanity project of an oligarch robber Baron, and now it’s Kadyrov’s vanity project.

1. ONE is unsustainable.
2. KSW is strictly European, and to this day plays mostly to Polish audiences only.
3. UFC fighters, especially the fighters who leave it and are still good, are expensive. Every promotion that plays the “let’s gobble up ex-UFC fighters” game goes broke.

It is THE mma promotion throughout all of Russia and the entire ex-eastern bloc and surrounding areas at this point. I don't give a fuck if it started as a plaything of an oligarch. All that matters is that is is stable and successful.

You are talking about washed up UFC fighters going elsewhere like Bellator. In this case, UFC would no longer exist and it would be like when Pride, Strikeforce and WEC went under and all of their fighters - many of them in their primes particuarly from Strikeforce and WEC - signed with UFC. Except in this case they would be signing with ACA, KSW, ONE, RIZIN, etc. whoever is the highest bidder.

 

[Ibm]

The UFC is backed by god essentially, the largest Media company owns them. The WWE also has their back. This is probably the most protecte company ever right now. no one has the resources to overtake them,others can still be successful with the right approach but i doubt it, in a sport of MMA. its way too difficult to suceed in the long term.

 

[wwkirk]

The UFC is backed by god essentially, the largest Media company owns them. The WWE also has their back. This is probably the most protecte company ever right now. no one has the resources to overtake them,others can still be successful with the right approach but i doubt it, in a sport of MMA. its way too difficult to suceed in the long term.

Everything you say is true, but check-it, even IBM seemed invincible for a long time.

 

[DoctorTaco]

You'd have to find someone with some SERIOUSLY deep pockets who won't mind losing money for at least 5 years. You'd have to somehow gather up all the best available talent not under contract with a major promotion, get TV/PPV deals, and promote the fuck out of it. Contrary to what a lot of people think I do not believe you need some big gimmick that differentiates you from the UFC... you just need to be an actual, transparent, legitimately merit-based league, and stay away from circus BS

Also, make sure your broadcast and production teams are top-notch... not putting in retarded shit like PFL does or taking FOREVER to get through events like Bellator did

This. Plus, invest in the stories of the fighters. Not wwe storylines, but i want to know who the athletes are, what they’re about, and why we should care about them.

 

[Hellowhosthat]

Oktagon did exactly what u said in multiple European countries- tv deals, reality shows... first Czech vs Slovak.... It worked. Same with Germany....because markets were basically empty. Then they tried same in English and it didnt work as they planned... Its simply too hard enter market where someone is already established because he will simply overshadow u. Ur only one chance to "beat" UFC is do not create organisation as bussines but be already billionaire ready to throw away big, big money to over pay local stars and get attention...

Why i mentioned Oktagon as example? They invested into promising guys from UK and tried to create stars...no one cared. If they overpaid MVP for example (which they could have) Their expansion into UK would be almost 100% succesfull - not profitable, but succesfull...

I think Oktagon were just too ambitious too early in the UK. I went to one of their UK shows and it was a pretty big arena but it was about 20% full, would have been better running somewhere smaller.

 

[David Street]

ONE is unsustainable? I would say it is unsustainable only because of debt. It tried to do too much, but now it is in a good place and sustainable if it weren't for the debt and still Chatri wants to make it BIG but the debt...

Now in Thailand it pays fighters little and employees little and they are pretty good. If they had started this way they would have had the base to grow.

 

[TCE]

I actually think it's inevitable that the UFC is going to be on Netflix when the TV rights expire.

Even for us UK fans, what's happening with TNT Sport?

 

[Hellowhosthat]

Even for us UK fans, what's happening with TNT Sport?

Probably. I don't know when that deal ends.

I just think with WWE getting the Netflix deal it would make sense for UFC to do the same given they're under the same umbrella.

 

[TCE]

Probably. I don't know when that deal ends.

I just think with WWE getting the Netflix deal it would make sense for UFC to do the same given they're under the same umbrella.

Let's hope so. Although recently I have discovered a nice hack for my Firestick where I get every single sports channel, and most other channels all for free on my Firestick, the picture quality is good, but isn't HD like I'd get through Netflix. Still doesn't buffer or anything. I love it, haha.

Fuck paying for sports channels in the UK, especially considering I only watch MMA and the big Snooker events.

 

[skylolow]

In America. Do you really think that if, magically UFC ceased to exist tomorrow, that mma worldwide would just stop existing and stop having a fanbase? Of course not. What would actually happen is all the UFC fighters going to the highest bidder over seas - be it ACA, ONE, KSW etc.

The so called "region" that ACA dominates, is roughly the size of the entire western hemisphere. The organization is successful, stable, pays well and attracts many of the best fighters in the former eastern bloc and surrounding areas. Western sanctions will keep if from being well known in the west; but it doesn't matter because it's own "region" is roughly the size of the entire western hemisphere and has the most combat oriented culture on earth.

How much is ACA's media deal worth in Russia region???



His point is that a very lopsided amount of a single dollar that MMA world wide makes in revenue goes to the UFC. He isn't saying orgs like ACA, PFL, KSW, Rizin, ONE, etc can't find success on some level in the world and do very well in their region. The issues becomes if your making 25 to 50 Million in revenue a year your making about what the UFC takes in every two to three weeks or so. That is how lopsided it is at the top. It is cliff when it comes to revenue after those few orgs. Wait until the new UFC media deal they get, they will be probably be taking in 1.5B in revenue yearly after that.

 

[Doctor Grudge]

In America. Do you really think that if, magically UFC ceased to exist tomorrow, that mma worldwide would just stop existing and stop having a fanbase? Of course not. What would actually happen is all the UFC fighters going to the highest bidder over seas - be it ACA, ONE, KSW etc.

The so called "region" that ACA dominates, is roughly the size of the entire western hemisphere. The organization is successful, stable, pays well and attracts many of the best fighters in the former eastern bloc and surrounding areas. Western sanctions will keep if from being well known in the west; but it doesn't matter because it's own "region" is roughly the size of the entire western hemisphere and has the most combat oriented culture on earth.

ACA isn't well known in the East either...it is incredibly niche even in FUSSR, and is only popular in the Caucus region (and quite frankly, I have my doubts about its popularity in a place like Armenia).South Asia, East and South East Asia know absolutely nothing about ACA and the idea that sanctions are the only reason why no one would know ACA is absurd.

The Western Hemisphere has like triple the population of the "region" you're talking about (I assume you're adding up every FSSR country as one, which is being incredibly generous to say the least). That's not to mention the spending potential in its core demographics are miniscule.

 

[RoseHDCovington]

There's literally nothing that can be done. You'd have to take the entire company down.

 

[HHJ]

You'd need to find and develop a Conor level star to entice other big names to sign on to face him. And alot of luck