Vettori vs this top 10

[Koro_11]

Bewildered why ppl are saying he beats Bisping? Bisping has as good cardio, better more technical kickboxing, more power and really good TDD and terrific ability to get back up to his feet. Marvin doesn't have a crushing top game like Kennedy or anything and that's basically the only time Bisping was topfucked in his career. Even prime Hashad @ 205 struggles mightily and nearly lost to Mike and Shael also had a razor close controversial win against Mike where he struggled to get him down and couldn't keep him down much at all. Both of them much better wrestlers than Marvin. And Marvin has struggled to take down a lot worse defensive wrestlers than Mike.

He literally loses to everyone on that list and most look one sided. His best chances are against Tim who's a better grappler with more power, but not as clean striking. And Anderson and Saucy had below average to weak TDD and liked to play guard but Marvin was getting hurt badly and pieced up late by Kevin Holland who's basically a Walmart Anderson so he wouldn't win those fights either

That post Strikeforce merge was the GOAT MW division by fucking far. No version of Marvin would have been top 10 in that era. He'd be a solid 11-15 with the likes of Brunson who was getting rekt back then and ironically is only a spot behind him in the rankings now at 37yo <Lmaoo> shows how fucking shite MW is now

Ping got beat by Kennedy, Rashad, Chael and Matt Hamill (yes he lost that one too, I don’t give a fuck what the Manchester judges say). Basically any strong wrestler he’s fought he got his ass handed to him, and Vetori is pretty similar to those guys in many ways.

The Walmart Anderson Silva line killed me tho, that was a pretty accurate description of Holland.

 

[Willek]

MW is pretty terrible considering Derek Brunson in his late 30s has made a late career resurgence.

 

[Bend NvR Break]

Bisping has better TDD and ability to get up than anyone Vettori has wrestlefucked, including 2018 Adesanya.

Bisping gave Chael a hard time and he's a better wrestler than Vettori. 5 round fight and Bisping takes that fight.

On the feet it's basically a pick em.

Chael landed 4 of 7 TD on Bisping and took Bisping's back once.

He also outlanded Bisping on the feet.

It was an unanimous decision:
30-27, 29-28, 29-28

Where do you get the idea Bisping would win in a 5 rounder? when else had Bisping done well in the championship rounds besides the Hendo rematch? He won round 4 in the Andersen fight but lost round 5. (Actually round 5 is a bright spot for Bisping because Silva threw everything and the kitchen sink at Bisping and tried to take him out but couldn't. He survived and won). GSP won in the 3rd round iirc maybe the second.

 

[Argonaut]

How is that he beats Machida for sure? The guy who beat Mousasi could make Marvin a chaser - and Mousasi also be Machida later on

Why does he beat Machida? If anything Vettori is tailormade to chase Machida around the cage, get his relentless aggression used against him and knock out Machida vs Bader style.

Everyone who thinks Mousasi beats Vettori but Machida doesn't have forgotten Machida beat Mousasi 50-45. - and Mousasi also be Machida later on

Machida has a TDD defense of 76% - Vettori is elite and a better striker/faster and has very solid takedowns. May not have the footwork Machida has but at the same time could deal with it if he can hang with a prime Adasanya.

 

[BowserJr]

This thread is bullshit and the whole thread is basically fighter bashing. Vettori is ridiculously underrated here. He’s beaten top level guys like Costa, Hermansson and Holland, yet gets no credit for it.

He’s a huge MW, extremely durable, has great cardio, smothering pressure, good wrestling and striking. Yes, he isn’t a exceptional striker or grappler, but he’s extremely well rounded and his strength and conditioning exceeds anyone on that list.

Weidman- 50/50 fight, with Vettori winning the championship rounds

Rockhold- Marvin would probably beat him quite easily. He wouldn’t stay on the outside for Luke’s kicks to work and he wouldn’t go to the mat with Rockhold. Would drown Luke with his pace in close range. 70/30 Vettori

Machida- another 50/50 fight. If Izzy and Costa couldn’t finish Marvin, I doubt Machida would. Marvin could take this one with his relentlessness as well.

Mousasi- it’s tough fight for Marvin to win, Moose is better everywhere. 70/30 Mousasi

Romero- Yoel wouldn’t match Marvin’s pace. 70/30 Marvin

Jacare- another 50/50 fight. Either Jacare subs him or Marvin wins a UD

Silva- 60/40 Marvin. Pre Weidman maybe could’ve done what Izzy did to him, but post prime Anderson wouldn’t stop Marvin’s pressure

Vitor- 60/40 TRT

Bisping- 60/40 Marvin

Kennedy- 80/20 Marvin

He's good iron the current weak MW division

I disagree with most of what you said.

Hermanson and Costa are solid but they wouldn't do much to this top 10 either.

I can't stand Bisping but I could even see him beat Costa.

 

[Bend NvR Break]

Machida has a TDD defense of 76% - Vettori is elite and a better striker/faster and has very solid takedowns. May not have the footwork Machida has but at the same time could deal with it if he can hang with a prime Adasanya.

Machida in his prime was better than Izzy. Not to mention Machida is an elite grappler and has out grappled grapplers like Sokujo.

Did you actually what Machida's run through the UFC?

 

[Argonaut]

Machida in his prime was better than Izzy. Not to mention Machida is an elite grappler and has out grappled grapplers like Sokujo.

Did you actually what Machida's run through the UFC?

I watched the entire "Machida era"
Don't get me wrong, he was good. He also popped for roids, but he was good KO'ing Rashad for instance.
But when USADA was implemented in 2014-2015 dropped 3 fights in a row.


Pre-Usada and roided up he would still lose to Izzy. Adasanya is more physically gifted and has a huge reach advantage+more skill, it wouldn't end well for him, just like a Vettori match.

Vettori's boxing is crisper and Machida would always need to be on the look out for the takedown, that is always a disadvantage for the striker.

 

[Bend NvR Break]

I watched the entire "Machida era"
Don't get me wrong, he was good. He also popped for roids, but he was good KO'ing Rashad for instance.
But when USADA was implemented in 2014-2015 dropped 3 fights in a row.


Pre-Usada and roided up he would still lose to Izzy. Adasanya is more physically gifted and has a huge reach advantage+more skill, it wouldn't end well for him, just like a Vettori match.

Vettori's boxing is crisper and Machida would always need to be on the look out for the takedown, that is always a disadvantage for the striker.

Izzy got out struck by Jan. Machida today could still beat Jan let alone prime Machida. Jan wasn't some prime, peaking version of himself when he beat Izzy. He was on the downside of his career and Izzy was supposed to be priming.

Izzy is overrated. Good but overrated. Jan proved that.

 

[GOATtalks]

He's good iron the current weak MW division

I disagree with most of what you said.

Hermanson and Costa are solid but they wouldn't do much to this top 10 either.

I can't stand Bisping but I could even see him beat Costa.

Your opinion is based on feelings, facts state the opposite.

How is current MW division weak?

Costa beat Yoel.
Yoel is 5-0 against the top10 in OP.
Yoel is also 1-3 against the current top10.

Hermansson beat Jacare and Jacare has 4 wins over top10 in OP. Jacare has 3 loses to the current top10

Izzy and Whittaker shits on the top10 in OP as well.

Khamzat would’ve beat them all as well.

 

[pankrat]

I watched the entire "Machida era"
Don't get me wrong, he was good. He also popped for roids, but he was good KO'ing Rashad for instance.
But when USADA was implemented in 2014-2015 dropped 3 fights in a row.


Pre-Usada and roided up he would still lose to Izzy. Adasanya is more physically gifted and has a huge reach advantage+more skill, it wouldn't end well for him, just like a Vettori match.

Vettori's boxing is crisper and Machida would always need to be on the look out for the takedown, that is always a disadvantage for the striker.

Dude, you are pretending Vettori is such a massive TD thread for Machida when the fact is he has dealt with grapplers MUCH more credited than Vettori. I guess you think outwrestling Hermansson is the ultimate grappling feat in the world of MMA, that's what recency bias is about.

Im not even sure Vettori would get the better of the grappling exchanges with Machida, and standing is clearly the inferior fighter even though he is togh as nails.

 

[pankrat]

Your opinion is based on feelings, facts state the opposite.

How is current MW division weak?

Hermansson beat Jacare and Jacare has 4 wins over top10 in OP. Jacare has 3 loses to the current top10

This dude makes a MMA math with Jacare in 2019 and Jacare in 2014-2015 pre-USADA as do if it was the same fighter. And then call it "fact".
Textbook shertard with simpleton, dishonest MMA maths like this.

 

[GOATtalks]

This dude makes a MMA math with Jacare in 2019 and Jacare in 2014-2015 pre-USADA as do if it was the same fighter. And then call it "fact".
Textbook shertard with simpleton, dishonest MMA maths like this.

Well it’s still a fact that he lost to Hermansson, it doesn’t matter if you like it or not.

Nice going in bashing Jacare as a drug cheat, lol!

Even if you want to discredit Jack’s win, you have no excuse for his loses to Yoel and Whittaker. Rob is clearly a better fighter than Jacare.

And I like how you intentionally skipped the Yoel part in my post, because it totally destroys your believe system and there’s nothing you can do about it.

 

[pankrat]

Well it’s still a fact that he lost to Hermansson, it doesn’t matter if you like it or not.

Nice going in bashing Jacare as a drug cheat, lol!

Even if you want to discredit Jack’s win, you have no excuse for his loses to Yoel and Whittaker. Rob is clearly a better fighter than Jacare.

And I like how intentionally skipped the Yoel part in my post, because it totally destroys your believe system and there’s nothing you can do about it.

Go around making dishonest MMA maths like that and feel proud.
I have nothing to discuss with a poster like that. Just wanted to call a textbook shertard for what he is Have a good day

 

[GOATtalks]

Go around making dishonest MMA maths like that and feel proud.
I have nothing to discuss with a poster like that. Just wanted to call a textbook shertard for what he is Have a good day

Keep running away, you sore loser!

What’s dishonest about Yoel beating Jacare, Weidman, Rockhold, Machida and Kennedy, but losing to Whittaker, Izzy and Costa?

 

[pankrat]

Keep running away, you sore loser!

What’s dishonest about Yoel beating Jacare, Weidman, Rockhold, Machida and Kennedy, but losing to Whittaker, Izzy and Costa?

The way he "loss" to Whittaker and Israel being in his 40s is already testament enough of him being a superior fighter than Marvin, even being Marvin in his athletic prime.

Fifght finder - recency bias - dishonest mma maths...
You are just the full package of a textbook shertard. Congratulations

 

[GOATtalks]

The way he "loss" to Whittaker and Israel being in his 40s is already testament enough of him being a superior fighter than Marvin, even being Marvin in his athletic prime.

Fifght finder - recency bias - dishonest mma maths...
You are just the full package of a textbook shertard. Congratulations

I’ve seen all of those fights.

Yoel beat Weidman just 8 months prior to losing to Rob, then beat Rockhold and lost to Rob again just 4 months later. Nothing indicated a physical decline in Yoel. Everyone knows that he’s a freak of nature.

Rob fought literally the same Yoel as Weidman and Rockhold did. Lol

Go fuck yourself!

 

[HwoarangStyle]

middleweight was fuckin stacked god damn

 

[pankrat]

I’ve seen all of those fights.

Yoel beat Weidman just 8 months prior to losing to Rob, then beat Rockhold and lost to Rob again just 4 months later. Nothing indicated a physical decline in Yoel. Everyone knows that he’s a freak of nature.

Rob fought literally the same Yoel as Weidman and Rockhold did. Lol

Go fuck yourself!

Yeah, and Rob would be a clear favourite over Marvin you moron. Not by a controversial dec / draw. A favourite to beat him handly. Marvin in his athletic prime, let alone when he reach his 40s.

Tell me some more MMA math, fight-finder analysis, and recency bias. Actually no, not interested. Have a good day.

 

[pankrat]

lmfao they so removed from that era that they aren't worth mentioning, I mentioned yushin chael and maia because they are andersons last 5 title defenses minus vitor who i addressed, they are the fighters closest to overlapping with the era OP has mentioned. Lutter was out of the ufc at the time i think cote was still around, but the middleweight division changed drastically at that time.

I'm not exactly sure what your obsession with george st.pierre is, but GSP fought the acquired champion at strikeforce (Diaz, Shields) and The acquired champion at WEC (Condit).

and for what it's worth I think Condit, woodley, Lawler, MacDonald, Ellenburger, beat fitch kos bj serra and hardy.
.

It's you who brought Silva's tittle challengers in order to discredit them.
I applied the exact same logic you did and, what a surprise, you get hysterical.

Maia is the "weak" tittle contender who then moves to the "strong" WW and remains a tittle contender for years until well into his 40s.

Ellenberger who you mentioned as the new generation of WW killers... got KOed by another "weak" former MW in Kampmann.

...

I replied to your assumption about the "image of MW being weak". I told you that "image" was largely a narrative of Canadian fanboys in sherdog. An you end up being buddy buddy with Thunderstruck hahaha dont get hysterical though Lockridge

 

[pankrat]

Chael landed 4 of 7 TD on Bisping and took Bisping's back once.

He also outlanded Bisping on the feet.

It was an unanimous decision:
30-27, 29-28, 29-28

Where do you get the idea Bisping would win in a 5 rounder? when else had Bisping done well in the championship rounds besides the Hendo rematch? He won round 4 in the Andersen fight but lost round 5. (Actually round 5 is a bright spot for Bisping because Silva threw everything and the kitchen sink at Bisping and tried to take him out but couldn't. He survived and won). GSP won in the 3rd round iirc maybe the second.

Sonnen himself disagreees with you. LOL

Yet here we have a sherdogger pretending to know better than Sonnen himself based on fight finder or stats, and building an argument around that to pretend that Vettori should be favoured to beat Bisping.

Vettori who is not even close the wrestler Sonnen is but who cares, uh?

Im not even saying Vettori would win or lose here. I think is a competitive fight. Just saying that your argument to present Vettori as a clear favourite are flawed as fuck