Television The Star Trek Thread V6.0

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

I think you can see what there getting at, a lot of the episodes that typically turn up on TNG best of lists tend towards being character ones, big moral lessons or those that really advance the setting yet you could argue really a lot of the meat of the show were more one off plot heavy episodes.

I did always enjoy that aspect of the show, perhaps part of why I didn't feel it dropped off as much as some claim in seasons 6-7, you could argue the character stories did lose some of their drama by that point as stories had been played out. A lot of the plot heavy episodes though I think still benefited from having a really well worked out formula by that stage.

The "spookey phenemon" episodes were always some of my favourites and I think that's an aspect that other Trek series always struggled to do as well as TNG(arguable Voyager should have had alot more of this kind of thing). Cause and Effect is a big one and Remmber Me with Crusher finding everyone vanishing but there were some really good latter episodes as well like Timescape(Romulans and frozen time) at the end of season 6 or Parallels(Worf shifting to parallel realities) in season 7.

Hopefully we do get another 5 episodes each from Mike and Rich, it is a bit strange its taken this long for them to look at Trek they actually like. Maybe cross over to the darkside and start with some Babylon 5 reviews?

<{monica}>

Remember Me, Timescape and Parallels are three of my favourite episodes that would definitely all make my top ten list. Another one that I liked that I personally put in that category too is Genesis from season 7, where the crew de-evolve into various creatures.

 

[sverre054]

I think part of the problem with Voyager though is that it started off more like DS9 but then tried to shift into being TNG.

The TNG characters were really designed to fit into weekly stories, not just in their duties but in their personalities/abilities, you had a certain plot element and a certain character naturally fit into it. The DS9 characters were designed much more for progression in the drama across the series and I think Voyager started off potentially doing the same then lost their nerve and tried to go back to TNG. When you undercut the whole divided/isolated crew aspect though you really lost a lot of what potentially made the show interesting and a lot of the characters were really pretty interchangeable.

You also have to remember, VOY was made for UPN, so it was a network show. They had to listen to the whims of executives at Paramount and UPN. They were trying to serve to many masters

 

[sverre054]

Happy 99th Birthday to Gene Roddenberry

 

[sverre054]

I remember all of that. I also remember how unpopular TNG was initially. Still, they created a formula that was a huge success after 7 seasons in both cases. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

All the post TOS series were hated by "fans" when they initially came out, and most were pretty rough for there first few season. Sorta like people who bitch about DSC, Picard, Lower decks....

Maybe give the show a chance before condemning them. TNG never would have made it past season 1, if the internet and social media existed back then.

 

[JDragon]

Article I thought worth sharing:



https://io9.gizmodo.com/a-new-documentary-shows-how-gene-roddenberry-almost-kil-1721153875

Nothing new for anyone who has seen Chaos on the Bridge, but I have to admit I have not watched it yet.

 

[JDragon]

So Strange New Worlds could be victim of Covid, I am afraid? Talking out of my ass here, of course.

 

[JDragon]

Ok may have been posted already, apologies...

Kurtzman on Strange New Worlds:

"[Strange New Worlds] is going to be a return in a way to TOS. We are going to do stand-alone episodes. There will be emotional serialization. There will be two-parters. There will be larger plot arcs. But it really is back to the model of alien-of-the-week, planet-of-the-week, challenge-on-the-ship-of-the-week. With these characters pre-Kirk’s Enterprise."


Sounds good. Now if I could be handed a dose of optimism and normal lighting?

 

[JDragon]

Update from the DS9 upscaling project dude:

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/313963-ds9-upscale-project-update-what-ive-been-working-on

Also check out the comments, there is a Link to a guy who did DS9 ship modeling.

 

[Peteyandjia]

DSC, Picard, Lower decks....

Maybe give the show a chance before condemning them. TNG never would have made it past season 1, if the internet and social media existed back then.

Nah. I gave all the new shows a chance. To varying degrees, I vomited pretty much the moment they each touched my palate.

Same chance I give with any other show, or movie for that matter. Including TNG. I tried the first episode of that too, and got instantly hooked. That’s because it’s actually a great show. The first season as a whole is varying parts okay to good, but the actual TNG premiere is a classic episode which still holds up today, as truly great. The modern ‘Trek’ shows on the other hand are all pure shit, liquid diarrhea.

 

[JDragon]

Nah. I gave all the new shows a chance. To varying degrees, I vomited pretty much the moment they each touched my palate.

Same chance I give with any other show, or movie for that matter. Including TNG. I tried the first episode of that too, and got instantly hooked. That’s because it’s actually a great show. The first season as a whole is varying parts okay to good, but the actual TNG premiere is a classic episode which still holds up today, as truly great. The modern ‘Trek’ shows on the other hand are all pure shit, liquid diarrhea.

That is not true, there is some good content there. I fully get the issues with Discovery and Picard, though (btw Canon is not one of them). So I do understand if someone loses patience with these shows.

 

[Peteyandjia]

 

[Francis Rossi]

Article I thought worth sharing:



https://io9.gizmodo.com/a-new-documentary-shows-how-gene-roddenberry-almost-kil-1721153875

Nothing new for anyone who has seen Chaos on the Bridge, but I have to admit I have not watched it yet.

Chaos on the Bridge was good. Really was a shitshow for the first two or three years.

 

[Philo-Publius]

All the post TOS series were hated by "fans" when they initially came out, and most were pretty rough for there first few season. Sorta like people who bitch about DSC, Picard, Lower decks....

Maybe give the show a chance before condemning them. TNG never would have made it past season 1, if the internet and social media existed back then.

I did give them a chance.

 

[deviake]

Well you have to remember back then DS9 wasn't as loved, as it is today. DS9 was always kinda the bastard step child of Trek. It never had the ratings TNG did. Also it was harder to syndicate, due to the serialization. I do remember watching it on TV as a kid, and would sometimes not really know whats going on, since I missed a few episodes, and had no idea who these new characters are.

DS9 and to a lesser extent, Enterprise, really rose in popularity the last decade, due to people rediscovering them on streaming services.

It's funny to me, I didn't know DS9 was a pariah back then, I grew up on it and it was just another ST show to me, I was happy to have another series.

All the post TOS series were hated by "fans" when they initially came out, and most were pretty rough for there first few season. Sorta like people who bitch about DSC, Picard, Lower decks....

Maybe give the show a chance before condemning them. TNG never would have made it past season 1, if the internet and social media existed back then.

I grew up on TNG & DS9, and saw some of TOS, grew up on the TOS movies, liked 'em all from the start, ableit TOS hadn't and hasn't aged well for me. For the most part, the others have aged well unlike other things I grew up on. To be fair I've only seen clips of Discovery but I tried, I really tried with Picard. I even ignored my own misgivings during the first episode, but it didn't take long into the second before my head was hung. If anything I was overly optimistic in my desire to enjoy it, hoping for the best. I've watched enough good content that had a rough start, I know when they're sanding down the rough edges and when the foundation and materials are rotten. Same shit with the Star Wars sequels. I didn't need to watch the third movie to know it was gonna be bad.

I gave Star Wars The Clone Wars a chance, stuck through the rough first episodes and love it despite hating the prequels. Watched Rebels. I think I can safely say I really try to give things a chance and the things I don't I know my tastes and what I'm seeing well enough to judge.

 

[GtehMVP]

I would say the writing wasn't as consistent as TNG and perhaps the cast as a whole maybe not quite as good but I think it also hit greater highs dramatically and the Cardasians are definitely the best alien race in Trek with Garak, Dukat(pre pah wraith anyway), Tain and Damar some of the best characters, Kira by far the best Trek female character as well IMHO.

I do think the rivalry with Babylon 5 actually worked very well for both shows as well, both constantly pushing forward trying to outdo each other.

Agreed all around. Garak and Dukat were brilliantly written/acted. Dukat is tje quintessential bad guy who thinks he's a good guy, and almost sells the audience on it.

Kira bothered me early on, but she was awesome as she grew into the character. I loved her relationship with Odo, and always believed her hatred for the Cardassians.

DS9 and Babylon 5 had incredible highs, with so many fleshed out characters too. I didnt get into B5 until the last decade, it must have been incredible having those airing at the same time.

They are my one and two fav sci-fi shows ever.

 

[sverre054]

So Strange New Worlds could be victim of Covid, I am afraid? Talking out of my ass here, of course.

Its still a go. They are in full pre production and season 1 is written. The biggest delay is SNW will be filming in Canada, so it's not easy to travel for the Americans on the crew. Both SNW and Picard are supposed to start production back up in the fall. DIscovery season is supposed to start shortly after but can film at the same time as SNW, due to CBS building a new studio next door to accommodate multiple trek shows filming at the same time. Picard will be filming in California again.

 

[sverre054]

Update from the DS9 upscaling project dude:

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/313963-ds9-upscale-project-update-what-ive-been-working-on

Also check out the comments, there is a Link to a guy who did DS9 ship modeling.

Looks great. I just rewatched What we left behind the other day, and the HD upscaling they did is just stunning. I really wish CBS would get behind the effort to bring DS9 to HD. With these new technologies, it could be accomplished much cheaper and quicker, then TNG did.

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

Deep space nine is probably my favourite Star Trek

It was the darkest and most realistic spin off, and the one that strayed the most from the original formula.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

Update from the DS9 upscaling project dude:

https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/313963-ds9-upscale-project-update-what-ive-been-working-on

Also check out the comments, there is a Link to a guy who did DS9 ship modeling.

Its never going to match true HD/4K scanning of the original film elements(and new FX work) we saw with TNG but you could I spose argue Trek is well suited to AI upscaling. I'm imagine the weakness of that kind of tech is when you have more "organic" detail and clutter but Trek does tend to stick to quite simple textures and DS9 especially doesn't have much location work.

 

[Clippy]