Law THE POLICE SHOOTING/USE OF FORCE MEGATHREAD: discussions to determine if justified or not
- Thread starter nhbbear
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Case worker called the cops on her because she threatened to harm herself and they fuckin killed her
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@Poon Goon
He's had 2 days to respond to the reasonableness of #1's actions relative to #2's in the ECPD shooting (post #411). They both had the same information, but their actions were completely different.
He wants a debate, I want a response to that post, or he needs to sack up and own that his position is retarded.
"It's a good shoot and, I don't care that the Shithead didn't follow policy or code"
Nobody commentated about my hypothetical either, which I find hilarious. What if the 3rd Car was K-9 handler and Scout? Does that change anyones view?
He's had 2 days to respond to the reasonableness of #1's actions relative to #2's in the ECPD shooting (post #411). They both had the same information, but their actions were completely different.
He wants a debate, I want a response to that post, or he needs to sack up and own that his position is retarded.
"It's a good shoot and, I don't care that the Shithead didn't follow policy or code"
Nobody commentated about my hypothetical either, which I find hilarious. What if the 3rd Car was K-9 handler and Scout? Does that change anyones view?
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Shot through the left eyeball, but clearly suicide by cop. My only complaint is the lady cop who just stood there and watched the whole thing go down. Should have had her taser out the minute the lady stepped out of her door. She also almost let herself get in a crossfire situation by being a moron. Desk duty at the very least, but I think she should be canned.
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They dispatched 2 Officers which seems reasonable. 1 was incompetent without immediate repurcussion, that was suffered by Her Partner. He had to take a life to protect his own.
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I'm sure bearman is somewhere right now furiously typing away a response, he just takes a while sometimes.
That would be even more of a tactical blunder than what has already been discussed. But, I've seen a few shootings where the suspect points a gun or knife at a K9 and gets lit up by police. Brick guy may have suffered the same fate if that happened here.
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This place must not have mobile crisis teams in place. We have a social worker/police hybrid response to situations like this one. Granted they're dog shit and almost never effective but it's better than simply presenting a suicidal person with the fastest path to their goal
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Cops can only use deadly force to defend Human Life
The department dispatched 2 Officers to the scene. Others were on the way iirc. But this turned out to be a situation that developed rapidly on 1st contact with the woman. She wasn't passively resistant to this initial contact by walking away. She was rapidly closing distance with a bladed weapon.
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Seems like it was allowed in Florida.
Here's another one, but this guy had a gun so obviously that's a little different
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Is this a quiz? I can read and understand Florida Statute and their Forcible Felony Statute that doesn't have reverance for human life. Florida aint California. It's also a subject that doesn't interest me greatly.
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My sincerest apologies then
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If you are talking about me, you are lying yet again. I absolutely blasted the Uvalde cops and was disgusted by their lack of action and that is easily provable by looking up that thread. It’s on you to prove that I have ever said anything good about their actionsb
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Clearly I can read and comprehend Statute quickly, and instantly spot the difference between Florida Statute and California Code. As Antanas Guoga says; "I'm qualified."
I don't present myself as an expert on the use of force. I present myself as someone with reading comprehension skills. I'm not trying to cram a square peg into a Graham V Conor shaped hole. I was applying ECPD policy, and California Code to what facts have been released regarding a shooting in California.
I'm familiar with the #8cantwait movement, with a fair understanding of what each of those policies means, including the de-escalation requirement that California has. Our resident expert in the use of force, proved to be ignorant to those de-escalation requirements; and has only ignored and excused that Officer #1 failed at de-escalation. He went Lone Ranger. The only life in any kind of jeopardy was his own, and he put himself there.
The 2nd shot was fruit from the lower branches. De-escalation was the tastier vittles at the top of the Tree. FPP wasn't ready for the discussion.
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I am not in court and I am surely not going through your thousands of whiny ass posts to find it. I know what you said and I was just passing it on. Go ahead and tell us another story of what a great guy you are.
i never respected you as a cop, but i never realized until the past few days how much you whine and beg people for approval. You remind me of a teenaged girl
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Then by all means, share what you know I said. Let’s hear it.
I took ten mins and searched Uvalde and nhbbear and I came up with two pages of threads where Uvalde is mentioned, but you know what isn’t mentioned? Me saying they did the right thing by holding back. I tried going through one of the main Uvalde threads and I got 20/183 pages in and quit.
But I copied and pasted my responses word for word. They all seem to say basically the same thing-the shooting gutted me and the inaction by the police made me sick and ashamed and I said there was no way I wasn’t going in that school orders be damned.
These are snippets from a dozen different threads and are out of context, but these are my words.
So here ya go:
I don’t agree with the uvalde decision to not go in, disgusts me, actually. But risking your life for kids is different from doing it to rescue a man that did this to himself
Oh, sweet baby Jesus I am so thankful, oh Lord, that you weren’t around here for Uvalde.
Not likely a chance in hell you would have blasted those fucking cowards more than I did. That day gutted me on a personal level and on a professional level to see such cowardice (at the command level and for the officers refusing to break with obviously wrong orders).
Oh no. I gave my life serving my community in an honorable fashion. I am so ashamed. I actually am ashamed at some of the shithead cops out there as I have always been, now I feel guilty that I retired and have no ability to shape the officers-but then there is the fact that I now have a masters and will start teaching adjunct courses starting in the summer. So, we are now academic bros. Want to make a secret handshake so at some academia function, we will know each other and can embrace?
Dude is a fucking stud. Uvalde officers, fucking take note!
I don’t think it is a secret how I feel about defunding the police, but I think it was so very little to do with Uvalde. I think it was more to do with the inability to make a decision by the chief. However much I dislike my former chief, I know he would give the order to enter and would have races to get there himself. I would have given that order immediately the second an active shooter was confirmed.
I was never a traffic cop-I have little use for them and I, like everyone else, cringe when I see a cop on the side of the road when I am going 15 mph over the limit, but I also accept responsibility for my actions if I get caught doing what I know is against the traffic laws, so “road pirates” don’t pilfer money, they punish stupidity and nail reckless drivers that put everyone at risk. I do not approve of what we used to call “chickenshit stops” or pretextual stops, but assholes on the road need to face some repercussions for dangerous driving.
Second, without cops-which you said you would love, who is going to respond to crimes in progress-you? Ok
And Uvalde disgusted and gutted me by the law enforcement response, but that incident and parkland are the exception to how most officers would respond to an active shooting. For every incident like Uvalde, I could counter with hundreds of examples where police did not bitch out and took on active shooters.
And help me out, I can’t tell whether you are a far right anti cop person or far left. Road pirates is a term used by copblock turds but also occasionally by sovereign citizen types and saying cops were “costumes” is also used by both sides.so which side of that douchebag coin do you fall on?
Again, did you post the thread about the story you are whining about? You got one, maybe two stories where cops pussed out and I lambasted them for their cowardice. It pisses me off probably way more than it does you. And how do you figure I care more about cops than children? The Uvalde shooting, cops response aside, gutted me as did the newtown shootings. I have three kids, asshole.
Ok, I will weigh in here. As a police officer, you are not responsible for preventing crimes before they happen. There was the Supreme Court case where there was a stabbing on a subway and people sued the police for not stopping the crime. The scotus ruled that police are not responsible for crimes that occur.
With that said, there are times when dereliction of duty comes into play. A cop driving by a flaming car accident and not stopping would be subject to such charges, but that does not require the cop to insert themselves into the wreckage to retrieve the person. More on this in a moment…
As that applies to Uvalde, police are not required to put themselves into the line of fire to stop a crime in progress. It doesn’t make much sense to me either. I started my career wanting to take on violent crimes and all that but ended my career more protecting the public and put myself at risk many times. I had people spitting on the top of my head while I plugged bullet wounds after being shot at and have been kicked in the face trying to revive a downed person on two occasions. I have also gone one on one with a guy with an ar and I had a .40. I didn’t wait for backup, I just went. So I know what I am doing at uvalde no matter what the co says. I am going in that school and job be damned. I know most other police officers feel the same, but in this situation, they put their faith in a gutless commander and hesitated.
As to the burning car, not to detail, but I have always wondered that if a cop arrived on the scene of a fiery, but mostly peaceful accident, and someone was burning alive-what would happen if they shot the person to put them out of their misery?
first, the police fuckup in Uvalde has nothing to do with the rest of law enforcement
second, nbc is responsible for what has their name on it, especially when they don’t put the “the opinions are those of the author and not nbc
Third, I have seen zero pro cop pieces and I actually looked
Uvalde and stone Douglas schools are the biggest cop fuck-ups in any mass shooting. Their responses were abysmal. I will never defend that and it guts me. It idiots like you like to paint all cops with the Uvalde incident or george floyd and say this is systemic and it is racist and every cop is part of that system…..so what cops did was essentially answer their calls and do nothing more. No more traffic stops, no more proactive policing. And it shows in the crime statistics with violent crime rising in many areas where it was never that high before. Oh, we’re going too tough on those hardened criminals and we should back off and when he shoots someone, larry krasner will let him out on bond because he “doesn’t want to lock more poc up. He has even quoted and I found it somewhere, that he will not prosecute felons in possession of a firearm because it overwhelmingly affects poc. Well, duh, dipshit. The felon thugs and animals are the ones that are carrying guns and dropping bodies in the streets. He o Lt cares when it is a police officer that shot someone and he will go out of his way even when the evidence says it’s a losing case, to prosecute cops and the best is that they add a unique charge “using an instrument of crime-“ which is of course, a gun. He blames the nra for the violence in Philly streets. Yeah, it’s the nra guys shooting us the streets instead of his beloved criminals.
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Alivia Schwab is the lady that got killed for your googling purposes.
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You know what pisses me off-I had a response for your long post with the blue highlights. I got busy over the weekend and worked 12 hours on Sunday, so when I went to finish the post, it was completely gone. I actually agreed with you on some points. But I still maintain that at the end of the day, he attacked a cop with a brick and responding with lethal force while his arm is drawn back is a good shoot. Problem arises because of the time it takes to perceive the threat, make a decision, then react and by that time, the brick may already be airborn.
And yes, I did call you in here to debate cases. My guess was that you had the balls and knowledge to actually take me up on my offer, and you did, so good on you. There’s plenty to choose from-we don’t have to spend our whole time on this one case. Pick another.
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No You didn't. At best you were a lazy ass pos bragging about writing fictional stories on Sherdog while on the Governments time. Does not reconcile with "Honorable." Try again.
