Somebody please show me the receipts!

[ComfortablyNumb55]

Jones wanted 30 million to fight Francis, I thought?

Then immediately accepted way less to fight Gane.

Lol.

 

[ComfortablyNumb55]

And there it is...

 

[Shilajit]

and Jon Jones struggled against Dominick Reyes and a guy who had 2 blown out knees. just because Jon Jones took Gane down and submitted him immediately doesn't mean he can do that to Ngannou.

there's still many questions to be answered for HW Jon. can he take the HW power, how does he look in a prolonged fight? does he have the stamina to go 5 rds if that's what it takes? does his strength carry throughout the fight?

I think Jones was kind of going through the motions during some of his fights.

Much like we seen against OSP. When they did the round table thing pre gane, Smith, Rashad and DC basically said they didn't feel Jones was as motivated during the end of his LHW tenure.

There's all this talk about fear, but it's actually that fear and butterflies which allows you to perform at your absolute best as an athlete. Something we see in many sports.

Someone like Jones needs to have that in the back of his head, especially when he's been doing this for so long. You need an obstacle to overcome, a challenge or test.

It's the same healthy fear and butterflies that GSP admitted he has for all of his fights. He admitted he can never sleep before his fights, but before he fought Serra, be slept like a baby.

You could argue that peak DC would beat any HW that has ever lived. I think a lot of those questions were answered against him.

The Jones who fought him was not the same one we seen during the end of his LHW career.

After watching DC 2 several times, I'm convinced that DC was his hardest matchup and that nobody presents the same difficulty that DC did, whether it's at LHW or HW. I just don't see it.

Comparatively speaking, he's a very bad style opponent for a lot of these guys. Including Francis. We seen Gane nullify Franks boxing, forcing him to wrestle.

Jones controls the kicking distance and uses it to mitigate damage better than any MMA fighter that has ever lived.

Historically speaking, we've seen how difficult it is for an opponent with a boxing dominant attack to get inside that range and actually hit him cleanly.

And this isn't even factoring in the wrestling. I think you'd see a much more tentative Francis on the feet, knowing that one small mistake and overextension would end up with him on his back.


This can be a hard concept to grasp, but I've always said Jones tougher matchups are in lighter weight classes currently. More well rounded, younger, better recorded, better takedown defense and scrambling ability. More diverse style on the feet. The heavyweights have far more holes, on top of being slower, older, etc.

 

[Shilajit]

Jones wanted 30 million to fight Francis, I thought?

Then immediately accepted way less to fight Gane.

Lol.

Jones was already signed to fight for the HW belt before we knew for certain that Ngannou was gone. They already had a date and booked the arena for March 4th back in December.

I would imagine he got a substantial pay increase, as he seemed very happy and said many times that he's grateful and feels appreciated by the organization. Which essentially means, the UFC gave in.

The 30 million figure is what Dana said. We all know how Dana is when it comes to airing out negotiations in public.

It's clear he wanted more money and rightfully so. He's one of the biggest stars in the sport and moving up to fight for the HW title. He would be a fool if he didn't fight for what he's worth, same with Francis.

 

[AmonTobin]

Jones was already signed to fight for the HW belt before we knew for certain that Ngannou was gone. They already had a date and booked the arena for March 4th back in December.

I would imagine he got a substantial pay increase, as he seemed very happy and said many times that he's grateful and feels appreciated by the organization. Which essentially means, the UFC gave in.

The 30 million figure is what Dana said. We all know how Dana is when it comes to airing out negotiations in public.

It's clear he wanted more money and rightfully so. He's one of the biggest stars in the sport and moving up to fight for the HW title. He would be a fool if he didn't fight for what he's worth, same with Francis.

I think Jones was kind of going through the motions during some of his fights.

Much like we seen against OSP. When they did the round table thing pre gane, Smith, Rashad and DC basically said they didn't feel Jones was as motivated during the end of his LHW tenure.

There's all this talk about fear, but it's actually that fear and butterflies which allows you to perform at your absolute best as an athlete. Something we see in many sports.

Someone like Jones needs to have that in the back of his head, especially when he's been doing this for so long. You need an obstacle to overcome, a challenge or test.

It's the same healthy fear and butterflies that GSP admitted he has for all of his fights. He admitted he can never sleep before his fights, but before he fought Serra, be slept like a baby.

You could argue that peak DC would beat any HW that has ever lived. I think a lot of those questions were answered against him.

The Jones who fought him was not the same one we seen during the end of his LHW career.

After watching DC 2 several times, I'm convinced that DC was his hardest matchup and that nobody presents the same difficulty that DC did, whether it's at LHW or HW. I just don't see it.

Comparatively speaking, he's a very bad style opponent for a lot of these guys. Including Francis. We seen Gane nullify Franks boxing, forcing him to wrestle.

Jones controls the kicking distance and uses it to mitigate damage better than any MMA fighter that has ever lived.

Historically speaking, we've seen how difficult it is for an opponent with a boxing dominant attack to get inside that range and actually hit him cleanly.

And this isn't even factoring in the wrestling. I think you'd see a much more tentative Francis on the feet, knowing that one small mistake and overextension would end up with him on his back.


This can be a hard concept to grasp, but I've always said Jones tougher matchups are in lighter weight classes currently. More well rounded, younger, better recorded, better takedown defense and scrambling ability. More diverse style on the feet. The heavyweights have far more holes, on top of being slower, older, etc.

So Jones took the easiest possible HW fight in Gane, based on the terrible style matching. We already knew that. Thank you for the epic wall of text. So many excuses, so little proof. Who you think would win is completely irrelevant to the question of who was going to fight who.

 

[Shilajit]

So Jones took the easiest possible HW fight in Gane, based on the terrible style matching. We already knew that. Thank you for the epic wall of text. So many excuses, so little proof. Who you think would win is completely irrelevant to the question of who was going to fight who.

You're not always going to have an outright announcement. Especially when they were waiting to see what Francis did.

Chael Sonnen said he was back though and the UFC was looking to book Jones Ngannou back in September.

The UFC released a date for Jones return to the media, booked an arena and all, which is the date he ended up fighting on.

They also offered Ngannou a 3 fight deal with the 8 million dollar Jones fight as the main bargaining chip to get him to stay with the organization. As we've established before, the UFC isn't going to offer such a fight in a legal binding document unless they knew for certain that Jones was committed to fighting for the belt.

The article you posted has Ngannou himself essentially admitting he could've took the fight if he wanted to but decided against it.

So, you're arguing with his own words.


This is all circumstantial evidence. It's not direct evidence. But it indicates that there's a high probability Jones was signed by this point.

Otherwise why book a date? Why would the UFC hype his comeback in the media if he wasn't even signed?

It doesn't make any sense and if you pay attention to how the UFC operates historically when it comes to negotiations, they don't get ahead of themselves.

Imagine if during the middle of contract negotiations, The UFC started hyping his comeback. Created a date. Told the media to hype his comeback but they weren't even sure he would sign.

Does that make any sense? No.

 

[AmonTobin]

You're not always going to have an outright announcement. Especially when they were waiting to see what Francis did.

Chael Sonnen said he was back though and the UFC was looking to book Jones Ngannou back in September.

The UFC released a date for Jones return to the media, booked an arena and all, which is the date he ended up fighting on.

They also offered Ngannou a 3 fight deal with the 8 million dollar Jones fight as the main bargaining chip to get him to stay with the organization. As we've established before, the UFC isn't going to offer such a fight in a legal binding document unless they knew for certain that Jones was committed to fighting for the belt.

The article you posted has Ngannou himself essentially admitting he could've took the fight if he wanted to but decided against it.

So, you're arguing with his own words.


This is all circumstantial evidence. It's not direct evidence. But it indicates that there's a high probability Jones was signed by this point.

Otherwise why book a date? Why would the UFC hype his comeback in the media if he wasn't even signed?

It doesn't make any sense and if you pay attention to how the UFC operates historically when it comes to negotiations, they don't get ahead of themselves.

Imagine if during the middle of contract negotiations, The UFC started hyping his comeback. Created a date. Told the media to hype his comeback but they weren't even sure he would sign.

Does that make any sense? No.

They wouldnt do any of this stuff to someone they don't know for sure will fight.

Your hot air is endless. Man at least on Twitter there’s a character limit.

 

[Shilajit]

So Jones took the easiest possible HW fight in Gane, based on the terrible style matching. We already knew that. Thank you for the epic wall of text. So many excuses, so little proof. Who you think would win is completely irrelevant to the question of who was going to fight who.

It's not about who I think would win..but it would take someone who doesn't understand how to analyze fights to genuinely believe Jones dodged this fight because he's a pussy coward. As you have suggested.

The whole premise to your belief starts with low MMA IQ.

And you're so invested in this that you ignore every piece of information that suggests otherwise.

Even Ngannou's own words. Who himself said that he could've taken the fight if he wanted to, but decided on another path.

 

[kalabula]

This site https://www.insidesport.in/jones-vs...-jones-earn-by-beating-ciryl-gane-at-ufc-285/
Says Jones made about 6.2 million for the Gane fight. If these numbers are to be believed, then Jon DID in fact ask for way more than he got for the Gane fight. That being said, who cares? Nobody is “scared” to fight each other. They are being smart about there very short window of opportunity to make money.

 

[Shilajit]

Your hot air is endless. Man at least on Twitter there’s a character limit.

And sadly, you still have nothing to say.

You speak of evidence but where's the evidence for the crazy claims youve made?

You actually said in this very thread that maybe Jones signed but he would only fight if the title is vacant.

That's how far from reality you are that you'll just continue to move the goal post to satisfy your awful takes.

 

[AmonTobin]

It's not about who I think would win..but it would take someone who doesn't understand how to analyze fights to genuinely believe Jones dodged this fight because he's a pussy coward. As you have suggested.

The whole premise to your belief starts with low MMA IQ.

And you're so invested in this that you ignore every piece of information that suggests otherwise.

Even Ngannou's own words. Who himself said that he could've taken the fight if he wanted to, but decided on another path.

You haven’t said a single thing that proves Jones wanted anything to do with Ngannou. This is complete and utter denial. Why are you still here?

 

[Shilajit]

This site https://www.insidesport.in/jones-vs...-jones-earn-by-beating-ciryl-gane-at-ufc-285/
Says Jones made about 6.2 million for the Gane fight. If these numbers are to be believed, then Jon DID in fact ask for way more than he got for the Gane fight. That being said, who cares? Nobody is “scared” to fight each other. They are being smart about there very short window of opportunity to make money.

Official websites say Conor got 3 mil for his last few fights as well.

The UFC never releases the real details of contracts to the public. Only tidbits.

And again, every indication is that Jones had already reached an agreement before Ngannou left. So it doesn't matter who he fought, same bag.

 

[AmonTobin]

And sadly, you still have nothing to say.

You speak of evidence but where's the evidence for the crazy claims youve made?

You actually said in this very thread that maybe Jones signed but he would only fight if the title is vacant.

That's how far from reality you are that you'll just continue to move the goal post to satisfy your awful takes.

More gaslighting and personal attacks when you can’t backup your theory.

 

[Shilajit]

You haven’t said a single thing that proves Jones wanted anything to do with Ngannou. This is complete and utter denial. Why are you still here?

So then answer the question.

If Ngannou was In the middle of negotiations, imagine if the UFC started promoting him, Chael said he was back, a date was released for his return.

When he wasn't even actually signed yet.

Would that make any sense or seem like something the UFC would do?

 

[Shilajit]

More gaslighting and personal attacks when you can’t backup your theory.

I've provided virtually every piece of circumstantial evidence possible to back up my 'theory' actually.

It's just a matter of reading between the lines. Which you are obviously incapable of doing.

No clue how you're even talking about denial. You're one of the biggest cases of denial I've ever seen in this site, lol.

You literally won't accept any piece of information that doesn't validate this idea that Jones is a pussy.

It's sad really. And I've been respectful up until this point but this is just full retard.

 

[AmonTobin]

I've provided virtually every piece of circumstantial evidence possible to back up my 'theory' actually.

It's just a matter of reading between the lines. Which you are obviously incapable of doing.

No clue how you're even talking about denial. You're one of the biggest cases of denial I've ever seen in this site, lol.

You literally won't accept any piece of information that doesn't validate this idea that Jones is a pussy.

It's sad really. And I've been respectful up until this point but this is just full retard.

Where’s the proof that Jon Jones wanted to fight Ngannou and was going to fight Ngannou? That’s all I’m asking. I don’t need these long winded run arounds. Just shows us the proof or for the love of god stop talking.

 

[Shilajit]

Where’s the proof that Jon Jones wanted to fight Ngannou and was going to fight Ngannou? That’s all I’m asking. I don’t need these long winded run arounds. Just shows us the proof or for the love of god stop talking.

Ive provided every sort of proof that exists in this case. It's just a matter of critical thought and connecting the dots.

The circumstantial evidence is pretty clear in the direction of Jones being signed long before Ngannou had actually left. Which comes from many sources.

Again, Chael wouldn't be hyping his return, saying he's back and the UFC wouldnt release a date for his comeback, booking an arena and all for a fighter they were still negotiating with. They also wouldn't have offered Ngannou the deal they did without that certainty.

When the UFC is negotiating with a fighter, they make it very clear to the public. Because it's one of the tactics they use to apply pressure. Just as they did with Ngannou up until his eventual departure.

They wouldn't be acting like he was back, even going as far to book a date for someone they were still negotiating with.

 

[Shilajit]

Where’s the proof that Jon Jones wanted to fight Ngannou and was going to fight Ngannou? That’s all I’m asking. I don’t need these long winded run arounds. Just shows us the proof or for the love of god stop talking.

Ngannou said he was offered the fight and could have taken it, but turned it down and subsequently left the UFC. He said one of his biggest career regrets will be not finding Jones.

Your response - Jones is a pussy coward.

Do you not see how backwards this is?

And you're so invested in this that it would literally take the gods to come down from the heavens themselves to convince you otherwise.

 

[AmonTobin]

Ive provided every sort of proof that exists in this case. It's just a matter of critical thought and connecting the dots.

The circumstantial evidence is pretty clear in the direction of Jones being signed long before Ngannou had actually left. Which comes from many sources.

Again, Chael wouldn't be hyping his return, saying he's back and the UFC wouldnt release a date for his comeback, booking an arena and all for a fighter they were still negotiating with. They also wouldn't have offered Ngannou the deal they did without that certainty.

When the UFC is negotiating with a fighter, they make it very clear to the public. Because it's one of the tactics they use to apply pressure. Just as they did with Ngannou up until his eventual departure.

They wouldn't be acting like he was back, even going as far to book a date for someone they were still negotiating with.

Hey pussy. You still there?

You’ve got nothing. Empty handed. Denial is a powerful thing.

 

[Deleted member 513083]

Where’s the proof that Jon Jones wanted to fight Ngannou and was going to fight Ngannou? That’s all I’m asking. I don’t need these long winded run arounds. Just shows us the proof or for the love of god stop talking.

No offense bro, I see no proof of him not wanting to fight him either.
There might be no 100% proof he wanted to, there is also no proof he wouldn't have done it.

Seems more like you can't stand Jones, which is understandable he is an asshole, but Jones is crazy I fully expect him to be willing to fight anybody for the right prize but again there is no such thing as 100% proof other than leaks and while he did take a bit too long for his step up to HW imo, there is no proof he wasn't gonna fight Ngannou under the right conditions.(Pay)