russians and bjj??

I like Sambo as a sport and martial art. It is pretty rare to find a sport sambo school in the states and I think it could be quite useful, sort of being a hybrid of Judo and wrestling with leglocks in the mix.

I think it is a nice art that has enough groundwork and plenty of takedowns.

As for what is trained in Russia I think it is an issue of availability.
Just like in judo there are guys that I am sure have a love for the groundowrk. Those guys might be more inclined to pick up BJJ as a style if it were available to them.
 
Its so simple. BJJ is generally one dimensional, a ground art. While sambo is basicly MMA. Just the grappling aspect of sambo includes more standup than bjj. Not to mention combat sambo which includes striking as well.

So obviously bjj will be better for ground game and you will have to do a lot of cross training for MMA. Sambo will make you a better freestyle fighter than pure bjj. With sambo you will need little cross training for MMA.

A better question is: What is the better strategy. Train one aspect of fighting first to near perfection (BJJ) or to train most aspects from the get go (Sambo)?
 
For better understanding what is Sambo or Cobat Sambo you have to know history of Sambo.
Basicly Sambo includ.. all Martial Art's from around world including Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.
Please read all info and history about Sambo!!!

Um... Sambo was created about the same time that the Gracies opened their first academy. You can't make an argument that BJJ was influenced Sambo until much, much later. I think the earliest cross-competition probably started around the 70s or 80s. BJJ and Sambo are not better than each other. This thread sounds like something I'd see at judoforum.com and their "BJJ=Basically Just Judo" people. :rolleyes:

Sambo included European CACC/pro-wrestling, Japanese jujutsu and especially judo, and native Russian martial arts. I think Sambo was originally comparable to MCMAP or US Army Modern Combatives. Later the sport variety was developed for the Olympics. I don't think Combat Sambo competitions started until recently (again like the 70s or 80s or even the 90s).
 
Its so simple. BJJ is generally one dimensional, a ground art. While sambo is basicly MMA. Just the grappling aspect of sambo includes more standup than bjj. Not to mention combat sambo which includes striking as well.

So obviously bjj will be better for ground game and you will have to do a lot of cross training for MMA. Sambo will make you a better freestyle fighter than pure bjj. With sambo you will need little cross training for MMA.

A better question is: What is the better strategy. Train one aspect of fighting first to near perfection (BJJ) or to train most aspects from the get go (Sambo)?

I don't know weather to argue that Sambo will make you a better freestyle fighter than pure BJJ.
 
This thread sounds like something I'd see at judoforum.com and their "BJJ=Basically Just Judo" people. :rolleyes:

You have to admit that some of the threads at judoinfo are pretty entertaining though ... especially when you get the "BJJ=Basically Just Judo" people arguing with the traditionalists who think that any judo developed after Kano's death is bad judo (though some make allowances for Mifune) ... since BJJ was mainly developed after Kano it can't be good judo (for that matter, Kimura and Yamashita have bad judo as well, and what's being done in the olympics nowadays probably shouldn't even be called judo) for the one group, whereas BJJ is good judo by a different name for the other. I like to read those threads with a big bowl of popcorn myself :icon_twis

One of the little known facts about judo you'll learn is that Kano hated competition and sport. His trip to Europe shortly before his death to talk to the IOC was really either subterfuge (he was trying to trick them into thinking he liked the idea of sport judo, because talking to the IOC was the best way to make sure judo would never be in the olympics), or based on a misunderstanding (he thought the olympic movement was about kata ... track kata, soccer kata etc) and left as soon as he realized the olympics was about competition.

BTW, there are some really good threads and posters on judoinfo as well ... in fact most posters are pretty good. But there are some who live in a different reality.
 
nope cause they have wrestling coaches, and fedor was almost subbed by mark hunt so his ground defence does ave flaws, if he had 10bjj blackbelts training with him he would probably never been in that situaiotn.

Fedor carried Hunt in that fight, he jsut gave him the kimura to make an excitng fight and escape
 
another random vid, i just typed "bjj vs sambo" on youtube

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That is the Sambo vs BJJ event, it went down 7-5 BJJ won but barely. Its sad but they happen to cut out all of Sambo guys victories in that event highlight. Some of the Sambo players had no business being in there except for Koulikov and Oleg guys. Those guys didn't even train for the guard or anything it was more sport Sambo.

Sambo I believe is on the same level of BJJ.
 
I don't know weather to argue that Sambo will make you a better freestyle fighter than pure BJJ.

Some people say its more effective to perfect one style first.

But at this point in the sport it's to early to go either way. 95% of all fighters who have trained for more than 10 years started with one thing. Most fighters that have a mixed background have not trained nearly as long. So hardly a fair comparison and majority of the top fighters having a singular background reflects this very disparity in training time.

To have a fair comparison you need two fighters who started around the same age. One starts with freestyle, another starts with one specific art.

Sambo will make you a freestyle fighter from the beginning, and you will definitely be more well rounded that a pure bjj'ist. But when the bjj'er start cross training with other things he will also become well rounded.

Which is the better strategy is still a question that remains to be answered.
 
That is the Sambo vs BJJ event, it went down 7-5 BJJ won but barely. Its sad but they happen to cut out all of Sambo guys victories in that event highlight. Some of the Sambo players had no business being in there except for Koulikov and Oleg guys. Those guys didn't even train for the guard or anything it was more sport Sambo.

Sambo I believe is on the same level of BJJ.

Yeah, I was there at that event too. It was a close event. Not a clear indication by any means. The two losses on the sambo side = 1 by DQ and another guy who had no business being there. In all honesty, it was a very even night. The other mtahces were very competative and exciting.

In the end, I think it is about who knows what they do better than the other guy. Not about which art is better than the other. It depends on what your goals are, what you are training for, etc.

About training in Russia, I have trained at Borec and Sambo 70. Sambo 70 is very sport sambo/judo oriented. Not combat sambo at all. Borec was much more progressive, more ground work, no gi, judo, sport sambo, sumo. A more well rounded experience than Sambo 70 IMO. My coach however (who has left the US and runs a club in St.Petersberg), was a combat sambo guy and we did tons of chokes, strikes, gi, no-gi, etc. His club is still linked with the military there.

I have also cross trained some catch, BJJ, judo, etc, and found some differences in perspective, movement, technique, etc. It helped me improve my game for sure. But this is the spirit of sambo anyway...always adding, weeding out, and improving. What I have learned from other arts, I have looked to see how it fits into the principles I have learned from sambo...some fit, some have not, but either way, my game has improved...even simply from knowing what others are doing. Anyone who thinks one art is the best or has all the answers is delusional.

Also, What "sambo" is is a very wide spectrum, so it can be tough to generalize by simply saying sambo. I would say that most people forget that combat sambo came first and included chokes, stikes, ect. Sport sambo took over in popularity later. But now that combat sambo is not limited to military/police, it is spreading more.

In the end, I think one is not better than the other. It simply depends on what you like.
 
Yeah, I was there at that event too. It was a close event. Not a clear indication by any means. The two losses on the sambo side = 1 by DQ and another guy who had no business being there. In all honesty, it was a very even night. The other mtahces were very competative and exciting.

In the end, I think it is about who knows what they do better than the other guy. Not about which art is better than the other. It depends on what your goals are, what you are training for, etc.

About training in Russia, I have trained at Borec and Sambo 70. Sambo 70 is very sport sambo/judo oriented. Not combat sambo at all. Borec was much more progressive, more ground work, no gi, judo, sport sambo, sumo. A more well rounded experience than Sambo 70 IMO. My coach however (who has left the US and runs a club in St.Petersberg), was a combat sambo guy and we did tons of chokes, strikes, gi, no-gi, etc. His club is still linked with the military there.

I have also cross trained some catch, BJJ, judo, etc, and found some differences in perspective, movement, technique, etc. It helped me improve my game for sure. But this is the spirit of sambo anyway...always adding, weeding out, and improving. What I have learned from other arts, I have looked to see how it fits into the principles I have learned from sambo...some fit, some have not, but either way, my game has improved...even simply from knowing what others are doing. Anyone who thinks one art is the best or has all the answers is delusional.

Also, What "sambo" is is a very wide spectrum, so it can be tough to generalize by simply saying sambo. I would say that most people forget that combat sambo came first and included chokes, stikes, ect. Sport sambo took over in popularity later. But now that combat sambo is not limited to military/police, it is spreading more.

In the end, I think one is not better than the other. It simply depends on what you like.

SamboSteve I was not there in fact I just quoted what I read/ what you wrote on WWG forum . I just happen to really enjoy Sambo and want to learn it badly.
 
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I was watching ufc 5,and when Oleg was walking down the isle they said that he had won multiple Euripean judo,and jiujitsu titles.
 
Don't pay attention to the name as much as what particular fighter does. Many Russian fighters don't practice BJJ persay, but they do use many of the position and submissions that BJJ made famous.

As well as working the other way, BJJ lacked many of the leg submissions that were popular in Sambo. The original innovators of BJJ like Rolls Gracie went over and practice with many sambo guys to learn how to submit the legs in fighting situation.

So it's not so much the name as much as the influence.
 
1- their pride 2- they have a similiar fighting system already in Sambo 3- Sambo is less gay then bjj, LOL...
 
rickson recently said he was 100% sure he could take fedor - end of thread
 
When was he almost subbed by Hunt? When hunt was attempting a submission wrong, and Fedor wasn't worried?

Fedor would two fights with Nog without even coming close to being caught in a submission.

sometimes you don
 
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