Rogan says Ngannou is perfect speciesman for HW. How could he be physically better?

[Shaddows]

He says Ngannous is a natural 265lber cutting a little or no weight to make 265lbs, is mostly muscle. Important note Francis did weigh in the high 250s before as I recall


Anyone know what is the lightest Francis ever weighed?


Id say be 6"6, with 86 inch reach. Francis could be taller, 6"4 is still in the range of average for a HW

That is, until he finds a grinder that he can't put away in the first/second round.
Then Rogan will tell us all about how he is too big, and that you need oxygen to feed those muscles, and that's why Francis tires so easily...

 

[Hatorade]

I tend to agree with all your points except height.
As the late great trainer Manny Stewart said, optimum height for a HW is 6'4-5, anything taller and a fighter becomes "chinny" and is easier to knock down and tends to have less stable "legs"

look at boxing for the last 20 years. it's mostly been guys over 6'5"

I do agree that when guys get that tall they're not as good on their feet.

optimal size for a HW might be under the 265 weight limit. part of me thinks that a LHW version of Jones is the best build and size for a HW as well. Who really beats a 230lb prime John Jones before he starts his cut. The answer is probably nobody including Francis. If Fedor and Randy could Dominate the HW division at under 230lbs, Jones with his 6'4" frame and unreal reach certainly could have.

who knows?

 

[Candy Routure]

He’s effective, but I wouldn’t necessarily call him fluid.

He’s going to get his head onocked off once someone isn’t scared to throw bombs down the pipe!!

I like Francis’ attitude, but he’s extremely sloppy. Guys get gun shy because of his power and aura.. BB isn’t afraid!

 

[Oceanmachine]

That is, until he finds a grinder that he can't put away in the first/second round.
Then Rogan will tell us all about how he is too big, and that you need oxygen to feed those muscles, and that's why Francis tires so easily...

Lol so true. He flips always

And when Stipe lost he blamed probably Stipe beibg too skinny and not enoigh power. Which I believe is legit

 

[Bacco]

He’s effective, but I wouldn’t necessarily call him fluid.

He's not fluid in that clip, i agree
Keep composure in the heat of a fight is not everybody's thing, specially if tired
But during training session vid (was training kickboxing iirc) i seen him move in a way you don't see everyday in a such big/heavy guy, specially in MMA where the skill level of HWs is not ever stellar.
Like fluid elastic movements, relatively good balance, not letting the momentum/weight ruin much the trajectory... even on training i guess many of the heaviest UFC HWs will have difficulties at display that

It’s amazing that he can be so lean at such a heavy weight. Most big guys at that size look more like Derrick Lewis than they do Ngannou. George Foreman at 260 pounds looked like the Pilsbury Doughnoy.

I think is because his natural weight is lower, then he got buff to get heavier
Overeem was similar

 

[Swepingright]

I may be wrong, but technique is not part of athleticism for how i see it

Athleticism is the raw body potential in terms of speed, strenght, explosivity, stamina etc etc

Technique are the artificial movements we teach our body to do, including timing, precision etc

The two things combined (plus the psychologic side) make the performance of the fighter

I agree his technique is'nt great, but his athelticism is formidable for MMA HW standards

He's a mixed bag. Some things he does scary good, but his balance, guard and posture can be really bad at times.

 

[Bacco]

what about Carwin? he's like a mixture of Brock and Ngannou.

Carwin was overall a slighty inferior Brock (size, strenght, speed, agility), but with more power in his hands and incredible toughness (i remember the JDS massacre)
He was another roid monster, specially just-before UFC

Yeah he was impressive too
Too bad he gassed the fuck out himself in the Brock fight, remember be lot disappointed because if he keept his cool he would have possibly TKOd Lesnar in the 2nd... instead he threw everything he had on Lesnars forearms, likely without breath
At such size/muscle mass good luck at recover the gas tank

 

[danny23]

Brock should come back and take the title from Ngannou, it will be like the hunt fight.

Brock couldn’t take a punch from Cain and Randy. Francis puts him in a coffin within 20 seconds.

 

[TheAmericanGazelle]

I might argue some of his power is surplus and could be traded against more cardio-friendly builds to create a somewhat more optimal build overall.

Of course, if he is KTFOing people in R1 or R2 it might end up being a moot point.

 

[bogeyj]

the downplay of Ngannou on here isn't surprising

you have people here saying Brock would beat him.

BROCK.

the guy who runs away when he gets punched <45>

 

[Bouboumaster]

Lacks cardio but that's it.

He has power like we've never seen before and he also has a chin made of pure steel.

I mean, what else could you ask for? The dude's almost a human cheat code.

 

[Poatan Power]

No he has a big frame, big reach 80 inches, is 6"4. 235ish to 245lbs. Him in the mid 230s is him without as much msucle mass which is a mistake. His peak form is 246 which he was in thr 1st Ngannou fight. If he roided he could be in 250s and more explosive

Okay...

Stipe: 6'4", 234, 80"
Francis: 6'4", 263, 83"
Brock: 6'3", 280-285, 81"
Mirko: 6'2", 234, 73"
Nog: 6'3", 240, 78"
Mir: 6'3", 262, 79"
Bigfoot: 6'4", 265+, 80"
Nelson: 6'0", 265+, 72"

I'll give you that Stipe has the reach and height of a HW, but he still isn't "big" compared to his opponents. I don't know what else to call him but a small HW because I feel like if he were any smaller he'd be a LHW. If you're under 230 I think you go to LHW and he's right there. People cut from 195-200 to hit 170, so he may be able to. But you're right, his frame is not small -- he's tall and long like a HW.

 

[TerryBogard]

@danny23

He took shots fine from both of them( cain landed an uppercut which made him lose his balance and then a punch to the back of the head after) and didnt even flinch at hunts punches. Ngannou would have a very hard time going for his wild haymakers against brock as he would easily take him down as soon as he tried throwing those punches and we all know ngannou is like a fish out of water on the ground and would get absolutely smashed by brock on the ground.

 

[Siver!]

Joe's clearly wrong.

The perfect specimen for MMA is this somewhat plain-looking, short, doughy, non-ripped heavyweight:

 

[Telford90]

No he is not. And the competition was weaker back then and brock tested for roids



Brock coulsnt make the NFL and tested positive for banned subtances thus cheating and was arrested in College for banned subtances his body was built on drugs. To favor Brock who is afraid to get hit, cant handle pain and sat down and got beat by Overeem is delusion or maybe just racism projection to downplay the 1st African champion and to favor a big white man over a black one.

Grow up mate. These kind of comments do nothing to help reasonable discussion.

 

[Venom]

Few improvements 6'6", 265+ lean (if not already), coordinated like prime Velasquez

He already has long arms, short torso, long legs, already strong, explosive.

 

[danny23]

@danny23

He took shots fine from both of them( cain landed an uppercut which made him lose his balance and then a punch to the back of the head after) and didnt even flinch at hunts punches. Ngannou would have a very hard time going for his wild haymakers against brock as he would easily take him down as soon as he tried throwing those punches and we all know ngannou is like a fish out of water on the ground and would get absolutely smashed by brock on the ground.

https://youtube.com/shorts/kte2KHsckFc?feature=share


Francis’ takedown defense was enough to deal with Stipe it’ll be more than enough to deal with Lesnar who struggled taking down an undersized Randy.
What’s Brock going to do when it stays standing?
He doesn’t have the skill nor power to trouble Francis’s iron chin. Lesnar will be going down in the first exchange.

And he can’t take a punch. He whimpers and crawls into a corner once he takes a hit or a grazing shot, like an abused step child.

 

[Cranberry2.0]

What? What does posting a pic of him next to a fighter from a weight division 60 lbs less than his suppose to prove? lol

I guess you could say he's average sized? He isn't cutting to 265 is the point. Guys that cut to 265 is what I think most of us would refer to as "big" HW's and guys who fall 20 lbs or more under the limit are "small" since there can be a 20-40 lb weight difference on fight night

Ryan Bader is pretty big dude. He's fought at heavyweight as well. Miocic is a much larger man clearly by the picture and yet you don't concede that you're wrong about Miocic being a small heavyweight. Congratulations

 

[johny ringo]

Didn’t he also claim Rousey as once and a lifetime? I like Rohan but he’s promoting…

 

[Vicious Wedgie]

You are talking of an excessively small and biased sample. You can't draw conclusions based on that.
There is no blueprint from the Lewis fight, it was a bizarre anomaly and Ngannou wasn't tired at the end.
And the blueprint from the 1st Stipe fight is likely obsolete. He learned from his mistakes: 1) always come to a fight well conditioned and 2) keep you self control.

With his body type and the way he throws punches it would be impossible for him to go 5 hard rounds clean. I'm not sure what your definition of coming to a fight "well conditioned" is but if it means being able to complete a marathon or triathalon with a semi-respectable time, impossible. If it means going 5 hard rounds, impossible. If it means going 3 hard rounds, unlikely.

In order for Francis to have good stamina he would have to drop muscle mass. Of course, he's not going to do that when he is finishing most of his opponent's in the 1st. However, it leaves a very glaring Achilles heel.