Official Women's Division Discussion #26

Discussion in 'Worldwide MMA Discussion' started by PurpleStorm, Jan 1, 2019.

  1. Eater of Souls

    Eater of Souls Guardian of the Gate

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    There are more atomweight women than there are 145'ers. and the talent level is higher.
     
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  2. Eater of Souls

    Eater of Souls Guardian of the Gate

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    +1

    Meaning: I like many of the Bellator shows. Sure, they do some dumb shit, but so does the UFC.
     
  3. Xuh

    Xuh Black Belt

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    Bro I even trane Bellator, come at me bro

    :meow:
     
  4. Xuh

    Xuh Black Belt

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    Bellator does feel 'UFC lite' but it also does have its own personality, see for instance Ilima entrance for her last bout. Wouldn't get nice things like that in the UFC.

    Most of the stuff they do is pretty lolworthy but that's a kind of fun in itself. Eg Tito Ortiz doing that pro wrestling mask reveal thing, David Rickels walking out with a pet dinosaur, Dave Navarro playing the US national anthem badly on the geetar before Chael vs Wand.

    The only fighter the UFC has allowed to have personal touches like that in recent years is Conman...
     
  5. AimedWithV

    AimedWithV Wound in the Force

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    Are these two natural 105 ers?
     
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  6. Daniel4802

    Daniel4802 Brown Belt

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    105 is my least favorite division - aside from 145. And the only fighter at 105 I enjoy watching is Seo Hee Ham. What other athletic, entertaining fighters are there?

    P.S. If your list includes Bi or Andy Nguyen, (or cardio kickboxing chicks) don't bother responding.
     
  7. Nathanli

    Nathanli Green Belt

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    Alesha Zappitella, Alyse Anderson, Herica Tiburcio, Ashley Cummins, Kyra Batara, Jayme Hinshaw, Lindsey VanZandt, Jillian DeCoursey, Kelly D'Angelo, Amber Brown just to name a few. Not to mention Frey and Grusander. Grace Cleveland is due back early this year after a severe neck injury. Some might need another win or two before they get picked up, but the first 7 would be a good start to a division. Pick up a handful of the best Asian fighters like Ham, Hamasaki, and Asakura, and have a couple girls from 115 drop and you have yourself a pretty good division. Definitely better than 145 and as a whole better than 135 in a year or two.
     
  8. Kaybee

    Kaybee C’est La Vie

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    All the divisions cut; not sure how weight cutting de-legitimizes atomweight when there are natural 125ers in 115, 135ers in 125, 145ers in 135 etc. If weight cutting is banned, then sure 105 would be empty, but ridding of weight cutting in MMA completely is pretty pie-in-the-sky.
     
  9. AimedWithV

    AimedWithV Wound in the Force

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    Unlike others.
    That's what makes the differenve in my eyes.

    Weight classes should exist for fighters who weigh accordingly. Not for those who can cut to it.

    That's why I'm all pro as many divisions as possible, on condition that thereare fighters who will enjoy it as a natural weight.

    That's just my personal opinion of course - but I think it makes sense...
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
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  10. WingsLax9042

    WingsLax9042 Purple Belt

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    Is 105 needed in the UFC? No.
    Can it be a GREAT addition to Bellator? Hell yes.

    Especially when you add in their working relationship with PrideZIN, which has some great atomweights. It would be a big deal if they could essentially take over 145 and 105.
     
  11. Kaybee

    Kaybee C’est La Vie

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    I agree in sentiment, but it just doesn't apply to the current MMA climate. Unfortunately I don't see the weightcutting issue changing anytime soon; there's been so many instances that should have been the catalyst that were just shrugged off days later so I don't see what could finally force the UFC or an AC's hand in stepping in to change things. Until they change things, 105 will be a viable weightclass for women while 145+ will remain a wasteland, and fighters like KH and Carla (if they make weight) would have just as much a claim to be legit atomweights as fighters like Suarez and Joanna have at strawweight.
     
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  12. thatdude21601

    thatdude21601 Bananarama Belt

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    In a similar dynamic to flyweight, I think in some ways Bellator will be able to make an atomweight division better than the UFC. UFC would have the better top end talent, but Bellator can groom younger fighters & fighters from other combat sports in a way UFC just can't (and probably shouldn't).

    Rich Chou historically likes signing lady kickboxers, so I'm gonna post about the tiny kick people I want to see fighting a can on the Bellator prelims this year or next (I've been thinking about this first women's K-1 Grand Prix so a lot of small kickboxers are occupying my mind).

    -That last Rizin confessions with RENA, specifically mentions Bellator as place she might fight (hopefully this last weight cut ordeal was an isolated incident). I'm not sure she's a bust after losing to Asakura, she's still got a mean sprawl and her grappling defense is improving rapidly. Asakura's chain wrestling is a skillset that just not many people have (even amongst good wrestlers). Keep RENA away from Zappitella/Garr/Aono and we'll be back to punching people's guts out.

    -Please somebody book Hyebin Kim in an mma fight. She wrestled at university, is probably the most successful Korean Sanda lady fighter, and just won her pro boxing debut. She's like 24, and her bff Bokyeong Byeon is another tiny sanda lady who's at least 19-2 in muay thai. Sign her up to DAZN too.


    -Shimeng Dai from China. Other than Elaheh Mansourian (who Hyebin Kim^ has fought multiple times), I think Dai has more credentials/medals than any other female sanda fighter. Partly because there's just more events to medal at, but she's a strong wrestler and a good kicker. I'm 90% sure she will be kickboxing or doing mma in GOH/Kunlun/WLF within a year or two. She has a clean win over Bokyeong mentioned above.

    -All Star Gym's Myriame Djedidi & Josephine Lindgren Knutsson. In 2018 Knutsson won 51kg gold at IFMA against the favorite Bui Yen Ly, got robbed in Japan against KANA, fought Lommanee Chalamnoy (a 50kg fighter with a winning record against Loma Lookboonmee in muay thai), and now has a rematch booked against KANA. Djedidi has mostly fought up in weight, but moved to 48kg recently where shewon this years Euro muay thai championships, and was the only person to take a round off of Loma this year at the worlds. Both have posted #mma #plans on their social media.


    -Bellator goes to Italy a few times per year, so you gotta get Jleana Valentino. She's had two competitive fights with RENA ( well before getting arm barred in the MMA fight anyway), and beat both Shootboxing (MIO) & Knockout Kickboxing's (Manazou Kobyashi) 48kg aces in the same night earlier this year. She had an mma fight booked for December before her opponent pulled out.


    -Australian Alma Juniku. Fought Weili Zhang to a decision in 2017 (Juniku was 17 at the time), and this year already beat Wondergirl Jaroonsak, and then KO'd Glory fighter Zaza Sor Aree. She might grow out of being able to make 48kg, but with a fight weight at 53 kg it shouldn't be a huge cut for now.


    -No idea of her name outside of Thai characters (นชนาฏ สิงห์ฉลาด), but the fighter from Lion Martial Arts/Raw Bjj who won the Neo Fight Tournament seems interesting. Also in Thailand curious about the lady who fights for Heroine FC in China (กายรุ้ง ชุ่มชื่น ...don't know her name either, it's not on the English databases).
    Here's นชนาฏ สิงห์ฉลาด squashing televised pro fighter and Thai national team member Supergirl Jaroonsak.



    -Christina Jurjevic, another Aussie fighter. She's got a janky kickbox record, but fights all over the place in terms of weight. Has fought RENA twice, and beat ONE's Kai Ting Chuang.
    https://www.instagram.com/p/BjTXSw1noJx/


    Also shoutout to Candy Wu, Kwok Hoi Ling, Phetnaree (last person to beat Stamp Fairtex), Phetjeejaa, Guan Acui, Dani Fall, Gong Yanli, Amy Pirnie, Selena Flores, those Mexicans at IFMA, and Donut from Yakkao (sorry Thai names are tough).
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
  13. AimedWithV

    AimedWithV Wound in the Force

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    Actually, recently there are some really nice movements up almost in every division.
    And it's been proven effective numerous times - just look at the UFC title pictures today, everywhere (almost).
    Also, weight cutting failures, even deliberate ones, became serious issue in 2018.

    So, in the whole MMA landscape fighters start to feel how bad it is to cut weight. Some fail to do so, some cheat with it, some move up - but the tendency is shown.

    And on this background, to encourage a division which is created ENTIRELY for weight cutters? Neither major leagues nor caring MMA fans should accept it, IMO
     
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  14. Xuh

    Xuh Black Belt

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    To me a 'weight cutter' is one of those guys or gals wrapped in towels trying to sweat out 20+lbs shaking with tremors acting like they're gonna die and stuff.
    Those are the 'weight cheats', the ones damaging themselves, the ones missing weight on the reg.

    Getting in shape, burning off a bit more fat than you usually carry, and maybe sweating out a few lbs no problem to meet a target not too far off what you normally weigh when in shape is a just part of being an athlete to my mind. & I'm sure plenty can do that for atomweight.

    Your last sentence bears the foul stench of trolling ;)
     
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  15. msm1981

    msm1981 Blue Belt

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    To give possible ideas where fighters start at pre weight cut
    Atomweight:115-125 lbs
    Strawweight:130-140 lbs
    Flyweight:140-150 lbs
    Bantamweight:150-165 lbs
    Featherweight:170-185 lbs

    Keep in mind these weights are averages but there maybe one or several
    fighters that are lighter or heavier then the figures mentioned here.
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2019
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  16. AimedWithV

    AimedWithV Wound in the Force

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    What you don't understand is that weight cutting = damaging yourself, no matter whether you see them drained on the weigh ins or not.
    Weight cutting is NOT getting in shape. And burning "a bit more fat" is burning the fat that your body is SUPPOSED to have.
    Weight categories were created initially so the guys with the same size would fight each other, no bigger guys done the same weight in one evening and then got back to their original weight.

    That's why fighters move up and succeed. More and more in 2018.
    That's why other fighters don't even bother to cut to their limit and accept the 20% fine. More and more in 2018. And they have great winning percentage this year.
    This is just two sides of the same coin.

    Yes, plenty can cut to 105. So what? The reason that someone can CUT to 105 is not a good enough reason to create this division.
    I know that it exists, I know that some will cut to it - but I really see NOTHING positive in it.

    Absolutely not. I'm serious about this.
    You wanna enjoy the fights and care about fighters enough for them to stay healthy? Then the division for weight cutters ONLY is the last thing you'd want.
     
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  17. Daniel4802

    Daniel4802 Brown Belt

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    Out of that list, Zappitella is the only one I enjoy watching. Jayme Hinshaw lost to both Bi Nguyen and Cassie. Yikes.
     
  18. MajorTB

    MajorTB Blue Belt

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    Looma Lookboonme will be a must watch for me anytime she fights, and I didn’t see her listed.
     
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  19. Eater of Souls

    Eater of Souls Guardian of the Gate

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    Me too. Razor sharp MT technique. Pure, too.
     
  20. PurpleStorm

    PurpleStorm Green Belt

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    If you get a chance check out Macfarlane v Letourneau from Bellator 213 (December 15 in Honolulu). Macfarlane fighting a few minutes from where she grew up. Dramatic & moving opening featuring native singers & dancers. The fight lived up to the hype. One of my favorites evah!
     
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