New Video on Explosive Power

Forgive me if I'm mistaken, but isn't this all just semantics? I mean, don't all strong acids dissociate in solution? To put that another way, isn't the strength of an acid proportional to it's degree of dissociation in solution?

We say we have hydrochloric acid (HCl) in our stomachs, but it's really H+ and Cl- (or, H30+ and Cl-), because that's what acids do.

Right?

Or am I missing something in this debate?
 
Once an acid donates it's H+ it's no longer an acid by definition, but in this case I'm saying, or at least Robergs is saying and I support his research based on what I've read, that lactic acid is never formed in the body to begin with and net gain in the H+ is coming from elsewhere other than the pathway of lactate formation so it's more than just a matter of semantics.
 
EZA, you were the first one to note that this is a semantics argument (also the one to start it). Why do you go on with it?

For all practical purposes, the terms lactic acid and lactate can be used interchangeably. Also, whether it is a metabolic waste product or a key energy intermediate is still unimportant for all practical purposes.



EDIT:
There is a world of difference in believing that you should train to maximize tolerance to "lactic acid" as the best way to prevent fatigue because its production is responsible for it, as opposed to understanding that lactate production actually helps prevent it and the fatigue is the result of the non mitochondrial ATP turnover of anaerobic metabolism.

In the first case, you will likely believe that the best strategy is to increase tolerance to acidosis to prevent fatigue while in the second case you will understand that the best way to increase capacity for anaerobic energy production before fatigue is actually to improve oxidative metabolism. Since the acid released in the hydrolysis of ATP can be metabolized in the mitochondria, increased oxidative metabolism can improve anaerobic performance.

These are two very different strategies and require different approaches to training. This means that is important to say more than just lactate accumulation correlates with fatigue and leave it at that and more than just an argument over semantics.

Fatigue is the "result of the non mitochondrial ATP turnover of anaerobic metabolism", there is no doubt about that. In both cases you would approach training exactly the same way. You would just think that it's to increase tolerance to acidosis from lactic acid, instead of thinking it is to increase tolerance to PH changes induced by other mechanisms, or to increase the capabilities of your intracellular lactate shuttle mechanism, or whatever that turns out to be. You will still use the same ergometric measurements to get the same kind of indications and apply them to your training in the same way (you would just think the mechanism is different, which is not of practical importance).

It seems like a big leap of fait to assume the limiting factor would be the metabolic capacities of the mitochondria. You are basically saying the aerobic system is a major, if not the limiting, factor in anaerobic glycolysis. And even if one were to agree with that (which I clearly don't), you are also saying that, to train the mitochondria's capacity to handle lactate, you need to train aerobically (where they would get zero exposure to lactate, so there would be no reason for such an adaptation). In practical terms, to include the aerobic system in the process of anaerobic glycolysis, and what we generally refer to as tolerance to acidosis (I don't care about semantics, we all know what that means in practice), you need to at least come up with simple data from events relying heavily on the anaerobic glycolytic system without significant aerobic systems involvement (e.g. 400m sprint), showing consistently significant correlation of aerobic capacity to performance/tolerance to acidosis.


If you could provide such data, then you could make a point and I would be willing to listen. There should be a number of sources providing ergomentric data for 400m sprinters, rowers, etc., but my common senses are telling me it's unlikely to find anything to support that theory.
 
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^ Looking forward to seeing a detailed response to this one! (Please!)
 
I'm glad I'm sitting this one out so I can swoop in with the answer at the 11th hour.

booger5.jpg
 
I did not like the website format either. Very gimmicky.
 
I'll respond more completely when I have time to go back through all my research notes and cite what I'll point out below, but here are some things you need to take into consideration:

1) If you want to use the terms lactic acid and lactate interchangably be my guest. Personally, I like to be accurate in my viewpoint and discussions on exercise physiology, I'm not going to say "lactic acid" when believe, and the research supports, that lactic acid is never even produced in the body. I also disagree that how you view lactate has no practical implications as far as training.

2) I also disagree, as do many other very well known coaches from around the world in many different sports, that the best approach is to just "increase tolerance to lactic acid" or however you want to look at it if improved performance is your goal. This is really older thinking and newer research and plenty of experience is showing this really to only be the most effective approach in very very short events.

More and more, we are understanding importance of the aerobic energy system, even in sports that we used to believe were glycolytic in nature. The 400m for by the way, turns out to be somewhere between 40-50% aerobic, depending on which research you look at these days. Even a 100m sprint is 15-20% aerobic! You are totally wrong saying such events are "without significant aerobic involvement"

I've got tons of research on this but you can start here:

Energy system contribution during 200- to 1500-m r... [Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2001] - PubMed result

How about this...

"The aerobic/anaerobic energy system contribution (AOD method) to the 400-m event was calculated as 41/59% (male) and 45/55% (female). For the 800-m event, an increased aerobic involvement was noted with a 60/40% (male) and 70/30% (female) respective contribution. Significant (P < 0.05) negative correlations were noted between race performance and anaerobic energy system involvement (lactate/PCr) for the male 800-m and female 400-m events (r = - 0.77 and - 0.87 respectively). These track running data compare well with previous estimates of the relative energy system contributions to the 400-m and 800-m events. Additionally, the relative importance and speed of interaction of the respective metabolic pathways has implications to training for these events."


Energy system contribution to 400-metre and 800-me... [J Sports Sci. 2005] - PubMed result

RESULTS: The relative contribution of the aerobic energy system to the 200-, 400-, 800-, and 1500-m events was 29+/-4, 43+/-1, 66+/-2, and 84+/-1%+/-SD, respectively. The size of the AOD increased with event duration during the 200-, 400-, and 800-m events (30.4+/-2.3, 41.3+/-1.0, and 48.1+/-4.5 mL x kg(-1), respectively), but no further increase was seen in the 1500-m event (47.1+/-3.8 mL x kg(-1)). The crossover to predominantly aerobic energy system supply occurred between 15 and 30 s for the 400-, 800-, and 1500-m events.

CONCLUSIONS: These results suggest that the relative contribution of the aerobic energy system during track running events is considerable and greater than traditionally thought

Or HERE for a good review

There are very few sports out there, even ones people used to believe were primarily anaerobic, that do not rely heavily on oxidative metabolism for performance, for a multitude of reasons.

This concept is not some "big leap of faith" it has been demonstrated over and over again over the last several years in the reserach and discussed by various high level coaches all over the world. Even the late Dr. Verkhoshansky, probably the foremost authority on strength and power development in history, discussed this principle he called "anti-glycolytic finality" in his paper on training for the middle distances. He suggested this approach in distances as short as 200m.

I would say focusing training primarily to improve glycolytic capacity is only applicable in very short single bout events lasting 30 seconds or less. Other than that, it has limited usefulness because this type of training will reduce mitochondria in the working muscles and in events of greater duration this is not what you want. A much better strategy is to develop a bigger aerobic engine so that anaerobic metabolism can contribute for longer without leading to fatigue.

My experience training top level MMA fighters for the past 7 years also supports what the research shows. I only do very limited amounts of focused glycoltyic work with any fighter who will be fighting 5 minute rounds.

"And even if one were to agree with that (which I clearly don't), you are also saying that, to train the mitochondria's capacity to handle lactate, you need to train aerobically (where they would get zero exposure to lactate, so there would be no reason for such an adaptation)"

I have no idea why in the world you believe that mitochondria don't oxidize lactate as part of aerobic metabolic processes, you're very mistaken here. Lactate production occurs throughout almost all ranges of aerobic energy production, it is just oxidized at the same rate as production and thus there is no net accumulation. The lactate threshold itself is typically defined as accumulation above 4mmol /L, which makes it obvious there is plenty of lactate being oxidized well below that. You need to look more thoroughly at how energy systems work.

Your general understanding of energy systems seems to be based on older research and older lines of thinking that have shown to be incorrect and/or outdated. There are also plenty of training implications based on what the newer research has shown and it's far more than just an argument of semantics. I get literally hundreds of emails and posts on my own site regarding the effectiveness of the approach I use based on this, not to mention the top pros who will tell you the methods I use and my approach to energy systems works.

For anyone who wants to learn more about this, I'd suggest picking up my book, reading through Lyle McDonad's series on endurance training and joining my site, where Lyle frequently posts as well. I'll also post more research links when I've got the time.
 
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i am lactic intolerant, how do I work around that?
 
You do make a compelling argument, which makes me happy I challenged your position. If nothing else, I stand to learn from this debate. I will think this through and reply tomorrow.
 
Cool video. Can't wait for the next installment.

A question about your DVD. Is it produced in PAL format (the format of dvd players in Europe/Asia/Australia? Or NTSC exclusively?

I'm not sure if my DVD player can read NTSC....
 
That's a good question, I hadn't thought of that yet to be honest. It would make sense for me to make it also available in PAL format because I've had a ton of customers buy my book in the UK and Australia so I'll talk to the producer about making a PAL version available and let everyone know. I should be able to make a PAL version.

edit: yes, it looks like I can make a PAL version as well. It costs a bit more to produce, but people have bought my book from more than 40 different countries so it's probably smart to make this available for those who don't have NTSC.
 
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In physics, RFD and power is not the same thing at all. Power is work per second, RFD is increase in force per second. If you draw a graph showing how much force a system exerts on an object as a function of time, RFD would be shown by measuring the slope of the graph, and power wouldn't be readable from that graph at all.
 
Indeed, I showed a real F-T curve in the video and discussed this. Power, on the other hand = dw/dt or FV when F is held constant. Power in the mechanical sense can be a bit misleading in that if no movement occurs, then no work is being done and there is no power. In this case it's better to think of power in the internal sense of the rate of energy production. Even when there is no external movement, energy is obviously still being created. I should have discussed this in the video.
 
I think people have their websites like that because anyone who gets hooked on the pitch at first will read through the whole thing, getting more and more confident about the purchase. It works.
 
Even when there is no external movement, energy is obviously still being created. I should have discussed this in the video.

If there is no external movement, the entire energy expenditure becomes heat I guess. For as long as you're pushing on, say, a squat but not moving upwards you're just heating the room, then :)
 
Another way of reducing your gas bills (at the expenditure of your electrical bill, of course) is to just leave your refrigerator open all the time. That'll heat your house as well. But failing squats is more fun!
 

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