Monson vs. Pe de Pano brawl

hayliks said:
The thing is Pe De Pano didn't use the rules to his advantage, he cried about it until Relson gave him the win basically. If you watch the video, Relson REFUSES to watch the video on the rules. Like I said a dozen times, I was at the event and they had a rules meeting with all of the contestants (I guess Pe De Pano skipped that part) and they SPECIFICALLY went over that it was ok to use the can opener in somebody's closed guard. They showed the technique with a closed guard and said it was ok, then they showed it with an open guard and said it was illegal. You couldn't get more clear than that. The video of their match clearly shows Pe De Pano with his guard closed, he even tightens his guard up to a figure four, and then taps. How can anybody (unless you have a CLEAR bias like Relson) think that Pe De Pano deserves a win via disqualification?
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wasnt there - so i guess this clears it up.

but eh.. what you going to do.. its in the past.
 
Monson should've either gotten the win or they should've had the match restarted.
 
pe de pano knew it was illegal to use if he kept the guard closed, tapped even when it didn't hurt and hoped to win from a DQ thats what happened.
 
Get a copy of the rules. Get a copy of the vid, go to court and sue...

Or... let it go.

I wonder if someone can sleep well at night knowing that they just "won" this way. Shit i know i wont. Maybe PDP still believes that he won?

Who knows, i wasnt there to hear the rules, but im going on Hayliks word here.

Win by tapping out and then bending the rules... AY CARAMBA!
 
kid dynamite said:
pe de pano knew it was illegal to use if he kept the guard closed, tapped even when it didn't hurt and hoped to win from a DQ thats what happened.
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That's the funny thing -- it actually wasn't illegal to use the neck crank on PDP so long as he kept the guard closed. But you're right, that was certainly PDP's strategy all along.
 
Pe De Pano is like an old school bad guy pro-wrestler - he finds a way to win using brain over braun, then taunts everyone after winning.
 
hayliks said:
The thing is Pe De Pano didn't use the rules to his advantage, he cried about it until Relson gave him the win basically. If you watch the video, Relson REFUSES to watch the video on the rules. Like I said a dozen times, I was at the event and they had a rules meeting with all of the contestants (I guess Pe De Pano skipped that part) and they SPECIFICALLY went over that it was ok to use the can opener in somebody's closed guard. They showed the technique with a closed guard and said it was ok, then they showed it with an open guard and said it was illegal. You couldn't get more clear than that. The video of their match clearly shows Pe De Pano with his guard closed, he even tightens his guard up to a figure four, and then taps. How can anybody (unless you have a CLEAR bias like Relson) think that Pe De Pano deserves a win via disqualification?
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I have nothing against you, and do not take offense. But in the thread in from a brazilian forum where they discuss this video, several respected BJJ fighters comment, such as Parrumpinha. None of them even came close to saying the move was legal, they all started from the principle that it was illegal. Parrumpinha in the video and all ATT staff never say "IT IS LEGAL, WE WENT OVER THE RULES", the said arguments along the lines of "HE COULD HAVE OPENED GUARD". I think you are mistaken, maybe those rules were not applied to Pe vs. Monson match? Because to me it all points to the fact that you cannot use the cervical in closed guard, and Pe used the rules, and tapped so he could get the win by the rule book, because he obviously didn't tap because of a submission, since all you do is open guard. Sissy move by Pdp, but I have a feeling you are wrong, and, again, in all the posts of a huge thread discussing this match in our forums, no one ever mentions the cervical being legal. But you can be right.. =)
 
Terere said:
I have nothing against you, and do not take offense. But in the thread in from a brazilian forum where they discuss this video, several respected BJJ fighters comment, such as Parrumpinha. None of them even came close to saying the move was legal, they all started from the principle that it was illegal. Parrumpinha in the video and all ATT staff never say "IT IS LEGAL, WE WENT OVER THE RULES", the said arguments along the lines of "HE COULD HAVE OPENED GUARD". I think you are mistaken, maybe those rules were not applied to Pe vs. Monson match? Because to me it all points to the fact that you cannot use the cervical in closed guard, and Pe used the rules, and tapped so he could get the win by the rule book, because he obviously didn't tap because of a submission, since all you do is open guard. Sissy move by Pdp, but I have a feeling you are wrong, and, again, in all the posts of a huge thread discussing this match in our forums, no one ever mentions the cervical being legal. But you can be right.. =)
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Let me get this straight.

Monson says they explained the rules, but you dont believe him.
The kid in the hoodie presented video evidence about the rules, but you don't believe him.
Hayliks was actually at the tournament and HEARD THE RULES IN PERSON, but you don't believe him.

Rediculous. PDP flat out cheated and a BJJ coach I truly respect not only caved in to a supposed "athlete" because of endless whining, but than that BJJ coach yelled at the hoodie kid for MAKING SENSE.

I'm embarrased to be a part of a sport where ethnocentric bias is so prevalent and this video is a great example for why BJJ should never be an olympic sport.
 
Kimuralex said:
ban this guy for fighter bashing
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If grapplers are under the fighter umbrella than 1/2 of the members of this forum would have been banned for bashing Eddie Bravo. The other half for bashing Rorion Gracie.

Besides, PDP didnt do much to prove "this guy" wrong.
 
Calibur said:
Let me get this straight.

Monson says they explained the rules, but you dont believe him.
The kid in the hoodie presented video evidence about the rules, but you don't believe him.
Hayliks was actually at the tournament and HEARD THE RULES IN PERSON, but you don't believe him.

Rediculous. PDP flat out cheated and a BJJ coach I truly respect not only caved in to a supposed "athlete" because of endless whining, but than that BJJ coach yelled at the hoodie kid for MAKING SENSE.

I'm embarrased to be a part of a sport where ethnocentric bias is so prevalent and this video is a great example for why BJJ should never be an olympic sport.
Click to expand...

It certainly takes away from the creditability of that particular tournament and its organizers/head referee. On the other hand, that kind of favoritism and poor sportsmanship make it a not bad candidate for an olympic sport ... ask Roy Jones Jr about some of the boxing refereeing, or the figure skaters about judging. For that matter, listen in on some judo judging discussions :icon_sad:

It's also probably just part of the growing pains of BJJ. Most new sports that come out of a particular culture go through that ... judo is still going through the tail end of the Japanese domination, hockey of Canada etc.
 
Calibur said:
If grapplers are under the fighter umbrella than 1/2 of the members of this forum would have been banned for bashing Eddie Bravo. The other half for bashing Rorion Gracie.

Besides, PDP didnt do much to prove "this guy" wrong.
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eddie bravo is not a professional fighter, PDP is a professional fighter, he has fought in MMA...
 
FACT: Tapping to a can opener makes you a pussy.
 
Calibur said:
Let me get this straight.

Monson says they explained the rules, but you dont believe him.
The kid in the hoodie presented video evidence about the rules, but you don't believe him.
Hayliks was actually at the tournament and HEARD THE RULES IN PERSON, but you don't believe him.

Rediculous. PDP flat out cheated and a BJJ coach I truly respect not only caved in to a supposed "athlete" because of endless whining, but than that BJJ coach yelled at the hoodie kid for MAKING SENSE.

I'm embarrased to be a part of a sport where ethnocentric bias is so prevalent and this video is a great example for why BJJ should never be an olympic sport.
Click to expand...

Well if it EVER becomes an Olympic sport i dont think this would be a problem. See here it seems that the final decision goes to one man, Relson. If it were a BIG world level competition with thousands of spectators, multiple judges and rules written in stone then this problem greatly decreases... still this kind of shit can always happen.

I keep hearing shit about PDP, that guy just seems shady. Its sad that a "well respected" master like Relson would do something like this, assuming that he knew what he was doing. For all we know maybe PDP's acting was Oscar winning thus fooling Relson himself
 
That was disgraceful. I have a new respect for Monson in that he clearly won (PDP tapped) and he offered to restart because PDP was "unfamiliar" with the rules. Also, Monson stayed completely calm during the whole thing regardless of how rowdy people got around him.

Resorting to physical violence at an event like this is unacceptable and should be very heavily punished.
 
georgejjr said:
It certainly takes away from the creditability of that particular tournament and its organizers/head referee. On the other hand, that kind of favoritism and poor sportsmanship make it a not bad candidate for an olympic sport ... ask Roy Jones Jr about some of the boxing refereeing, or the figure skaters about judging. For that matter, listen in on some judo judging discussions :icon_sad:

It's also probably just part of the growing pains of BJJ. Most new sports that come out of a particular culture go through that ... judo is still going through the tail end of the Japanese domination, hockey of Canada etc.
Click to expand...

The tournament itself was a complete clusterfuck. I was in the blue belt mens middle weight division that year. It was scheduled to begin at 3pm (I think). They called out over the loud speaker that our division at 4pm, then at 4:30pm they called out saying it would start at 5pm, etc... I didn't step on the mat until I think 9:15pm or so. I won my first match. My second match was literally about 10 minutes after my first because they tried to rush the shit out of it. I got royally fucked in that match too. Before I begin, after the match I found out the table workers were from the same team as my 2nd opponent, I also find out the ref is the FUCKING FATHER of my opponent as well. So I shoot in and get a takedown out of bounds. Ref says we went out of bounds no points, no advantage. I do it again, takedown out of bounds, same bullshit. Now my opponent is afraid of my shot and just backs up. He backs up for THE REST OF THE FUCKING MATCH. The ref says "ok it's 0-0, who do you think was more aggressive?" to the table workers, first off UHMMM WTF? WHO DOES THAT, and second yeah the table workers were from the same school as my opponent so who wins? That shit bag. I honestly tried to get my money back for the tournament because it was utter bullshit. I'm glad it's no longer run by Relson and who's that other fuckhead? John Smith or whoever, the fatass black guy.
 
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