Monson vs. Pe de Pano brawl

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Terere**, Apr 23, 2008.

  1. Terere**

    Terere** Purple Belt

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    http://www.dailymotion.com/related/...jeff-monson-vs-pe-de-pano-cruz_sport?from=rss

    I don't like Pe, but he was right this time.. If the cervical is applied, and you tap, its over, Monson is disqualified. But the whole video is entertaining as hell if you know Portuguese. Specially funny after Monson takes the ref down, and Sonequinha, a 5 foot dwarf calls him out. I don't know if this was posted here already.. I wish there were subtitles for you guys..
     
  2. omgitsrick

    omgitsrick Green Belt

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  3. TopCat

    TopCat The Most Tip-top

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    Isn't this like the 3456th time this has happened in a fight of theirs?
     
  4. easy tiger

    easy tiger Blue Belt

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    i love this video. I agree, Pe was right. Still don't like him. Haha.
     
  5. Balto

    Balto Silver Belt

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    I loved the video.

    This is also why the Arnolds has a reputation for being one of the worst tournaments in BJJ.
     
  6. Kimuralex

    Kimuralex Brown Belt

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    whos side was relson on in the beginning? and what is pe de pano screaming? and what exactly were the rules, that you can use the can opener to open the guard? cuz monson kept saying that pdp has his guard closed....

    i wish there were subtitles, i dont understand 90% lol
     
  7. Terere**

    Terere** Purple Belt

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    Pe is screaming that he tapped, so there is no restart. Parrumpinha is being idiotic and saying that "all he had to do was open guard" but thats a pretty stupid argument.
     
  8. Amar

    Amar Feelin' Froggy? Leap

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    Pe de Pano is a whiner, he should have just went again
     
  9. DaRuckus337

    DaRuckus337 Black Belt

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    Yea, it's hard to tell what to make of it.


    Here's how things would work in my world:

    Can-openers to open closed guard should be allowed, but must be released as soon as the guard opens. If the opponent taps during a can-opener without having opened his guard, then the tap is invalid, but the match does not stop. You reset in a 'bottom man on back with knees up and feet on floor, top man on his knees with hands on bottom man's knees' open-guard starting position. No points or advantages awarded. And if you refuse/are unable to continue, then you forefeit, because you were not hurt in an illegal hold.

    Problem solved.
     
  10. Terere**

    Terere** Purple Belt

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    Yeah but in that tournament's rule it was illegal, so it was simple. it was so idiotic that such confusion was created, its in the rules, the judge should have just raised Pe's hand in the first place. Although I don't know if you are evaluating the fight, or the rule in general..
     
  11. Kimuralex

    Kimuralex Brown Belt

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    who started the fight and do you know why terere? did that small guy in the grey shirt jump on monsons back? cuz the camera didnt show the very start, i just saw monson fall and then get up trying to chase someone and the small guy whiling out...

    its also always the smallest guys who are trying to pick a fight witht he biggest guys, lol
     
  12. tinker_190

    tinker_190 Brown Belt

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    That small guy has some brass ones, cuz Monson is fuckin' huge and scary lookin'
     
  13. Terere**

    Terere** Purple Belt

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    Monson didn't fall, he was attacking the ref, he took him down, and the small dude jumped on him and hit him I think
     
  14. Jimmy Cerra

    Jimmy Cerra Amateur Fighter

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    Sorry, man. There are tournament which have that rule, like the Midwest Grappling Open in Ohio. And I think the rule is one of the worst ideas ever. It is too subjective. The move should just be banned or not-banned.

    Submissions should be either legal or illegal. There shouldn't be any half-way "legal here or not." It is not a very high percentage submission in most matches, but you'll end up with a lot of white belts hurting their necks trying it anyway. The can-opener is not a push-button for opening a guy's guard, and it should not be encouraged for beginners. For advanced guys, if neck cranks are legal then it should be legal. Otherwise it should be illegal. No ifs ands or buts.
     
  15. judogido

    judogido Aussie!, Aussie!, Aussie! ...

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    So wait.... In this case.... The rules state you CAN use the can opener to open a closed guard? But they just don't have a rule to cover the eventuality of someone tapping instead of opening guard...?
     
  16. Kimuralex

    Kimuralex Brown Belt

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    really? monson attacked the ref? monson is officially on my least favorite fighters list, and whos the little guy who jumped on his back, the little guy is awesome
     
  17. DaRuckus337

    DaRuckus337 Black Belt

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    I have a question:

    Why don't the refs know the rules of the tournament's they're reffing? There are only a few rules that vary from tournament to tournament, why can't they just read the rulebook and be prepared? They're getting paid, is that asking so much? If the match had been stopped and reset with a warning the moment the can-opener was thrown on, this 25 minutes embarrassment could have been avoided.
     
  18. hayliks

    hayliks Banned Banned

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    I was there, in the rules it was allowed as long as the guard was kept closed, which it was and pe de pano tapped. Everybody there knew it was bullshit because they EXPLICITLY went over the rules, including the canopener for closed guard only.
     
  19. Calibur

    Calibur Jiu Jitsu Snob

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    So what went wrong?:mad:

    Are you allowed to use the can opener in closed guard or not.

    If so, than Jeff won. If not than PDP won. There is no restart. Either one guy got the sub, or the other guy got the DQ victory.

    Which was it?
     
  20. Jimmy Cerra

    Jimmy Cerra Amateur Fighter

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    Cuz they are Brazilian. Or Americans. Or militantly pro- or anti-wrestling. Or pro- or anti-leg locks. I've seen the head ref say one thing at the rules meeting, then have the mat ref tell me a different thing. I've seen refs rule all guard pulls as takedowns, and I've seen refs who refuse to rule for any takedown. I've seen advantages called for every "almost" thing, and I've seen advantages called for just takedowns. All of these contradictions happened at the same tournaments. They are worse than football refs.
     

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