Karate blackbelt Jesse Enkamp demonstrates why BJJ does not work

[Banana Tree's Nemesis]

Dq’ing someone who isn’t engaging in combat in a combat sport is a good decision.

If you dont want to get taken down or do jiu jitsu then you shouldnt sign up for a jiu jitsu competition.

This is only half true though. That's were the problem with tournaments like this lies.
Jesse did engage. He worked on getting grips and tried several footsweeps. He just stood up when his opponent pulled guard, which makes perfect sense, as his opponent would not do that if it wasn't a position he considered advantageous in the first place.
You should not want to get taken down. Nobody is bothered by the chance of getting taken down in a BJJ tournament. Neither was Jesse.
He was bothered not by the chance, but by the actual takedown. That's what the problem is. In a fair competition obviously either party could get taken down.
The issue pointed out here is that under some rulesets sitting down is incentivised. Which is quite literally bypassing the scoring system as a takedown scores. Just as a sweep does, which you also can't do standing vs a grounded opponent.
So the guy who sits down actually gains an advantage over the other regarding scoring while at the same the criteria itself implies that being taken down is a bad thing, as it scores for the other.

It just makes little sense that way. Either a takedown scores, or it doesn't. But if it does, you can't allow someone to take themselves down just so they don't get scored on.

I actually find the video pretty well intended. The title may be a bit clickbaity, but his critique isn't aimed against BJJ itself but against the incentives set by competition rules.
He goes as far as complaining in similar fashion about the Karate ruleset these days, where a guy was able to win Olympic gold by getting knocked out.

 

[Deleted member 449757]

Yeah that’s accurate. It’s the IBJJF ruleset and most tourneys use this format.

Back is the most dominant position to control/choke. If you get your back taken in a jiu jitsu match at any level above white you’re probably done for. Very hard to get out and very hard to not be finished. For the rest, based on striking.

knee on belly shouldnt score imo

I just asked because i literally never heard anybody claim that BJJ scoring was based on striking positions. I thought it was about control and submission opportunity per position.

 

[listrahtes]

I have felt pressure points and I think I would describe them as being extremely painful when done correctly but I don't know how easy they are to do when you have a wild animal trying to punch you in the face.

Pressure points are just points of the body with more noziception. It can be tendons, nerves surfacing or most efficient parts of the body associated with an internal organ. You know what the best pressure point MA is by far? Boxing and mt. Because you actually learn to hit them in a fight. liver, kidney, solar plexus, sinus carrotis reflex, your face, ear, neck...etc. Everything else is mumbojumbo nonsense cosplaying "ancient" touch up. I let one time in my twenties a strong pressure point "fighter" stay static and deactivate me allowin g him to go full force. He used the ellbow were N. radialis surfaces. Hurt like hell but who cares I could still do everythign I wanted with him and he was only able to get that point because I allowed it.

To really use a pressure point you need punches / kicks or on the ground chokes,..etc and then you need entries aka sparring aka fight experience. aka punch skills

I have trained in many Martial arts from TKD to Aikido, from kickboxing to Judo. I always say you never want to fight a boxer or a wrestler. One can knock you out, the other will take you down and beat you without ever getting tired.

Yep I always have to laugh when TMA coaches talk about a wrestler being helpless on the streets. A Tai Chi Master told me that as did my KArate teachers and especially Kernspecht and other Wing Chun guys made even fun of it being too easy to defeat etc. They really have no clue at all how out of this world a wrestlers agility, pain threshold, speed , stamina is and how destructive normal wrestling skills are in a normal environment not even thinking about concrete underground. The Gracies also always belittled wrestling for that. Absurd. I rather face anyone else in a real fight than a wrestler.

It works both ways. The karate guy was a newbie, too.

Nope Enkamp is not a Newbie. Thats why I wrote he creates false narratives by design to trigger people. Really just a classic asshole. First he earns money by training Karate so his fitness is a lot better than the other guy and he has extensive training in Judo and BJJ together with Karate.

Enkamp is a fake as it gets YT personality.

 

[Deleted member 449757]

Everything else is mumbojumbo nonsense cosplaying "ancient" touch up.

Especially because many systems with focus on pressure points are chinese based and therefore don't even necessarily focus on anatomics but on qi flow meridians and esoteric bullshit like that which usually roughly coincides with specific nerve clusters. Hitting someone's funny bone might be uncomfortable but that doesn't make it a viable combat option. It's on the same level as trying to defeat your opponent via tickling.

The closest thing to pressure point usefulness (apart from the things you already mentioned) is using it in an attempt to create reactions / movements from your opponent while using actually mechanically sound techniques at the same time.

 

[listrahtes]

It's on the same level as trying to defeat your opponent via tickling.

That actually sounds horrific and deadly. I would tap immideatly. Mabe we should explore that furthermore into developing a new kung fu based tickling martial art. <Lmaoo>

is using it in an attempt to create reactions / movements from your opponent

And thats why BJJ and wrestling can be so incredible painful. They know all these dirty tricks

 

[Belaya Smert]

It’s called click bait let’s not get emotional

 

[listrahtes]

It’s called click bait let’s not get emotional

There are a lot of channels not going this low . Yeah I call him out for that. He makes money by talking shit and knowing it's a lie. He creates tension between ma instead of bringing them together . That is low and cheap. His happy go lucky persona is just an act.

 

[Belaya Smert]

There are a lot of channels not going this low . Yeah I call him out for that. He makes money by talking shit and knowing it's a lie. He creates tension between ma instead of bringing them together . That is low and cheap. His happy go lucky persona is just an act.

The vast majority of YouTube is a money hungry cesspool of grifters with good information sometimes. Not surprising

 

[JohnPJones]

Show me all the videos of bjj guys getting beaten up at bars. I’ll wait.
Closest is a drunk BJ Penn who chased the dude down and sent him to the hospital.

karate is gay and doesnt work. There is not a group of people more delusional about their fighting ability than Karate guys.

Tell that to the hundreds of professional MMA fighters who trained karate their whole life.
And the likely thousands of karate people competing in kickboxing…

 

[Da Speeit]

Tell that to the hundreds of professional MMA fighters who trained karate their whole life.
And the likely thousands of karate people competing in kickboxing…

Yeah, genius, those same guys started doing actual sports that actually work to get ready to actually fight

 

[JohnPJones]

Yeah, genius, those same guys started doing actual sports that actually work to get ready to actually fight

…you mean they cross trained…like every other fighter? Wow you really showed me…

Or is it your position that these fighters just so happen to be so much better that they spend years, possibly multiple decades training karate, learning bad habits, and they just so happen to start other styles and go around beating people who have been training ‘real’ styles for years?

cope harder

 

[Da Speeit]

…you mean they cross trained…like every other fighter? Wow you really showed me…

Or is it your position that these fighters just so happen to be so much better that they spend years, possibly multiple decades training karate, learning bad habits, and they just so happen to start other styles and go around beating people who have been training ‘real’ styles for years?

cope harder

Karate is stupid and the only parts of it that work are in other combat sports that actually do.

How many MMA fighters, other than Lyoto Machida, are opening fucking Karate schools? Or even have adult karate on the curriculum.
And you want to talk about COPE? It's all you TMA dorks do, is make up stupid delusional scenarios on how and why Karate actually matters to anyone besides cultists who actually bought in to this crap.

 

[Wrath of Foamy]

I don't get why Jesse would have been disqualified.

BJJ dude should have got up and went for the takedown.

BJJ is vital, but surely takedowns are part of it, as well?

 

[JohnPJones]

Karate is stupid and the only parts of it that work are in other combat sports that actually do.

How many MMA fighters, other than Lyoto Machida, are opening fucking Karate schools? Or even have adult karate on the curriculum.
And you want to talk about COPE? It's all you TMA dorks do, is make up stupid delusional scenarios on how and why Karate actually matters to anyone besides cultists who actually bought in to this crap.

So…all of it works?

 

[JohnPJones]

I don't get why Jesse would have been disqualified.

BJJ dude should have got up and went for the takedown.

BJJ is vital, but surely takedowns are part of it, as well?

They are but they’re not incentivized in competition

 

[Deleted member 592822]

Guy has a fair point. Sport BJJ is getting more ridiculous and laughable by the day

 

[Deleted member 592822]

You can nullify almost any martial art if the skill gap isn't too huge and you simply refuse to engage. I could enter a boxing match and run from the guy the whole fight, doesn't mean boxing doesn't work. The whole point is that it works when you're being attacked.

no you couldn't. You will get knocked out of the skill gap is sufficient. The equivalent in boxing to a BJJ black belt is very efficient with his hands and footwork. Doubt you could escape for long.

on the other hand there are BJJ black belts who can't do a seoi nage or a body lock takedown for their life

 

[Deleted member 592822]

This is only half true though. That's were the problem with tournaments like this lies.
Jesse did engage. He worked on getting grips and tried several footsweeps. He just stood up when his opponent pulled guard, which makes perfect sense, as his opponent would not do that if it wasn't a position he considered advantageous in the first place.
You should not want to get taken down. Nobody is bothered by the chance of getting taken down in a BJJ tournament. Neither was Jesse.
He was bothered not by the chance, but by the actual takedown. That's what the problem is. In a fair competition obviously either party could get taken down.
The issue pointed out here is that under some rulesets sitting down is incentivised. Which is quite literally bypassing the scoring system as a takedown scores. Just as a sweep does, which you also can't do standing vs a grounded opponent.
So the guy who sits down actually gains an advantage over the other regarding scoring while at the same the criteria itself implies that being taken down is a bad thing, as it scores for the other.

It just makes little sense that way. Either a takedown scores, or it doesn't. But if it does, you can't allow someone to take themselves down just so they don't get scored on.

I actually find the video pretty well intended. The title may be a bit clickbaity, but his critique isn't aimed against BJJ itself but against the incentives set by competition rules.
He goes as far as complaining in similar fashion about the Karate ruleset these days, where a guy was able to win Olympic gold by getting knocked out.

so clearly articulated and explained. but BJJ people will get angry at that somehow

 

[dirtypablo]

no you couldn't. You will get knocked out of the skill gap is sufficient. The equivalent in boxing to a BJJ black belt is very efficient with his hands and footwork. Doubt you could escape for long.

on the other hand there are BJJ black belts who can't do a seoi nage or a body lock takedown for their life

I literally said if the skill gap isn't too huge in my first sentence. But even if the skill gap is large, it is still difficult to beat someone who is purely playing defense - generally speaking you open yourself up to being attacked by attacking.

 

[DoctorTaco]

I literally said if the skill gap isn't too huge in my first sentence. But even if the skill gap is large, it is still difficult to beat someone who is purely playing defense - generally speaking you open yourself up to being attacked by attacking.

I understand what you’re trying to say but boxing is a terrible example. If you’re not throwing punches you’re gonna get pounded.