Judo throws and sweeps in BJJ

[Adriano**]

My favourite foot sweep is a ko ouchi gari from behind taking the supporting foot away Illegal in Judo and in Sambo but not BJJ or MMA. It forces the opponent to fall face first if he puts his arm out I am landing on it or putting an arm lock on.

I ended Kevin Simpson from extreme courtures MMA career in a BJJ contest when I went for the leg sweep I planted my foot in him inside leg forcing his to put is knee out destroying his knee. :icon_lol:

 

[Uchi Mata]

Did Saulo and Xande do Judo?

I know Jacare did, and I thought the 2 brothers did, but I'm not sure...

Anyone know?

I know Saulo did, I don't know about Xande but I would imagine so (most Brazilian BBs have done some Judo IME).

I mostly use foot sweeps, tomoe nage, and sumi gaeshi. I throw Osoto some, but it's hard against guys who bend over and push forward. I mostly stay away from turning throws after getting my back taken after them a few times.

 

[BigStaff]

Adriano, Thats pretty shitty to brag about ending a mans career. Not Cool

 

[Chute Stomp]

Kouchi gari
Drop Seoi
Kata Guruma
Sumi Gaeshi

 

[Carrera26]

Things I have found to work very very well against "BJJ Stance" folks. Once you know how stupid easy it is to get past stiff arms, it's pretty simple to:

Tsuri Goshi, Tsurikomi Goshi with back grip.
O Soto Makkikomi (lands very hard!)
Ko Soto Gake
Sumi Gaeshi
Hikikomi Gaeshi
Ko/O Uchi Gari
Ko Uchi Makikomi
Tai Otoshi


Here's a very good link on the Osoto Makikomi by a former Olympian, and in general it should help on defeating the stiff arm. Generally, if you have a stiff-arm held tight against you its very hard to push right through it if you maintain good posture, but very easy to "rotate" into it and collapse the arm. Imagine they have a typical lapel grip on your left lapel. All you have to do is twist clockwise while you push in, like you are trying to make shoulder/torso impact with their left pectoral. Start by asking someone to hold you in a tight stiff-arm stance and just rotate, you;ll see how stupid easy it is to cross up their arms and collapse them. Then work into rotating while closing the distance and before you know it you're tight against them with their lapel hand uselessly pinned to their torso and in a perfect position for a variety of throws.

Episode 22 - Makikomi and Variations : Super Judo TV - v2.0

 

[Adriano**]

Kevin was a beast and I do respect him allot he used to kick my ass in training and at contest and just about everyone else he trained and competed against. Shitty yeah it was for him for me thats another story.

 

[karma2burn]

Adriano, Thats pretty shitty to brag about ending a mans career. Not Cool

I've been doing bjj a few months now and we just recently had an in school tourney to give some of us new guys a taste of competition. Our instructor is a high level judo and bjj guy so we are taught to not pull guard and to use the judo to get the take down.

This was my first time starting on the feet and it's such a completely different animal. I was amazed how tired I got just trying to go for the throws and take downs. Maybe it's because we all sort of cross train in judo that it was hard to get any kind of throw at all. I do sort of get pulling guard in competition because you don't expend a lot of energy trying to get the take down.

Still, I found that it was much more difficult trying to get a throw in live competition than I thought.

 

[Carrera26]

Adriano, Thats pretty shitty to brag about ending a mans career. Not Cool

And his explanation makes no sense at all. The only thing even remotely like that that's illegal in Judo is Kawazu Gake, which is illegal for a damn good reason. Land wrong and you'll destroy a knee.

It's not funny, not cool, and not bad-ass to use this move. It's pure a-hole, and to put a smiling face next to bragging about delivering a career-ending injury, especially if it was Kawazu Gake when you know what it does makes you an utter piece of shit Adriano.

 

[Adriano**]

karma2burn when sparring with others who are new to Judo or wrestling for BJJ you will find it hard to get a takedown but the more takedowns you have and setups the easier it becomes.

Think more of using Judo, wrestling as control rather than the takedown.

I control my opponent by controlling where the fight goes and not letting my opponent decide where the fight goes this sounds simpler than it actually is.
A good example is your against an opponent who has little takedown ability you wish to use your wrestling and Judo and BJJ to defeat your opponent, by keeping distance and taking the grip you wish you can control where the fight goes by shooting for a double or single by keeping your distance and stopping your opponent from pulling guard.

If you know your opponent is going to pull guard its easier than not knowing what your opponent will do. Which means if I can prevent him from pulling guard and taking him down or simply countering his guard pass he is one dimensional I am better well rounded I will control where the fight goes this is the mentality you need to grow and one you will in time. He needs to be worried about getting taken down and pulling guard you only need to worry about him pulling guard.

 

[Adriano**]

Carrera26 I know it was illegal its one of the most dangerous throws someone can use and yeah some people may call me an a-hole but I win the contests I get the results and thats all that matters.

It's not illegal in BJJ so I wasn't breaking the rules. The technique your showing I use in competition also but it wasn't the sweep I used I was behind my opponent and put the leg in his inside leg planting the foot similar to the technique you have shown but different.

 

[Zankou]

They always teach you osoto gari and ippon seoi nage in bjj class, but it never actually works in competition, so what's the point? Ever seen a wrestler get hit with osoto? Neither have I. I'm sure SOMEBODY has, but it's so low percentage I don't know why they bother.

Single legs, double legs, ankle picks, drop seoi, harai/uchimata. Oh and sumi gaeshi. That's pretty much what works in the real world of bjj comp, as far as I can tell. You have to be near olympic caliber to hit the other stuff consistently.

 

[Shemhazai]

Adriano, are you talking about the takedown/trip that Leo Vieira shows @ 7:30 in this video?

 

[Uchi Mata]

Carrera26 I know it was illegal its one of the most dangerous throws someone can use and yeah some people may call me an a-hole but I win the contests I get the results and thats all that matters.

Really, in a hobby all that matters is winning? Even if it costs people their actual careers? WTF is wrong with you? That's sociopathic. Who gives a shit if you won some purple belt comp? It doesn't bring you money, fame, certainly not respect if you're out there hurting people and laughing about it.

Besides, that shit catches up with you. If you're known as a guy who will hurt someone to win, don't be surprised if normally safe people start hurting you to protect themselves. If you're that kind of guy and I know you'll hurt me if you have the chance, then I'm not taking the chance of letting you out of a hold or letting you throw me. I'd break your arm before you could tap if I got the chance. Is that really the spirit you want to engender in everyone you meet in BJJ?

 

[Shemhazai]

Single legs, double legs, ankle picks, drop seoi, harai/uchimata. Oh and sumi gaeshi. That's pretty much what works in the real world of bjj comp, as far as I can tell. You have to be near olympic caliber to hit the other stuff consistently.

I'd like to add tani otoshi and its 'cousins' uki waza (mostly used as a 'faceplant' move in conjunction with an arm/collar drag) and yoko otoshi.

 

[Rod1]

They always teach you osoto gari and ippon seoi nage in bjj class, but it never actually works in competition, so what's the point? Ever seen a wrestler get hit with osoto? Neither have I. I'm sure SOMEBODY has, but it's so low percentage I don't know why they bother.

Single legs, double legs, ankle picks, drop seoi, harai/uchimata. Oh and sumi gaeshi. That's pretty much what works in the real world of bjj comp, as far as I can tell. You have to be near olympic caliber to hit the other stuff consistently.

I have seen Osoto hit against wrestlers.

Also i doubt Leo Vieria is "olympic level" and he hit an ippon seoi nage NOGI in ADCC 2011.

The "real world" of BJJ is that the moment you get a good dominant grip on your opponent he will butt flop, hard to throw someone who throws himself to the ground.

 

[Rod1]

Carrera26 I know it was illegal its one of the most dangerous throws someone can use and yeah some people may call me an a-hole but I win the contests I get the results and thats all that matters.

It's not illegal in BJJ so I wasn't breaking the rules. The technique your showing I use in competition also but it wasn't the sweep I used I was behind my opponent and put the leg in his inside leg planting the foot similar to the technique you have shown but different.

Depending on the context i agree completely if i have an option yeah, ill pass on the kawazu gake, if i dont im certainly using it to win.

The hating is hilarious, that's paramount to saying you wouldnt break an arm if someone didnt tapped to your armbar.

 

[fourfif**]

I ended Kevin Simpson from extreme courtures MMA career in a BJJ contest when I went for the leg sweep I planted my foot in him inside leg forcing his to put is knee out destroying his knee. :icon_lol:

omfg, are you foreals??

you are HAPPY about injuring someone who fights for a living to support his family.

I hate everything about you.

 

[Chute Stomp]

I forgot Tani Otoshi. Right to side control.

 

[brollikk]

I think all the throws are legit. The problem is how the sport is practiced as well as the ranks.

A black belt in judo is attained fairly easily compared to say a black belt in bjj.

In terms of take down ability, a LOT of college level wrestlers are as good at takedowns as brown belts are in BJJ.


In terms of take down ability relative to those wrestlers, I'd say a lot of guys who just got their judo black belt casually are as good at takedowns as blue belts are at bjj.

Of course there are olympic calibur judokas that have better takedowns, but the problem is that because of how easily belts are attained, it is hard to discern when/who is at that level other than seeing people actually wrestle.

 

[JudokaUK]

I ended Kevin Simpson from extreme courtures MMA career in a BJJ contest when I went for the leg sweep I planted my foot in him inside leg forcing his to put is knee out destroying his knee. :icon_lol:

I really hope that someone from Xtreme Couture reads this, works out who you are and comes and wrecks your shit.

They always teach you osoto gari and ippon seoi nage in bjj class, but it never actually works in competition, so what's the point? Ever seen a wrestler get hit with osoto? Neither have I. I'm sure SOMEBODY has, but it's so low percentage I don't know why they bother.

The thing is O soto gari and Ippon seoi nage are hard techniques to pull off in Judo.

They both have 'instinctual' defences to them that make them much easier to defend against than other techniques e.g stepping the leg back for O soto and stepping back and hip cutting for Ippon seoi.

However, if you actually understand the principals of the techniques and are taught them well, which is not guaranteed in Judo so even less likely in BJJ. Then they are both very reliable and viable techniques regardless of stance etc...

I regularly throw people who adopt the 'wrestling posture' with O soto gari. We don't really have any wrestlers in the UK so can't say if my O soto would 'work' against a wrestler, but the defensive posture of bent over at the waist arms out etc... associated with wrestling is relatively simple to overcome with O soto gari.

I know its simple, because if a rec. athlete spud like me can do it then anyone can.