Joe Rogan and Rubber Guard

[Bartatua]

Exactly. All Joe has to say is ...

Okay, he has rubber guard now. He is grabbing both of his own ankles to keep his opponent from standing up.

There is absolutely no need to reference crack head control, zombie, dead pussy order, etc.

He is trying to put 10th planet JJ phrases into the BJJ vernacular, and it annoys me because it is as subtle as an elephant. Nothing burns me more than poor attempts to use propaganda on me.

As good as Joe is, I think Florian is better. A better balance of fighter perspective and play by play.

I've actually wondered how things would work with Bas and Rogan commentating together. It could be great, because Rogan's agendas and strong personality would but up against Bas, who has far superior knowledge in the standup department. Rogan needs someone to offer counter-opinions from an educated viewpoint.

 

[Tony Manifold]

I've actually wondered how things would work with Bas and Rogan commentating together. It could be great, because Rogan's agendas and strong personality would but up against Bas, who has far superior knowledge in the standup department. Rogan needs someone to offer counter-opinions from an educated viewpoint.

Rogan is actually fairly well versed in the standup game himself. He had a shot to be a national/international TKD competitor but choose to stick with his comedy. He has also trained MT as well. Not at Bas' level, obviously, but few are.

do you ever hear the gracies, the machados, countless blackbelts call things "retard contol" "crackhead control" "the godfather stomp" and etcc.?

No one has yet to give me an alternate name for any of the main rubber guard positions. Right now, for whatever reason, Eddie Bravo's name is synonymous with rubber guard. He uses the terms such as mission control, zombie, etc. Which Machado is it that teaches rubber guard, again? Does Rorion teach it at the Gracie academy?

I totally understand why someone would have problems with some of the terms like Crackhead control or Dead pussy Odor. Even Joe Rogan laughed as he named the position (as mentioned in this thread). However, it is the name he knows it by and there is no alternative. When someone comes up with a less fucked up name, people can start using that.

 

[GZUS]

what is funny is everybody is complaining about terminology but everyone remembers what it is and the name to go along with it. the names stick out and people remember them. i think eddie done his job w/ that

 

[-Montanha-]

This thread still goin?

 

[SFinclined]

"crazy cracker mission mars weed"

Haha, Nice!

 

[hayliks]

what is funny is everybody is complaining about terminology but everyone remembers what it is and the name to go along with it. the names stick out and people remember them. i think eddie done his job w/ that

I'll be honest and say that I own an Eddie Bravo book, mostly for his half guard techniques, and I still don't know what mission control is let alone crackhead control or whatever.

 

[spenderz]

You know what history professors like to talk about? History. You know what those people who re-enact Civil War battles like to talk about? The Civil War. You know what Eddie Bravo students like to talk about? Rubber guard.

 

[-Montanha-]

I'll be honest and say that I own an Eddie Bravo book, mostly for his half guard techniques, and I still don't know what mission control is let alone crackhead control or whatever.

I bought his first book, even tho I have busted his balls more than anyone[except maybe TudorBJJ] back in 03-04. I picked up a half guard move of Eddie's I use regularly. But in keeping with my BIAS, I mostly use half guard moves I learned from a team mate of mine Rob Lugo, last years Worlds No-Gi World Champ.

Part of Eddie's outlandish style is the dumb ass names for moves, but if it gets you knotheads to remember, then its all good. When Dave Terrell began inventing moves we called them some weird names to keep them secret.

We are into the nasty mean kill moves and really rag on Eddie's "buttscoot".

 

[sienk-jitsu]

All this hassle over who created the moves...

Fernando Pontes once asked me, "Do we create moves or do we find them?" I jokingly replied, "I create them, YOU find them." He then proceeded to armbar me.

Bottom line though- I don't think moves are created. I look at BJJ like chess- there are a finite number of moves and a finite amount of applications. Isn't it then just a discovery, not a creation?

Best post so far.

 

[DaRuckus337]

what is funny is everybody is complaining about terminology but everyone remembers what it is and the name to go along with it. the names stick out and people remember them. i think eddie done his job w/ that

Other than mission control and maybe the invisible collar, I have no idea what the fuck Eddie Bravo and/or Joe Rogan is talking about when they start rambling about zombies and crackheads.

 

[-Montanha-]

I like these grappling forums, and love jiu-jitsu but ya gotta understand my Bias is good jiu-jitsu that is functional.

Eddie's rubber guard is a novelty system to sell books.

That is not to put down his system or the value of the rubber guard..............its an un-balanced focus on a specific part of your game.

This video will give you an idea of the environment I am in and as compared to what Eddie has produced, why my/our opinions are so strong on this subject......

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[Cash Bill 52]

There are times when Nick is showing a move and he is giving details about the set up. He doesn't name the set up move. He just says, "grab the collar here," or "put your leg there".

One thing our school could learn from Eddie is how to promote a system and marketing techniques.

There's a fine line between selling out and making money off your craft.

 

[DaRuckus337]

I like these grappling forums, and love jiu-jitsu but ya gotta understand my Bias is good jiu-jitsu that is functional.

Eddie's rubber guard is a novelty system to sell books.

That is not to put down his system or the value of the rubber guard..............its an un-balanced focus on a specific part of your game.

This video will give you an idea of the environment I am in and as compared to what Eddie has produced, why my/our opinions are so strong on this subject......

No offense, but it seems to me like that is exactly what you've been trying to do. You called it a novelty system designed to sell books - how can anyone take that as anything but an insult? I'm not saying I disagree with you, but you seem very dead set on your ways and your gym, and very disrespectful of anyone who does things otherwise - especially with regards to 10th Planet, which you obviously have a personal issue with. Now, I'm not a big rubber guard fan, and am all for a substance of style approach to training, but you - and the Diaz brothers in that video - come off as elitist meatheads (not that there's anything wrong with that if you are in fact a very confident athlete who lives for his time in the gym). You may embrace that label, you may not, but given the posts and comments you've made, you might as well just drop the disclaimers and say you don't care for Bravo, his style, or his gym already. I mean, it's the interwebs, why beat around the bush?

 

[-Montanha-]

No offense, but it seems to me like that is exactly what you've been trying to do. You called it a novelty system designed to sell books - how can anyone take that as anything but an insult? I'm not saying I disagree with you, but you seem very dead set on your ways and your gym, and very disrespectful of anyone who does things otherwise - especially with regards to 10th Planet, which you obviously have a personal issue with. Now, I'm not a big rubber guard fan, and am all for a substance of style approach to training, but you - and the Diaz brothers in that video - come off as elitist meatheads (not that there's anything wrong with that if you are in fact a very confident athlete who lives for his time in the gym). You may embrace that label, you may not, but given the posts and comments you've made, you might as well just drop the disclaimers and say you don't care for Bravo, his style, or his gym already. I mean, it's the interwebs, why beat around the bush?

Thank you for your post, and putting a great deal of thought to it. Your observations are good.

I have been balls out blunt in the past and not beating around the bush and that put off alot of people too.

Here is what it is; I am like that dad who acts like a dad even when I am not at home. In the academy I am gonna teach the bread and butter first, and on your own time you can choose to get some candy.

These forums are your free time, and I butt in and put you guys to task about eating candy. I am not going to get good reviews or br well accepted here because I remind people of the bread and butter diet of good all round techniques.


Remember this all the readers here do not have the benifit of good direction or a big academy and come here searching for info............I will pipe up at times and call it like I see it.

Notice Hayliks post; when he trained with Eddie, Eddie didnt even use the rubber guard. Hayliks has a wrestling background and was a stud at the blue belt level, so Eddie used a smart game to tool em.

And yes I am just ballsey enough to call people on what I think is a short sided view of their game. Guys here I respect and know that have a well rounded game that servrs them in comps, fights or just enjoying training dont have a problem with my candor.

As you guys grow in your BJJ experience, you will come around.

Thanks for your view and taking time to read mine.

 

[Kimuralex]

montanha, i love this quote you said-

"In the academy I am gonna teach the bread and butter first, and on your own time you can choose to get some candy."

recently, i got a bunch of dvds as well as robson mouras, demien maias, some other stuff and cesar gracies.

I was telling a purple belt how i was watching this crazy "robinho cross guard" and how i think its the greatest thing since sliced bread(I am like a kid in a candy store when i see new stuff, I like everything and i want to try everything and play with everything immedietly)...however what he told me kindof upset me a little....but it was the truth. He told me to put that stuff down for now, and watch and re-watch cesar gracies basic sets.

Long story short, watching 30 mins of cesar gracies set reminded me of very basic minor details that i didnt use(or didnt use right for that matter) and reminded me of what i really need to work on.

I need to finish watching cesars set, its what everyone should watch. I even remember my instructor saying he recently re-watched an instructional on the basic hip bump sweep, and by that time im sure he already knew the sweep inside and out

 

[-Montanha-]

montanha, i love this quote you said-

"In the academy I am gonna teach the bread and butter first, and on your own time you can choose to get some candy."

recently, i got a bunch of dvds as well as robson mouras, demien maias, some other stuff and cesar gracies.

I was telling a purple belt how i was watching this crazy "robinho cross guard" and how i think its the greatest thing since sliced bread(I am like a kid in a candy store when i see new stuff, I like everything and i want to try everything and play with everything immedietly)...however what he told me kindof upset me a little....but it was the truth. He told me to put that stuff down for now, and watch and re-watch cesar gracies basic sets.

Long story short, watching 30 mins of cesar gracies set reminded me of very basic minor details that i didnt use(or didnt use right for that matter) and reminded me of what i really need to work on.

I need to finish watching cesars set, its what everyone should watch. I even remember my instructor saying he recently re-watched an instructional on the basic hip bump sweep, and by that time im sure he already knew the sweep inside and out

Thanks

This last year I have trained with a guy alot who is a long time student of Saulo. You wanna talk about a solid game full of basic details that serves him well. Let me tell I have become a Saulo Fan, he is a great instructor giving his students prime meat and vegitables and serving their needs and not their wants.

With having a good foundation like that, he is ading on some of my weird shit too. But the joy is the bulk of our conversation and practice is detailed foundation building.

 

[DaRuckus337]

Good stuff Montahna. I agree with you about the rubber guard, and think the talk it gets is way out of proportion with it's place in any well-rounded grappler's gameplan. It's nice little guard that works for some people, but obviously shouldn't be a major focus of most people's time on the mat. Do you know if the 10th Planet guys start out with rubber guard early in their training? Do white belts learn rubber guard along side basic closed and open guard, or do they more responsibly add it in once guys have some experience? Do 10 Planet competitors all use it?

 

[blanko]

Thanks

This last year I have trained with a guy alot who is a long time student of Saulo. You wanna talk about a solid game full of basic details that serves him well. Let me tell I have become a Saulo Fan, he is a great instructor giving his students prime meat and vegitables and serving their needs and not their wants.

With having a good foundation like that, he is ading on some of my weird shit too. But the joy is the bulk of our conversation and practice is detailed foundation building.

you know something? Saulo's instructions have influcened my game to the point where a teamate of mine (who trained under a saulo brown belt) told me that i remind him of his former teamates. Freaky huh?

 

[sienk-jitsu]

Everyone here is talking about learning the details and the small bits of technique which serve as the foundation to a solid game. Doesn't this apply equally to Eddie's school? People say the rubber guard sucks, they don't like it, it doesn't work, whatever they wanna say. It's style over substance. Whatever. Eddie knows the shit inside and out. He knows HIS stuff better than anyone. It his his bread and butter. So until someone has that depth of knowledge on the system, why judge it or deem it impractical? Isn't that kind of hypocritical. Having said that- it goes without saying that the rubberguard isn't for everyone.

 

[-Montanha-]

Everyone here is talking about learning the details and the small bits of technique which serve as the foundation to a solid game. Doesn't this apply equally to Eddie's school? People say the rubber guard sucks, they don't like it, it doesn't work, whatever they wanna say. It's style over substance. Whatever. Eddie knows the shit inside and out. He knows HIS stuff better than anyone. It his his bread and butter. So until someone has that depth of knowledge on the system, why judge it or deem it impractical? Isn't that kind of hypocritical. Having said that- it goes without saying that the rubberguard isn't for everyone.

Please read with your head and not your emotions.

People do not say it[rubber guard] sucks, they love it! and if they paid attention to Eddie's instruction it WORKS! I have even offered tips on these forums on how to protect your knees and further the rubber guard's effectiveness even if you are not flexible. It CAN BE effective for many people.

Here is the rub tho; I know volumes about the Invert Guard, I am a tall lanky guy and my abilities allow things I can do. Now I could teach you Invert Guard till your head spins off. Lets say you "Get it" and it works for you, WOW! that's cool! your Jazzed...............I just took alot of money from you for a "private lesson" and your no better the grappler.

Example;
Your Base is still bad, and dont have a clue where to put your hands in a scramble. Things that will get you swept, mounted and controlled and submitted.

Lets go back to Eddie's comp days, his bread and butter was Catch Wrestling to surprise BJJers. Namely the Twister which was his highest percentage submission getter.

His biggest innovation was being instrumental in the NO-GI Revolution. Eddie and Dave Terrell were the first two to brake from tradition and open academys that really taught exclusively NO-Gi curriculum.

That's the day to day life. Rubber Guard it the market association which is called a Brand, or a selling point.

Example;
Nick Diaz's day to day is running competitively in triathlons, stemming from a swimming background. How is that even close to the Market association which is his brand or selling point, "Flipping the Bird".


If it were not for Joe Rogan to get him over the marketing HUMP, and the good idea to come up with catchy names for moves so you would remember........Eddie would be teaching No-Gi in relative obscurity like Dave Terrell in a strip mall in LA piggy backing off the Machado Name as an affiliate.

There is your lesson in marketing.......FREE. Props to Eddie.

My issue is with the buyers who talk it to fucking death here on the forums, while they still have big holes in their game. Go train at 10th planet and you will learn a complete No-Gi game, IF you pay attention........or you can pay for those privates from Eddie him self to get Mission Control down pat.


Your choice guys


Old teaching trick, you dont like the guy? So what! Show him too many moves so he wont retain any, or show em complicated kool moves that wont improve his game. But teach em, and take his money!