jds "lucky" punch

[Bollman]

that's the most retarded logic.

did you aim punch at the head? then it wasn't lucky?

How about? Did you aim the golfball at the hole? Then the hole in one wasn't lucky....

More goes into a punch than just aiming and swinging, the success depends on how your opponents moves into it and many other things. That's why fighters throw sometimes HUNDREDS of punches each fight and all of them are aiming to do serious damage but most don't.

So what's the difference between all the punches that Cung Le MISSED trying to do that same counter and the one that he landed?

Maybe that's the even better argument against the logic: cung le threw that same punch multiple times. It only landed the one time... so what was the difference?

I'm thinking the answer is that the opponent happened to move into perfectly this time instead of moving his head the other way like last time or staying out of reach like last time when Cung thought he was coming in. That difference IS the luck factor

He executed it more perfectly that one time. He timed it slightly better. He moved slightly quicker. He aimed slightly more precisely. And the circumstances (perhaps one of the components of luck) were just right.

It seems like you aren't taking into account the skill of the fighter executing the maneuver, his ability to make all the factors of a successful strike align. If all fighters were equal across every attribute then you could certainly lay equal value in the opponents contribution to the landed strike. But you have to understand that these are individuals who are actively engaged in performing certain maneuvers. It is their intent to land the strike thrown. Otherwise, why throw the trike in the first place (unless it's a set up strike).

Sometimes it works better than others because they perform them better at certain times than others by putting the elements together better. Same could be said for the hole-in-one analogy.

So, it could be argued that the presence of intent alone would nullify the luck argument. Though it's obvious that a certain amount of other factors come into play (the defensive movement of the opponent, etc.) for the strike to land.

Wih the JDS shot on Cain it was apparent that JDS was coming in with that punch full force with the intention to land it on Cains body regardless of weather it was blocked or absorbed. He didn't set it up with a combo. It wasn't a set up punch as part of a combo that happened to land. No, he squared off and threw an extremely hard power shot at the head of Cain. Now Cain tried to move and raised his shoulder to partially block it. However, a small piece of it got through and landed behind the ear of Cain. The fact that a small amount of the shot's impact go through even though Cain moved to avoid/block it could be construed as lucky, I guess. But again, I stress that JDS was looking to put a heavy shot on Cain weather he blocked it or it got through. I just don't really subscribe to the theory of ascribing luck when these guys train/work hard every day to do something and then it works.

 

[bhp02]

There's no such thing as a lucky punch in MMA unless you're swinging wildly with your eyes closed.

you mean like fedor ??

 

[KingAvram]

so...

it was a lucky punch?

No, not at all. he aimed for the stars.
And i guess we are all mature enough and can acknowledge the FACT that everything aimed for the stars falls on Cains head. So no. it was the gameplan. a well executed attempt to reach deep space, knocked Cain dafuk out!

 

[GiantSilva]

No, not at all. he aimed for the stars.
And i guess we are all mature enough and can acknowledge the FACT that everything aimed for the stars falls on Cains head. So no. it was the gameplan. a well executed attempt to reach deep space, knocked Cain dafuk out!

i'm not sure what you're getting at, but you sound confident and I believe you.

 

[Claude]

JDS KO's in one minute an undefeated guy who is coming from injury surgery and layoff.

It has fluke written all over it. Worse fluke than Serra vs. GSP.

 

[chinarice]

JDS KO's in one minute an undefeated guy who is coming from injury surgery and layoff.

It has fluke written all over it. Worse fluke than Serra vs. GSP.

This post looks to be a bitter Cain fan. Your logic makes no sense. By your logic, there are a ridiculous amount of flukey fights.

 

[KingAvram]

you mean like fedor ??

Fedor doesn't close his eyes when throwing bombs. His strikes may appear reckless, but he aims those Russian hooks quit well.

throwing leather while closing eyes is a Garcia tactic.

 

[Kenro199x]

I don't think he threw that punch by accident.

 

[let me bang bro**]

if you throw a punch with the intention of landing it and it lands, theres no luck, unless its a leonard garcia style haymaker

 

[MP15]

What if Cain lands a lucky takedown?

 

[Chapter40z]

the harder you work the luckier you get

 

[knock_you_out]

If an asteroid hits the earth, that's lucky (or unlucky).

If a fist hits a head, it's not lucky, because it was intentional.

 

[Bolshevik***]

There's a degree of luck to every strike. There's even luck in chess. You throw a strike based on your perception of your opponent's movements. Whether your perception is correct has a high degree of variance- luck. Whether your strike is thrown exactly as you intended is also subject to luck. Whether your strike just wobbles a guy or finishes him is also luck.

Was it a punch that crosses that imaginary line into being what we call a "lucky" punch? It was pretty close, I say yes. I also think he'll get "lucky" again tonight.

that's a good point. there's only so much you yourself can do when throwing a punch. the rest comes down to things that are out of your control, so there certainly is some luck involved.

 

[76Knockout]

that's the most retarded logic.

did you aim punch at the head? then it wasn't lucky?

How about? Did you aim the golfball at the hole? Then the hole in one wasn't lucky....

More goes into a punch than just aiming and swinging, the success depends on how your opponents moves into it and many other things. That's why fighters throw sometimes HUNDREDS of punches each fight and all of them are aiming to do serious damage but most don't.

So what's the difference between all the punches that Cung Le MISSED trying to do that same counter and the one that he landed?

Maybe that's the even better argument against the logic: cung le threw that same punch multiple times. It only landed the one time... so what was the difference?

I'm thinking the answer is that the opponent happened to move into perfectly this time instead of moving his head the other way like last time or staying out of reach like last time when Cung thought he was coming in. That difference IS the luck factor

You like to put JDS down a lot. Why?

 

[Bolshevik***]

If an asteroid hits the earth, that's lucky (or unlucky).

If a fist hits a head, it's not lucky, because it was intentional.

so if i buy a lottery ticket and i intend to win, then i do, i'm not lucky because i intended to do it?

 

[Seven30]

Anyone can get lucky & have good fortune fall into their laps. However, professionals don't rely on luck. If they did, why train or study if you're expectant or dependent upon the randomness of the outcome being in your favor? This is really a silly discussion. Have some respect & give credit to those who have worked to achieve, & have a body of work to validate their sometimes unbelievable accomplishments...

 

[GiantSilva]

so if i buy a lottery ticket and i intend to win, then i do, i'm not lucky because i intended to do it?

sounds pretty boss

 

[Seven30]

so if i buy a lottery ticket and i intend to win, then i do, i'm not lucky because i intended to do it?

This is a good point. Winning the lottery is generally dependent upon the randomness of the draw going in your favor. So, if you were to win the lottery, I'd say good fortune (luck) was on your side. However, if you routinely hit the lottery over & over again, I'd have to believe that there is some kind of method (scientific, mathematical or otherwise) being employed & successfully so.

 

[IAC]

Wow, some terrible comparisons in this thread.

The chances of a fighter hitting another one in the head is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay higher than hitting a golf hole or guessing the lottery numbers, are you guys insane?

You guys should forget about "luck" because such a fucking thing does not even exist. Open your mind, think about context, think about probability, just don't bring this "luck" crap.

Examples not related with fighting are completely irrelevant.

 

[KingAvram]

Edit