jds "lucky" punch

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KingAvram

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I keep reading that the punch that dropped cain was pure luck.

im with bass rutten on this subject... If the punch thrown was aimed at the head and it lands, its not lucky.

Same with Cung le vs franklin
le: it was a lucky punch..
Bass: but you throwed the punch while aiming at the head
Le: Yes
Bass: then it wasnt lucky
 
I agree.

If he intended to hit Cain, and he did hit Cain, then that's not random luck. Same with Le/Franklin, or Fedor/Arlovski etc.
 
There's no such thing as a lucky punch in MMA unless you're swinging wildly with your eyes closed.
 
Well i think it could be considered lucky that all the random factors that go into making a KO punch connect aligned at the right time.

Do I think JDS isnt going to do it again? No.
 
It wasn't lucky. JDS' career consists of early knockouts. If it didn't I might entertain the idea.
 
There's a degree of luck to every strike. There's even luck in chess. You throw a strike based on your perception of your opponent's movements. Whether your perception is correct has a high degree of variance- luck. Whether your strike is thrown exactly as you intended is also subject to luck. Whether your strike just wobbles a guy or finishes him is also luck.

Was it a punch that crosses that imaginary line into being what we call a "lucky" punch? It was pretty close, I say yes. I also think he'll get "lucky" again tonight.
 
KingAvram said:
I keep reading that the punch that dropped cain was pure luck.

im with bass rutten on this subject... If the punch thrown was aimed at the head and it lands, its not lucky.

Same with Cung le vs franklin
le: it was a lucky punch..
Bass: but you throwed the punch while aiming at the head
Le: Yes
Bass: then it wasnt lucky
Click to expand...

that's the most retarded logic.

did you aim punch at the head? then it wasn't lucky?

How about? Did you aim the golfball at the hole? Then the hole in one wasn't lucky....

More goes into a punch than just aiming and swinging, the success depends on how your opponents moves into it and many other things. That's why fighters throw sometimes HUNDREDS of punches each fight and all of them are aiming to do serious damage but most don't.

So what's the difference between all the punches that Cung Le MISSED trying to do that same counter and the one that he landed?

Maybe that's the even better argument against the logic: cung le threw that same punch multiple times. It only landed the one time... so what was the difference?

I'm thinking the answer is that the opponent happened to move into perfectly this time instead of moving his head the other way like last time or staying out of reach like last time when Cung thought he was coming in. That difference IS the luck factor
 
It was 'lucky' to me in the sense that it was the best result possible given the variables, eg precise location it landed, Cain not moving slightly to lessen the potential damage etc.

It was not lucky in the sense that JDS trains to hit people very hard and has physical gifts making it easier for him to do it than most. I certainly think there was an element of luck, but JDS works very hard so he can perform in such a manner, so I wouldn't try and detract from his success by downplaying his effort or writing it off as 'pure luck'.

I guess we'll see if he has it in him to be lucky again today!
 
Two dudes throw at each other all fight, the better guy wins almost every time. The luck gives way to the skill in most fights. Grappling is obviously less about luck. A one-shot KO means much less, though we revere it.
 
Harai Goshi said:
Well i think it could be considered lucky that all the random factors that go into making a KO punch connect aligned at the right time.

Do I think JDS isnt going to do it again? No.
Click to expand...

following jds carreer it seems that he doesnt need profound "random factors" to ktfo someone... And lets be honest. the basics of the fighting game is offence and defence... A ko is cracking someones defence with your offence. Wouldnt call the factors of a ko all that random...
 
SuperKenMasters said:
what is luck? when preparation meets opportunity. was it a lucky punch?
Click to expand...

Preparation meeting opportunity requires some luck- but it isn't the definition of luck.

Maybe that punch was one of those things like "It was there so he took it", which wouldn't make it very lucky at all. We'll see tonight though.
 
i dotn think people literally mean it was luck.. i think people just dont think cain would get knocked out like that 10 times out of 10 vs jds.. cain underestimated juniors power and will now respect it more.. the fight will most likely not go the same
 
Agreed.

As I've said before, these Cain fans just turned into Shogun fans.

"Healthy Cain" can beat JDS.

Right, now GTFO. War JDS.
 
The only lucky move I recall in recent history was in TUF Smashes Finale, when Alloway threw a front kick to the body of Manny while Manny was switching level and it landed perfect in his chin. Other than that, this sport does not depend much on luck.

You can make a case for a random factor when Leonard Garcia throws a punch, since he pretty much swings his arms wildly without aiming. For JDS, no way.
 
BASSRUTTEN.jpg
 
JDS set up that punch. Nothing lucky about it.

UFC 155 - Cain Velasquez: Easy to Hit

Dos Santos does not often use hooks to the body, and is known somewhat as a headhunter, but his right straight to the body is an excellent way to draw opponents out of position. Arguably the hardest hitter in the heavyweight division, it will be hard for any heavyweight to ignore Dos Santos pot-shotting their midriff. Furthermore, Dos Santos' head movement toward the opponent's right hand as he throws the right straight baits the opponent into throwing a punch of his own. Notice in the above picture, of the right straight to the body that Dos Santos throws immediately before the knockout overhand, that Cain is punching to where he feels Dos Santos' head will be. This led to Dos Santos' overhand looping over the extending arm of Velasquez and landing in a "Cross Counter", assuring the knockout.
Click to expand...
 
Bas is wrong. People who say it's all luck are wrong as well.

Landing a strike obviously involves a lot of skill, but you unquestionably need luck, because you can't control the entire situation.
He can't control whether or not Cain avoids it. He can however increase his chances by setting it up with body shots, feints, angles etc.

Seriously, this is not debatable.
 
There is luck involved in anything. If Cain shoots from the outside and gets a take down early in the second fight it will be a result of skill,strength, and luck.
 
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