Social Is "Woke" going too far?

[Fury]

It's fucking tiring hearing about it from both sides honestly, I take the same approach as the dude above who said just watch what you want and fuck anyone else.

I do however like the irony of the perpetually online always-first-to-respond-in-the-war-room posters in here unironically using the phrase "perpetually online losers"

You're forgetting that they feel entitled to have things they think they might like made exactly how they like them.

Both sides of this dumb argument. If they start making more movies/tv/video games that you don't like.... Do something else with your time.

 

[UberHere]

Man children legit throw a temper-tantrum if a female video game character in a post-apocalyptic game isn't hot enough for them. It's loony. Just try to ignore them and consume whatever entertainment you like without them yapping in your ear about bullshit.

lol sure buddy

 

[UberHere]

It's fucking tiring hearing about it from both sides honestly, I take the same approach as the dude above who said just watch what you want and fuck anyone else.

I do however like the irony of the perpetually online always-first-to-respond-in-the-war-room posters in here unironically using the phrase "perpetually online losers"

Yup and they were all shit posts. Except for @deviake who put thought and solid arguments into his post. Anyway I wouldn’t consider T2 or Aliens woke.

 

[UberHere]

The right "hijacked" the word? The word was originally used by right wing conspiracy theorists, probably originating from The Matrix to signify people who chose to wake up from the Matrix. The left were the ones who hijacked the word and associated it with extreme progressivism.

Woke was being used in the 60’s by black activists.

 

[Renard]

The issue is that people have different definitions of woke. In a movie context I would define it as needless and illogical tokenism and modern politics shoved into content where it doesn't belong, which detracts from the overall enjoyment of the story and immersion.

For example having a movie on the Roman empire where half the soldiers are black and there's some sort of social commentary on Roman empire = evil white cis-normative patriarchy, which the "good" characters (who happen to be gay, transgender and/or black) are railing against.

It's not enough for a movie or TV show to merely have minorities or women in it for it to be "woke." Lots of content has that and it's not woke at all. If you thought that was the definition then I could see why you were confused. By that metric almost everything is woke and it's not.

 

[I Am Legion]

I always say the same thing....if something is well made and done really well, it doesn't matter if it is "woke". The issue is most woke things choose the wokeism over the quality and it suffers because of it. When you change the race, gender or sexual orientation of a character, because you want diversity, it is woke and usually bad. When you do so because that is the best person for the job, it will be fine. We have directors and writers out here that want to make things "gay" or "diverse" and those projects usually fail--The Marvels, Madame Web, Snow White, The Acolyte, The Sandman, Velma are examples. But when you have organic diversity for quality it succeeds--Dune, Vox Machina, Denzel as The Equalizer, Thor's Heimdall etc.

It also has a lot to do with respecting source material. James Bond is white, straight, and British. Superman is a white Kryptonian. Fictional or not, to just change their race or sexuality just "because", would be cheap and woke. Some people do go overboard calling everything woke. But to act like it isn't an issue is just as egregious and is just driven by agenda.

 

[heloder]

In particular, I am not a fan of changing the race of a main character

It's the worst.

 

[NoSmilez]

It doesn't bother me. I just don't consume the product if I don't like it. I wouldn't bitch about it for a long time. Maybe unless they start messing with boob physics in gaming.

 

[Xanzito]

None of what you described is woke. Woke is injecting ridiculous left wing social justice ideology into the movie that does nothing to advance the plot. This used to be done as satire (see PCU made in 1994). The movie was ahead of its time foreseeing how looney leftwing academic and political culture was to become.

A prime example would be the latest season of Fargo. Of course they have to make the antagonist not only a trump supporter, but to comment on how great a man he is. GTFO

When woke was a serious term it was used to describe people aware of racial injustice, but it isn’t used that way anymore. What woke has become just makes a mockery of that.

This. Wicked, Orange is the New Black, Barbie, those aren't woke, that's just how the product is for that specific public.
The issue is changing the 100 year old story about "Snow Woke" because it's "not 1930 anymore" and it seems those nasty bitches can't handle a love story cause it makes them think what they're missing.
And the gender/sexual orientation/race swap on characters just to pandemia. That shit sucks ass too.

 

[Poon Goon]

With all of the confusion over this subject I have found these products from Bill O' Reilly to be very helpful. You will know my stance from several feet away and I don't have to say a word.

 

[RemyR]

I'm pretty extremely against the recent extreme push for DEI policies but I'd be lying if I also wasn't worried about the anti-woke backlash.

It seems that woke-ism is dying that is fantastic news, the sooner the better. But the people fighting it also have to recognize that just because a movie has someone in it that's black or a strong female lead that doesn't automatically mean it's woke garbage. I honestly think that if Alien 2 were released today there'd be a group of people calling it woke and trashing it. I knew we were kind of losing it when people were upset that Ariel in the Little Mermaid was black. It's like dude we are talking about fish people here, show me what a real life mermaid looks like before we start getting worked up over racial recasting of fake people.

I know I'm ranting but I dunno man. I'm very happy to see far leftism go up in ashes. But it also seems like some random shit is getting caught up as collateral damage.

 

[Scheme]

I'm pretty extremely against the recent extreme push for DEI policies but I'd be lying if I also wasn't worried about the anti-woke backlash.

It seems that woke-ism is dying that is fantastic news, the sooner the better. But the people fighting it also have to recognize that just because a movie has someone in it that's black or a strong female lead that doesn't automatically mean it's woke garbage. I honestly think that if Alien 2 were released today there'd be a group of people calling it woke and trashing it. I knew we were kind of losing it when people were upset that Ariel in the Little Mermaid was black. It's like dude we are talking about fish people here, show me what a real life mermaid looks like before we start getting worked up over racial recasting of fake people.

I know I'm ranting but I dunno man. I'm very happy to see far leftism go up in ashes. But it also seems like some random shit is getting caught up as collateral damage.

People were always outraged when minority characters were race-swapped for white characters in the early days of Hollywood. Back then they had a reason though: the vast majority of actors were white and it was hard to find minority talent for every minority role in every movie.

Nowadays, we get diversity pushed on us because Blackrock, Vanguard and State Street (who have major stakes in every major corporation) will it so, by their own words:

 

[Possum Jenkins]

The thing with ultra progressives is that they HAVE to keep being seen to "progress" or else they appear conservative. So naturally things just get weirder and weirder until they run out of goodwill.

That's the spirit of The Enlightenment, though. The notion that there are lots of problems in society but they can and should be improved through human action.

Of course, conservatives have been against it from the beginning and have given all kinds of reasons throughout the centuries : it's against god's will, it's against the laws of nature, it'll lead to chaos, regular people are too stupid to make decisions, it was fine up until this point but "they" are taking it too far, etc. They've always thought it's the end of history and that any reform or movement towards greater equality is a step too far and is destructive.

But no, they're all just attempts towards improving society and people. In a lovely twist, you can thank the whitest white guys from the 1700s that looked like this for this:

 

[nhbbear]

It's the worst.

I am not religious, so…

 

[Possum Jenkins]

It also has a lot to do with respecting source material. James Bond is white, straight, and British. Superman is a white Kryptonian.

But James Bond's whiteness isn't an essential part of his character. But his gender, heterosexuality, age, nationality, elegance, all are, so to keep all these qualities and change his race would be fine. Especially since black Brits have been a sizable part of the English population for the last several decades.

Idris Elba as James Bond would have been great.

 

[Spam On Rye]

The myth of progress is coming off of the tracks. People are starting to realize that secular humanism is a wash. It's a lot bigger than a green black chick.

 

[oldshadow]

It's the worst.

Show us a picture or drawing of his father and we could tell better what he looked like. Not his step father.

I don't think that picture is probably accurate also.

It's really simple don't send your money and time on things you don't want to see. Knowing what is in a movie or any form of entertainment before you go helps everyone. Then people can decide if they want to support it.

The woke crowd throws a fit if people are warned about the content and pass it on and don't support it.

 

[Osculater]

It's the worst.

Everybody knows that Jesus is African-American

 

[Osculater]

The problem is they go too woke instead of telling a good story and Wicked was not bad imo

 

[I Am Legion]

I'm pretty extremely against the recent extreme push for DEI policies but I'd be lying if I also wasn't worried about the anti-woke backlash.

It seems that woke-ism is dying that is fantastic news, the sooner the better. But the people fighting it also have to recognize that just because a movie has someone in it that's black or a strong female lead that doesn't automatically mean it's woke garbage. I honestly think that if Alien 2 were released today there'd be a group of people calling it woke and trashing it. I knew we were kind of losing it when people were upset that Ariel in the Little Mermaid was black. It's like dude we are talking about fish people here, show me what a real life mermaid looks like before we start getting worked up over racial recasting of fake people.

I know I'm ranting but I dunno man. I'm very happy to see far leftism go up in ashes. But it also seems like some random shit is getting caught up as collateral damage.

All good points. The thing about Ariel, is that the little red head white mermaid turning black wasn't the issue. It's that they didn't audition a ton of girls and the best one just happened to be black. They SET out to make her black to.....just to make her black. INSTEAD of creating a new character that happened to be black, they just race swapped. Cost them hundreds of millions. Just like casting a Latina as Snow White who bashed the original, and changing 7 Dwarves into all sorts of woke bullshit. This was so blatantly bullshit that it bombed before it even released.

Example of how to do it correctly and how not to:

Fantastic 4 remake--They turned a white character who has a white sister in the same movie black. Michael B Jordan should have never been cast there, it makes no sense at all and stunk of DEI.

New Captain America--It is a NEW Captain, not just a race swap. The story line transitioned it to a deserving black character, the shield handed to him by the old cap. He might not prove to be as popular, but they handled it properly, and I am rooting for it to do well.