If Charles beats Islam, is he the new LW Goat?

[markg171]

He got finished by Jim Miller, Paul Felder, Islam and Cerrone at LW

Thank you for correcting yourself that only 4 of Charles losses count towards his LW GOAT potential as the rest weren't LW fights.

Now if only you could also acknowledge that Khabib only has 16 LW wins, not 29.

 

[JKS]

I'd like to see him defend the belt 1-2 times, then I think he's got a good case.

 

[Mammothman]

Thank you for correcting yourself that only 4 of Charles losses count towards his LW GOAT potential as the rest weren't LW fights.

Now if only you could also acknowledge that Khabib only has 16 LW wins, not 29.

Still have a lot of losses at LW.

Also Khabib 4 title wins > Charles 2 title wins.

 

[RonDante]

His record is 34-9. How is that “much better” than Khabib’s 29-0? If a fighter wins, he’s the GOAT but if he loses it doesn’t count? Or does it only work with fighters you like?

His record at lightweight is like 15 and 4, with two losses when he was like 21. Khabib is 13 and 0 at ufc lightweight

 

[Lee_]

Lol nice way to twist it but no, GSP and Jones didn't finish a lot of his opponents and they are the 2 top goats.

What are you even talking about? That has nothing to do with what I was saying. Anyway, we will see.

 

[markg171]

His record at lightweight is like 15 and 4, with two losses when he was like 21. Khabib is 13 and 0 at ufc lightweight

11-0. Horcher and Trujillo weren't LW fights.

We also all saw he missed weight against Justin.

 

[RonDante]

Man looking through this thread it’s like people think every single one of Oliveiras fights was at 155

 

[RonDante]

11-0. Horcher and Trujillo weren't LW fights.

We also all saw he missed weight against Justin.

Oh yeah lol

 

[Lee_]

Errr yeah Khabib brutalised and finished them first lol

He didn't brutalize them; he took them down and got a choke. He didn't really brutalize people much; I wouldn't characterize his wins that way.

 

[jitzmonkey]

If he wins and defends (on weight) a few times, then he’s definitely the greatest LW champ of all time.
He’s going to have to start by making a statement with Islam first; which is no easy task.

 

[JKS]

It's an interesting debate between Charles and Khabib. First and foremost, if were talking LW goat, you gotta considering only what they've accomplished at LW and not other divisions.

Khabib has 16 fights at LW and a perfect 16-0 record, 4 title wins (3 defenses). Now I gotta take this further with these assumptions and say that if Charles beats Islam, there will certainly be a third fight. Now I know this is a "what if" but this whole thread is based on "what ifs" so we gotta consider Charles would be Islam again.Charles would have a record of 25-4, 2 time LW champion with 3 defenses.

At that point, it's very subjective. Do you go with the guy who's got more wins and a bigger resume but has losses? Or the guy with less but complete dominance?I don't think it's really clear cut one way or the other. Unless Charles defends the belt 4 times in his second title reign.

 

[Mammothman]

What are you even talking about? That has nothing to do with what I was saying. Anyway, we will see.

Off course we will see.

 

[Lee_]

Off course we will see.

Meaning this conversation is meaningless UNTIL we see. It isn't hard.

 

[kellier]

I dunno about GOAT. He lost too many times.
THE most exciting fighter in LW history, maybe yeah.
I believe it would be great for the division if Charles takes it back, many interesting matchups to follow

His losses other than Islam and Felder are x5 at 145 (has no bearing on LW) or else Cerrone & Miller when he was a 21 yr old kid (after which he got shit advice to starve for 145)

Not everyone cuts their cloth beating cans in Russia

 

[Nobru]

This kind of thinking doesn’t make any sense to me. Even if our day to day life’s we stumble, lose everything and bounce back and be the best you know you can. Michael Jordan, Djokovic, Barry Bonds, Serena, Phelps these athletes are considered GOATS in their respective sports. They have all lost soo many times during their careers, does that make them GOATS? You aren’t defined by your loses but your wins and Oliviera has learnt from his early career to become a better fighter now.

man, Charles is great. dont get me wrong, at all.
I truly rooted for him against Islam and I will do it again now.
I am just not emotional about it. IMHO, too early to call him GOAT.
I already gave him the title of THE most entertaining fighter ever at LW. And thats a lot.

 

[Nobru]

There are zero interesting matches if Charles wins whereas we are yet to see Islam vs Dustin, Justin, Chandler or Beneil.

Islam x winner of Justin x Dustin. Loser x Beneil. Tsarukyan x Chandler. All would sound good to me

 

[Guy LeDouche]

Too many losses and not enough defenses, add in the fact he’s missed weight a bunch
He’s the product of recency bias, like how some were trying to prop up Kamaru’s title run over GSP.
You got to look at the entire career and not just the last few years.

 

[Shabal]

Yes

 

[OmegaRugal]

Sure, this makes sense in the Mt Rushmore of MMA discussion, but we aren't comparing him to GOATs - we are comparing him to Charles Oliveira lol.

Thats fair

 

[Joinho10]

No but he does cement his spot as the second-best. I think the more interesting question is what does a second win over Charles do for Islam? He would have in my opinion the best win streak of Charles n Khabib and still I feel somewhat hesitant to put him over Charles in the GOAT LW rankings.