Greatest boxer ever?

[Ox Baker]

 

[xXSpawnXx]

^^^The missing link, the last living neanderthal lol! If Adamek ends up fighting Andrew Golota, that will be another example.

 

[Ox Baker]

It was a response to that one poster's statement that "freakshows" like the 6'0" Floyd Patterson fighting the 6'0.5" Sonny Liston are a thing of the past.

 

[xXSpawnXx]

It was a response to that one poster's statement that "freakshows" like the 6'0" Floyd Patterson fighting the 6'0.5" Sonny Liston are a thing of the past. *CAPTAIN OBVIOUS*

Oh really?

 

[Hard as Iron]

Yeah. Liston was half an inch taller, and 20 pounds heavier. We never see that anymore.

Frame isn't the same as weight. A small fighter with 30 pounds forced on his natural frame (even if it's muscle) will be at a massive disadvantage against a fighter who fights at the same weight, but is his natural weight. Liston was clearly more comfortable in his body than Patterson. Patterson wasn't built for heavyweight.

I think people focus too much on reach and not enough on range. Just because someone has a longer reach, it doesn't mean he can just sit outside and box. Look at Aaron Pryor outboxing Tommy Hearns in the amateurs despite a massive reach advantage on the latter's part. Liston had a huge reach with his jab, but not as big a range with his power shots. Look at his fights with Cleveland Williams. Williams's reach measurement was 4" less than that of Liston's, but watching those fights, it looks like Williams has the advantage.

That's because a lot of Liston's "reach" was actually just his broad shoulders. Again, big frame.

Patterson had the same kind of power as Mike Tyson, only to a lesser extent.

Just not at heavyweight.

Liston walked around at 240 or so, and he had to train his ass off to make it down to 215 for fight time.

With modern training and supplements, he could shred down to 207 or so and do a reasonable cut down to 200. He was in great shape at his peak, especially for his time, but that was a different time. He would be a cruiserweight today. A flabby 240 Liston would get murdered by the Russian giants.

A middleweight? He moved to light heavyweight because he couldn't make 165 as a pro. At 190 pounds, there wasn't an ounce of fat on him. He would've had trouble making 175, let alone 160, even if he dehydrated for days. Look at how much trouble Roy Jones had making 175 after fighting at heavyweight.Yeah, right.

At 190 pounds, he had too much muscle on his frame. Yes, it's the same mistake Roy made. If he was reasonable with his body, and with today's training and supplements, he would be at 160, possibly 168. I don't think he's any bigger than Pavlik, for example. I don't even think he'd need a bit cut to make 160.

Ruiz is a joke. He fights giants like Valuev or a beefed up Roy. He's a horrible representative for boxing.

 

[MMAGuruLV***]

Damn, you all just got skooled by a whitebelt!

Oh snap son!

 

[bradlee180]

With modern training and supplements, he (Liston) could shred down to 207 or so and do a reasonable cut down to 200. He was in great shape at his peak, especially for his time, but that was a different time. He would be a cruiserweight today. A flabby 240 Liston would get murdered by the Russian giants.

At 190 pounds, he (Patterson) had too much muscle on his frame. Yes, it's the same mistake Roy made. If he was reasonable with his body, and with today's training and supplements, he would be at 160, possibly 168. I don't think he's any bigger than Pavlik, for example. I don't even think he'd need a bit cut to make 160.

Ruiz is a joke. He fights giants like Valuev or a beefed up Roy. He's a horrible representative for boxing.

Damn, you all just got skooled by a whitebelt!
Oh snap son!

Yep, you two guys are Borderline Intellectual Functioning.

.

 

[Flexwave2003]

You know I personally dont think Ruiz is a joke and find those kinds of statements incredibly disrespectful.

Hes not the greatest ever, but to deminish what he has accomplished in his career by simply summarizing him up as a joke is quite irritating for me to see personally.

 

[MMAGuruLV***]

Yep, you two guys are Borderline Intellectual Functioning.

.

Your brown belt doesnt make you an expert retard.

Get over yourself and your undeserved sense of self-satisfaction.

Nice, by the way, that you quote ME to try to sound smart.

 

[bradlee180]

Your brown belt doesnt make you an expert retard.

What's an "expert retard"?

.

 

[MMAGuruLV***]

I gotta give you that one, that was funny

I can appreciate a good joke at my expense

 

[pittelp]

I'm not a huge boxing fan and haven't followed much of it, but I dig into these discussions. Who do you think was the best boxer of all times?


With my minor knowledge, I think candidates might be:

• Muhammad Ali
• Floyd Mayweather Jr.
• Roy Jones Jr.
• Joe Frazier
• George Foreman
• Lennox Lewis

Thoughts? Other candidates?

I would add Joe Luis, Sugar Ray Robinson, and Leonard and subtract Joe Frazier and George Foreman since each boxer had an era.

 

[Hard as Iron]

You know I personally dont think Ruiz is a joke and find those kinds of statements incredibly disrespectful.

Hes not the greatest ever, but to deminish what he has accomplished in his career by simply summarizing him up as a joke is quite irritating for me to see personally.

Turn in your man card and boxing credentials. They have been revoked. :icon_twis

Oh, and I didn't have to mention names because I was replying to a quote, so the context was clear.

 

[Seano]

Turn in your man card and boxing credentials. They have been revoked. :icon_twis

Oh, and I didn't have to mention names because I was replying to a quote, so the context was clear.

Ruiz may not be an exciting fighter but he managed to pull off some pretty good wins in his career. You don't have to like his style, but you should respect him.

 

[MMAGuruLV***]

respect is one thing, but the GOAT list?

c'mon dawg

 

[Khan-age!]

1) Sugar Ray Robinson
2) M. Ali
3) Sugar Ray Lenard
4) Marvin Hagler
5) Pernell Whitaker
6) Floyd Mayweather Jr.
7) J. C. Chavez
8) Roy Jones Jr.
9) Bernard Hopkins
10) Lennox Lewis
11) Joe Calzaghe
12) James Toney
13) Thomas Hearns
14) Joe Frazier
15) Larry Holmes
Those r about tha top 15 best boxers of all time 2 me.

Here you go.

 

[MMAGuruLV***]

next person to say "(blank) is the best hands down, no reason to start these stupid threads." I will fly you out to vegas and pay your 20 dollar licencing fee and your 50 dollar entry fee for Tuff n Nuff.

Cause what your really saying is:

"Im the king of all that is ignorant! You cant touch my ignorance! I come on a thread based on opinion, and actually convince my retarded self that my opinion is the only one that counts. Like I'm the fuckin Truman show, and the world is just my movie!"

Drink some fuckin draino already!

 

[MMAGuruLV***]

sorry for that last one. I get a little heated sometimes.

 

[Hard as Iron]

Ruiz may not be an exciting fighter but he managed to pull off some pretty good wins in his career. You don't have to like his style, but you should respect him.

50 years ago he would have nothing but disqualification losses for his ridiculous clench loving. 100 years ago he would be a riot starter.

Troll edit: 50 years in the future he would be a Muay Thai champion, and people would wonder how he would do in the lost art of boxing. :icon_chee:icon_chee:icon_chee

 

[Ox Baker]

50 years ago he would have nothing but disqualification losses for his ridiculous clench loving. 100 years ago he would be a riot starter.

Really? Then how did Harry Greb get those 261 wins? How did Muhammad Ali win the rematch with Joe Frazier?