Law Florida - Senate passes Republican sponsored Bill to outlaw lab-grown meat. DeSantis supports ban

[panamaican]

So? Nobody has to die to get the meat, so why do all the small government and none of their business arguments ITT suddenly vanish depending on what meat they grow? How about they ONLY grow meat from animals that are illegal to hunt or farm and endangered species, and beef, pork, chicken and fish can be traditionally farmed or fished? Then it really would be just an addition that wouldn't step on the toes of existing farmers and fishermen.

I think the piece that you're not asking is "so what if it steps on the toes of existing farmers and fishermen?"

Capitalism would say that if a company can produce a cheaper but equivalent product, we should be fine with that.

I don't think the human meat analogy translates because human meat isn't illegal to begin with, only the common ways to obtain it, so a lab grown version wouldn't trigger the same issues. Cattle, beef, pork, etc. are legal and legally obtainable.

 

[HereticBD]

Florida GOP has leaned heavily in restricting people's choices. They started with left-leaning positions but they've graduated into full on big government. Legislating away individual freedom because Ron knows what's best for you...even better than you do.

The real problem is that because of how partisan the country has become, people who would normally oppose this type of government intervention are going to stay quiet because they can't or won't criticize DeSantis publicly.

All that from lab meat being banned, huh? LOL.

 

[terrapin]

The main good of lab grown meat is that it will end the holocaust of animal slaughter and mass production that we call the meat industry.

The good of this far outweighs any damage it might do to existing farmers on any level.

 

[sickc0d3r]

Lol, Florida. Nobody loves telling people what they can or can’t do more than Liddle Ronnie Meatballs.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Pretty dumb. I for one would like the Freedom to eat a lab grown burger while bolting a cow in the head just for the fun of it.

That's the American way

 

[jefferz]

Florida has 15,000 cattle farmers and the biggest seafood export in the country, so not exactly win-win for farmers and fishermen who can't exactly throw on a lab coat and sell their farms to Bill Gates or the Chinese.

So what happens when "lab grown meat" hits mass production, and the price becomes cheaper than farm raised.
Is Florida going to keep the ban on, forcing the other 22 million people in Florida to pay higher prices to save those farmers?
If we're banning it to "save the farmers", at what point are the farmers no longer worth saving?

 

[terrapin]

It's very strange how people are selective about what they want to control and give people freedom with... There seems to be no rhyme or reason to it.

If it's automation that causes people to lose jobs? Well other jobs will open up and it will all work out! You got to protect the business owner right? But now that it's cattle ranchers somehow they should be protected from the forward movement of technology?

The good of this technology far outweighs the cattle industry in every way possible.

Lab grown meat doesn't fart so that's way way less greenhouse gases too.

 

[MicroBrew]

So? Nobody has to die to get the meat, so why do all the small government and none of their business arguments ITT suddenly vanish depending on what meat they grow? How about they ONLY grow meat from animals that are illegal to hunt or farm and endangered species, and beef, pork, chicken and fish can be traditionally farmed or fished? Then it really would be just an addition that wouldn't step on the toes of existing farmers and fishermen.

You really don't see the difference between human DNA and non human animal DNA?

 

[MicroBrew]

let me guess, leftists support this because it'll likely be produced by a big tech/bio firm, preferred corporation as opposed to farm

It doesn't matter who makes it, the point is that as long it's safe (and there is no evidence it isn't ) people should have a choice. Why are these Republicans against people having choices.

 

[MicroBrew]

Florida GOP has leaned heavily in restricting people's choices. They started with left-leaning positions but they've graduated into full on big government. Legislating away individual freedom because Ron knows what's best for you...even better than you do.

The real problem is that because of how partisan the country has become, people who would normally oppose this type of government intervention are going to stay quiet because they can't or won't criticize DeSantis publicly.

It's all part of the anti woke cultre war bullshit bandwagon that Ron has hitched himself to. He's trying to be like Trump, thinking if he takes every position that is perceived to be anti woke the GOP base will gravitate to him. He tried it with Disney and thought he was in a good position to secure the GOP 2024 nomination but too bad for him that the base decided they much rather have the real Donald Trump than Dollar Store Donald (aka DeSantis)

 

[nostradumbass]

I think the piece that you're not asking is "so what if it steps on the toes of existing farmers and fishermen?"

Capitalism would say that if a company can produce a cheaper but equivalent product, we should be fine with that.

I don't think the human meat analogy translates because human meat isn't illegal to begin with, only the common ways to obtain it, so a lab grown version wouldn't trigger the same issues. Cattle, beef, pork, etc. are legal and legally obtainable.

So is that a yes to opposing a ban on lab grown human meat? There's no such thing as "common ways to obtain" human meat.

Sure, if we lived in a purely capitalist society, but we don't, and we have very heavy central planning. Nearly every major corporation and industry receives subsidies, preferential taxation and loopholes, heavy regulation often written by lobbyists for those industries, so if we're going to have such hands on planning already, fishing and farming seems like a pretty good choice to protect.

Cultured meat certainly isn't a self-funded endeavor, it's had $2.8 billion in investment from governments and venture capital.

State of the Industry Report: Cultivated meat and seafood | GFI

This report details the commercial landscape, investments, regulatory developments, and scientific progress in the cultivated meat and seafood industry.

gfi.org

Unprecedented government support for cultivated meat​

• In Europe, the Netherlands announced $65 million in funding for cultivated meat and precision fermentation, the world’s largest-ever public investment in the cellular agriculture field.
• Israel, China, and South Korea all increased policy support for cultivated meat development.
• The U.S. Congress directed nearly $6 million in research funds to alternative protein R&D. California approved the first-ever state investment in cultivated meat research, directing $5 million to R&D across three labs, two of which focus on cultivated meat.
• Israel launched the largest government-backed cultivated meat consortium to date, involving the country’s top food producers and academic labs.

So what happens when "lab grown meat" hits mass production, and the price becomes cheaper than farm raised.
Is Florida going to keep the ban on, forcing the other 22 million people in Florida to pay higher prices to save those farmers?
If we're banning it to "save the farmers", at what point are the farmers no longer worth saving?

I have no idea what they are planning on doing at some unspecific point way in the future, but the cultivated meat isn't even available for consumers currently, so you can pocket that question and come back to it when they start pumping out fake meat that it's significantly cheaper to buy that real meat. If voters demand it, I'm sure they'd be willing to, or they can give it to bums or something.

Right now the cost isn't anywhere close.


In 2013, the first clean burger cost $325,000. While the price has decreased dramatically since then, current estimates range from $363 to $2,400 per pound, making it much more expensive than regular meat. (A pound of conventionally produced lean ground beef costs less than $6. Organically raised beef typically costs about a dollar more.)

 

[nostradumbass]

You really don't see the difference between human DNA and non human animal DNA?

Yes. I'm not 100% sure lab grown meat even has DNA, but I don't see how that would make a difference in whether it's the government's business or not.

 

[Sinister]

Being reactionary to cultivated meat is stupid. Traditionalism for traditionalism's sake. If the nutritional profile is good, people like the taste, its nutrient dense, and not costly to the environment to manufacture or the consumer then there shouldn't be a problem. If data proves its garbage, no one should eat it. This decision should have ZERO to do with "wokeism."

It's a much much bigger concern that like 4 corporations control all of the actual meat processing which results in the ranchers and consumers getting f*cked on each end. If cultivated meat can act as a check on them by presenting a viable competitive option, good.

 

[Osculater]

There's been no long-term studies into the benefits/hazards of lab-grown meat.

And has anyone asked the question 'lab-grown from what?'

Aborted babies

 

[MicroBrew]

Yes. I'm not 100% sure lab grown meat even has DNA, but I don't see how that would make a difference in whether it's the government's business or not.

It's a matter of ethics. Human dna would make it kinda cannibalism.

 

[MicroBrew]

All that from lab meat being banned, huh? LOL.

Well ....

The crusade against Anti Woke / ESG ideology is a big part of it, atleast that is how DeSantis is selling it.

DeSantis sees “fake meat” as part of the hedge-fund-led “ESG” campaign to dictate the “environmental, social, and governance “of corporations. He says ESG is a scheme to impose an agenda on society by the economy.

Gov. DeSantis favors bills to keep lab-grown meat out of Florida

Ron DeSantis is back to doing what Governors do as he left the Presidential campaign trail. And Gov. DeSantis has just made it clear that he looks

www.foodsafetynews.com

---

While speaking in Hardee County last week, DeSantis slammed the scientific innovation as part of his crusade against "ESG" (environmental, social and governance), a business philosophy that encourages investors to throw their money behind companies with consideration to their handling of environmental and social issues.

https://fox59.com/news/national-world/ron-desantis-has-beef-with-lab-grown-meat/

 

[jefferz]

I have no idea what they are planning on doing at some unspecific point way in the future, but the cultivated meat isn't even available for consumers currently, so you can pocket that question and come back to it when they start pumping out fake meat that it's significantly cheaper to buy that real meat. If voters demand it, I'm sure they'd be willing to, or they can give it to bums or something.

Right now the cost isn't anywhere close.


In 2013, the first clean burger cost $325,000. While the price has decreased dramatically since then, current estimates range from $363 to $2,400 per pound, making it much more expensive than regular meat. (A pound of conventionally produced lean ground beef costs less than $6. Organically raised beef typically costs about a dollar more.)

The current price is high because only a few companies are doing it. When the process gets scaled up, the price will go down.

 

[MicroBrew]

Cultured meat certainly isn't a self-funded endeavor, it's had $2.8 billion in investment from governments and venture capital.

Farm Subsidies

 

[nostradumbass]

It's a matter of ethics. Human dna would make it kinda cannibalism.

Yes, and cannibalism is illegal because it generally involves killing somebody to get the meat or stealing sick or injured bodies, though according to @panamaican , getting the meat is the only part that's illegal, not the actual cannibalism. I don't think that really ever came up before for there to be much of a distinction, but if they're calling this a clean and ethical way to get meat, I don't see why the species would make a difference. It seems like they're squandering the technology by focusing on already abundant meats instead of ones that are harder to get, more expensive or that have legal or ethical concerns around getting them at all.

The current price is high because only a few companies are doing it. When the process gets scaled up, the price will go down.

Ok, well when they lower the price by 99% to make it noticeably lower than real meat, and they've worked the bugs out and done long term studies on somebody else, then we can revisit the topic.

 

[MicroBrew]

Yes, and cannibalism is illegal because it generally involves killing somebody to get the meat or stealing sick or injured bodies, though according to @panamaican , getting the meat is the only part that's illegal, not the actual cannibalism. I don't think that really ever came up before for there to be much of a distinction, but if they're calling this a clean and ethical way to get meat, I don't see why the species would make a difference. It seems like they're squandering the technology by focusing on already abundant meats instead of ones that are harder to get, more expensive or that have legal or ethical concerns around getting them at all.



Ok, well when they lower the price by 99% to make it noticeably lower than real meat, and they've worked the bugs out and done long term studies on somebody else, then we can revisit the topic.

What has banning cultured meat got to do with whether it should be legal to grow human meat?