Law Don't let your kids chemically transition

[Fox by the Sea]

“2021 and 2022 have been record-breaking years for anti-transgender legislation, and the majority of it specifically focuses on trans young people and students. Many of these legislative and governmental efforts aim to criminalize gender-affirming care for trans youth,” said Tordoff. “Given what we know about the importance of timely access to this care for young people, if these laws take effect, the consequences could result in lost lives and incredibly negative impacts on the wellbeing of trans youth and their families.”

You really should go back to your yogurt reviews forum if you can't even focus on the topic anymore.

 

[Ruprecht]

Can't say I've been following the US very closely on this issue. Do the state laws restricting hormone treatment and surgery from children apply to intersex kids as well?

 

[mkess101]

Mental Health Outcomes in Transgender and Nonbinary Youths Receiving Gender-Affirming Care
"Question Is gender-affirming care for transgender and nonbinary (TNB) youths associated with changes in depression, anxiety, and suicidality?

Findings In this prospective cohort of 104 TNB youths aged 13 to 20 years, receipt of gender-affirming care, including puberty blockers and gender-affirming hormones, was associated with 60% lower odds of moderate or severe depression and 73% lower odds of suicidality over a 12-month follow-up.

Meaning This study found that access to gender-affirming care was associated with mitigation of mental health disparities among TNB youths over 1 year; given this population's high rates of adverse mental health outcomes, these data suggest that access to pharmacological interventions may be associated with improved mental health among TNB youths over a short period."

The willful ignorance ITT for the sake of trashing non-binary gender is staggering. Enjoy your whinefest but know you have no idea what you are talking about.

OMG a study 104 kids...holy shit you've solved it! And LMAO at using a follow up ONE YEAR later when we are trying to discern long term consequences.

And it's telling that even after I point out that we're talking about ONLY the chemical and surgical aspects, you immediately revert to crying about everyone discarding (or worse being "out to get") trans kids.

In the end, do whatever you want. Pump your confused kids full of all the cocktails that Pfizer or Moderna can come up with and hang your hat on a study of 100 kids to justify it. Your choice. Not a decision I am likely to have to make with my kid, but if I did I can tell you that fucking with her body's growth cycle chemically wouldn't be on the table. And I'd still love and support her no matter what. But you do you.

Edit: and "ages 13-20 years"?? Almost all of those kids would already have gone through puberty then. My kid is 12 and she and almost all her friends her age have their periods, are going through the obvious physical changes associated with puberty, etc. How is this study really relevant when it comes to chemical puberty blockers if most of the kids are past puberty?

 

[sangreporsangre]

OMG a study 104 kids...holy shit you've solved it! And LMAO at using a follow up ONE YEAR later when we are trying to discern long term consequences.

And it's telling that even after I point out that we're talking about ONLY the chemical and surgical aspects, you immediately revert to crying about everyone discarding (or worse being "out to get") trans kids.

In the end, do whatever you want. Pump your confused kids full of all the cocktails that Pfizer or Moderna can come up with and hang your hat on a study of 100 kids to justify it. Your choice. Not a decision I am likely to have to make with my kid, but if I did I can tell you that fucking with her body's growth cycle chemically wouldn't be on the table. And I'd still love and support her no matter what. But you do you.

Edit: and "ages 13-20 years"?? Almost all of those kids would already have gone through puberty then. My kid is 12 and she and almost all her friends her age have their periods, are going through the obvious physical changes associated with puberty, etc. How is this study really relevant when it comes to chemical puberty blockers if most of the kids are past puberty?

The fact that they use such low-quality studies to try and manufacture consent for such a drastic medical intervention should be a MAJOR red flag. I don't understand the confidence in the medical industrial complex that some of these guys have when it comes to this issue. One would have to at least admit to themselves that all the ingredients are here for a massive medical scandal - keep in mind that there is no way to really prove that someone has a "gender identity" that doesn't match the body they were "assigned".

 

[Andy Capp]

OMG a study 104 kids...holy shit you've solved it! And LMAO at using a follow up ONE YEAR later when we are trying to discern long term consequences.

And it's telling that even after I point out that we're talking about ONLY the chemical and surgical aspects, you immediately revert to crying about everyone discarding (or worse being "out to get") trans kids.

In the end, do whatever you want. Pump your confused kids full of all the cocktails that Pfizer or Moderna can come up with and hang your hat on a study of 100 kids to justify it. Your choice. Not a decision I am likely to have to make with my kid, but if I did I can tell you that fucking with her body's growth cycle chemically wouldn't be on the table. And I'd still love and support her no matter what. But you do you.

Edit: and "ages 13-20 years"?? Almost all of those kids would already have gone through puberty then. My kid is 12 and she and almost all her friends her age have their periods, are going through the obvious physical changes associated with puberty, etc. How is this study really relevant when it comes to chemical puberty blockers if most of the kids are past puberty?

It's one study, nitwit. It's not all there is. But like I said, cheers to you, vent your spleen all you like. I'm out.

 

[mkess101]

It's one study, nitwit. It's not all there is. But like I said, cheers to you, vent your spleen all you like. I'm out.

It's the one YOU posted as some type of "evidence". And it's ages 13-20 when we are talking about puberty blockers. I'm sorry you tossed out something irrelevant and were called out.

Some of you are so damn transparent. The first whiff of people using common sense and saying "Hey, pumping kids full of drugs to halt puberty MIGHT not be a great idea..." you immediately get red faced and start crying and calling everyone transphobic. Objectively it sure as hell makes you look like an agenda is far more important to you than what's best for these kids you claim to be championing.

 

[Lubaolong]

I haven’t checked, but with the Pfizer/Moderna comment and all the conspiracy talk, I’m curious if these same people denying the existence of trans/non-binary identity and wanting to deny these kids medical care are the same people who rally against Dr Fauci, think COVID is a hoax, don’t believe in vaccines, etc. it seems like there might be considerable overlap.

 

[Deorum]

"LOL, you must be gay. How many dicks have you sucked, gay boy!"

<45>

Gay Shaming isn't nice.

 

[Lubaolong]

It's the one YOU posted as some type of "evidence". And it's ages 13-20 when we are talking about puberty blockers. I'm sorry you tossed out something irrelevant and were called out.

Some of you are so damn transparent. The first whiff of people using common sense and saying "Hey, pumping kids full of drugs to halt puberty MIGHT not be a great idea..." you immediately get red faced and start crying and calling everyone transphobic. Objectively it sure as hell makes you look like an agenda is far more important to you than what's best for these kids you claim to be championing.

You don’t finish puberty in one year. Lol. If kids are a little further along, you can still use puberty blockers to stop unwanted things like menstruation or to prevent further development of unwanted secondary sex characteristics.

People are saying gender affirming care is not life saving, doesn’t help, “half the people kill themselves,” and other nonsense. He posted a study from Harvard showing a significant improvement in mental health and significant decrease in suicidal ideation after treatment. Seems like a logical rebuttal to share.

 

[mkess101]

You don’t finish puberty in one year. Lol. If kids are a little further along, you can still use puberty blockers to stop unwanted things like menstruation or to prevent further development of unwanted secondary sex characteristics.

People are saying gender affirming care is not life saving, doesn’t help, “half the people kill themselves,” and other nonsense. He posted a study from Harvard showing a significant improvement in mental health and significant decrease in suicidal ideation after treatment. Seems like a logical rebuttal to share.

Yeah...the kids are 13-20. Assuming they're evenly spread out among the age range (which we don't even know), most will have already FINISHED going through puberty by the time they entered the study. I'm guessing you don't have kids? I have one who is on a swim team with hundreds of kids. Ages 8-18. Every weekend I can literally see roughly where kids are along with their physical development. It factors in a ton with how fast they are within their age groups etc.

It's obviously a tiny study, but that doesn't mean there aren't aspects of that care that may prevent depression or suicide. I'm not arguing that. And I'm not arguing on behalf of others. I'm telling you and him that a kneejerk reaction of "OMG you transphobe!!!" when someone says giving kids drugs to block puberty isn't a good idea is insanity on your part. And not beneficial.

 

[IamStryker]

Most of the treatments kids recieve are not necessary. We give short kids growth hormone. It's pretty common, it's literally treating body image issue with hormones. I don't think I've ever heard a discussion about the risks it could pose. We give hormone therapy to many/most teenage girls to treat cramps or regulate their cycle. That comes with 2 different cancer risks and a risk of blood clots or loss of vision. We have hard data on this. I don't see multiple threads a week on here about that risk.

I'm going to try to respond to everything and I'm going to be completely honest/good faith. I have never heard of giving hormones to short children. Maybe give me a link to this so I can see what it's about first. The details are going to matter. I have no idea how many girls go on birth control just to regulate their periods. I doubt the risks are the same for this vs giving them abnormal amounts of testosterone.

My main point on this is going to be that this trans issue is about a lot more than just some risks from the hormone treatment. Most of these kids that transition are going to continue transitioning which means they take puberty blockers, hormones, and then have surgery. The girl in this story had ger breasts removed. She really screwed up her health and it was completely unnecessary. She had no medical reason to do any of this. She did it because of the lgbtq culture that she wanted to be a part of. That is why this is such a huge issue.

And they don't just let kids decide to transition. You can't buy a transition kit over the counter at your local piggly wiggly. A minor can't just ask their pediatrician and the Doctor says YOLO. A parent or guardian, a shrink, a medical doctor, and in some cases a surgeon all have to agree to this.

If that is really true then why does this happen? The girl in this story did not have severe gender dysphoria. Yet somehow all of the people in charge of this happening gave it the green light. She went to these people and said that she is transgender and in a very short time they gave her the drugs and removed her breasts. So if this is supposed to be a closely monitored process how did this happen? One of my issues is that trans ideology doesn't even require gender dysohoria. Adults are told to affirm these kids because if you dont affirm them then you are being transphobic. I think this is what leads to children being allowed to make this gigantic mistake.

All of this is ultimately beside the point. I'm not making the case for this treatment. I'm saying people are lying about the root of their concern, it's all the thinly veiled culture war issue and all the outrage is conjured from a very dishonest place.

Based on everything I just posted you really think my concern is just political and not genuine? If you aren't going to defend transitioning children then can you understand why people have big concerns with it?

For some personal reference here I have a young daughter. She is a kid who is easy to influence. She is a beautiful girl and has never had any gender dysphoria. In the past she has expressed enjoying some boy activities more than girl activities. My wife and I are convinced that if gender ideology was pushed into her brain she most likely would have ran with it and chose to be a boy. This is what disturbs me as a parent. Teaching this to children and thinking it can't be harmful is nonsense.

 

[MoparOrNoCar]

Framing transphobia as a debate is dishonest. I'm not debating because there is no debate. It's an attack. Just like homosexuals were (and still are) attacked over their rights, you and others are attacking transgender people. This time it's not about the right to marry or adopt kids but the right to life-saving medical treatment and whether or not their identity is a trend. Your "trans debate" nonsense is not done in good faith. You're just being an asshole and trying to push these kids out of view and ensure they don't have the same basic human rights as you.

All of this is complete nonsense.

Who are you to say that giving kids irreversible drugs is a life saving medical treatment? You have no idea if it is or not.

What human right do I have that I am insisting trans kids shouldn't have? I don't think that I should have been given life altering drugs as a child either. I don't think that I should have been twerked in front of by a man dressed like a woman when I was a child. What are you even talking about here?

The stats on how many Gen Z'ers identify with LGBT is absolute proof that this is a social contagion. This doesn't mean that every single LGBT person is LGBT because of the social aspect. It's the massive spike in the amount of them that identify with this group that is the social contagion. Pretending as if it's liberation that is causing 20% of them to identify with this group is asinine.

You have no argument here, which is why you resort to these lame, yet typical tactics. It's always the same.

1. Why do you care?
2. Why do you hate people?
3. You're a bigot.

Rinse and repeat.

 

[MoparOrNoCar]

You know, some of us actually view gay people as equals and wouldn't be offended when called gay. Neither would we use that as an insult, because how is that insulting to someone?

Might as well be insulting people by calling them left handed, it doesn't quite work unless they believe that being left handed is somehow negative.

If someone insinuates that you're gay and that bothers you, then you are the problem, not them.

Yeah this would maybe hold weight if you guys used it in any debate other than when it comes to homosexuals.

I don't see you guys saying that conservatives secretly want to be liberals because they're arguing against liberals.

I don't see you guys saying that pro lifers secretly want to be pro choicers.

I don't see you guys saying that anti vaxxers secretly want to be vaxxed.

The "comeback" is only used when talking about homosexuals.

Sorry, you lose again.

 

[mkess101]

I haven’t checked, but with the Pfizer/Moderna comment and all the conspiracy talk, I’m curious if these same people denying the existence of trans/non-binary identity and wanting to deny these kids medical care are the same people who rally against Dr Fauci, think COVID is a hoax, don’t believe in vaccines, etc. it seems like there might be considerable overlap.

I'm vaxxed and boosted, bud. I'm against mandates about the vaccine but decided it was beneficial for myself and my kid.

Saying that drug companies are profit driven to unacceptable levels when it comes to societal impact doesn't mean they do nothing beneficial. Do you actually deny their role in the opioid epidemic? I sure hope you aren't that dense.

The ability to assess these things individually should not be that difficult. It's static and lazy thinking to say "Welp Pfizer played a big role in the opioid epidemic so everything they've ever done is worthless ." Just as it is moronic to say "Well I think the Covid vaccine was a win for society so...sure let's have Merck or Moderna flood doctors with puberty blockers to divvy out to confused kids because if they came up with the Covid vaccine they MUST be looking out for the best interests of those kids!"

Be a little more dynamic in your thought processes.

 

[Lubaolong]

Yeah...the kids are 13-20. Assuming they're evenly spread out among the age range (which we don't even know), most will have already FINISHED going through puberty by the time they entered the study. I'm guessing you don't have kids? I have one who is on a swim team with hundreds of kids. Ages 8-18. Every weekend I can literally see roughly where kids are along with their physical development. It factors in a ton with how fast they are within their age groups etc.

It's obviously a tiny study, but that doesn't mean there aren't aspects of that care that may prevent depression or suicide. I'm not arguing that. And I'm not arguing on behalf of others. I'm telling you and him that a kneejerk reaction of "OMG you transphobe!!!" when someone says giving kids drugs to block puberty isn't a good idea is insanity on your part. And not beneficial.

I have kids.

People on Sherdog don’t know what treatment is appropriate or not. You don’t decide these things. And there are plenty examples of transphobic comments in this thread. Denying their identities, saying they are just confused or part of a trend, they aren’t a ‘real’ whatever, wanting to deny them access to recommended medical care (again, you don’t decide what’s appropriate or not), these are all examples of transphobic behavior.

 

[chardog]

I'm vaxxed and boosted, bud. I'm against mandates about the vaccine but decided it was beneficial for myself and my kid.

Saying that drug companies are profit driven to unacceptable levels when it comes to societal impact doesn't mean they do nothing beneficial. Do you actually deny their role in the opioid epidemic? I sure hope you aren't that dense.

The ability to assess these things individually should not be that difficult. It's static and lazy thinking to say "Welp Pfizer played a big role in the opioid epidemic so everything they've ever done is worthless ." Just as it is moronic to say "Well I think the Covid vaccine was a win for society so...sure let's have Merck or Moderna flood doctors with puberty blockers to divvy out to confused kids because if they came up with the Covid vaccine they MUST be looking out for the best interests of those kids!"

Be a little more dynamic in your thought processes.

{<Mcgoat}

you coming around

fact is that teens are dumb as heck

my son is a he/him and gay around his girlfriend, which he's also banging

I got three teens in the house and they're dumb/confused AF, and I cant beat the crap out of them either. There's only one way to win the parenting game, deep, slow, subversion. I dont get pulled into their level, but I see my wife does and consistently LOSES hard. 1 of my 5 kids is vaccinated, the older one, he wanted it so he could be social at school, they promised no mask, and that lasted for a few months............. the rest wont be getting covid vaxxed, they already got covid.......

not even going to entertain hormonal changing drugs for all but one of my kids, that is autistic, anything is worth discussing for him, but I'll weigh out the pros and cons myself. in this day and age, I'm considered antivax, and it aint gonna shame me into anything.

 

[Fox by the Sea]

plenty examples of transphobic
all examples of transphobic

we get it, you learned a buzzword.

 

[Lubaolong]

I'm vaxxed and boosted, bud. I'm against mandates about the vaccine but decided it was beneficial for myself and my kid.

Saying that drug companies are profit driven to unacceptable levels when it comes to societal impact doesn't mean they do nothing beneficial. Do you actually deny their role in the opioid epidemic? I sure hope you aren't that dense.

The ability to assess these things individually should not be that difficult. It's static and lazy thinking to say "Welp Pfizer played a big role in the opioid epidemic so everything they've ever done is worthless ." Just as it is moronic to say "Well I think the Covid vaccine was a win for society so...sure let's have Merck or Moderna flood doctors with puberty blockers to divvy out to confused kids because if they came up with the Covid vaccine they MUST be looking out for the best interests of those kids!"

Be a little more dynamic in your thought processes.

People who are providing care for transgendered youth are not being bribed by drug companies for 40-60-year-old drugs.

 

[King Joffery]

I know a guy on another forum who admitted he wanted to be a girl when he was a kid but says he grew out of it and is glad he is a dude now. Brave of him to admit it but I'm sure there are lots of kids going through phases where it seems like the opposite sex has it better but they grow out of it. What are the chances these Gender affirming clinics can spot such cases? I've no confidence they would tbh.

 

[IndyCovaHart]

you had to dress like a woman for a year to see if you could put up with all the assholes giving you shit

you have just triggered my PTSD from fraternity pledging