Daniel Cormier Fires Back At Jones' 'Athlete' Remarks

[Richard Fannin]

DC is getting annoying trying to get into Jones head

Whats more astonishing is that Jones continues to answer him

From what I could gather from the thread title and the OP, it's the other way around.

 

[Augustus Caesar]

DC was just saying earlier today in the scrum that he has never felt better than now. I hope it isn't an injury.

 

[Bearknuckle]

I don't think most of Sherdog understands what a "great athlete" is supposed to mean. You are right, Jones looks incredibly awkward and uncoordinated with the basketball and when jumping. What may be the best way to describe a great athlete is someone who can excel at almost any sport naturally; they will never look awkward when trying to dunk a basketball, for instance. Take Bo Jackson, who many people consider the greatest pure athlete of our time. He excelled at football and then became a very good professional baseball player later in life, as well. A great athlete can become better at a given sport with much less practice than a less athletic player.

The standards that many people use to determine a great athlete are not by coincidence many of the same metrics used at the NFL combine. Think of speed, strength, and explosiveness (not in the way that Sherdog uses that term). Both speed and explosiveness are measured in the 40 yard dash. Vertical jump and broad jump test explosiveness. 3 cone drill and shuttle measure speed and ability to change direction on the feet. In addition to tangibles like these measures, there is the intangible element that I described earlier about being able to transition to any sport and excel and not look awkward.

Jones has never shown to be a great athlete. His vertical is obviously horrendous (shown by the dunk video), and he has shown to be awkward and not adept at any other sports. His brothers even make fun of his lack of athletic ability. That being said, there is no denying that he has become successful at winning fights under the current rules. There is obviously more to being a successful fighter than just pure athletic ability.

To be fair, I am not sure how good of a pure athlete Cormier is either, but he isn't the one that brought the issue up.

I think jone brought up the athletic LOOKING thing to poke fun at dc being short and pudgy.

If you just look at jones and DC side by side and saw their numbers. One guy is 6'4 and 227lbs and the other is 5'10 and 230lbs, who LOOKS more athletic is what jones was getting at

 

[Got GOAT]

St-Pierre is the best athlete I've seen in the UFC for his size. He has a potent combination of speed, strength, agility, flexibility, balance, cardio and explosiveness. He was never known for his power (in his hands) but he wasn't the type to swing for the fences either. His wrestling shot is the fastest/quickest I've seen to date and he covers a crazy amount of distance in a very short amount of time with it (as well as his lunging jab and Superman punch). I'm talking before he tore his ACL, since he's obviously declined in springiness/explosiveness since, unfortunately. This is really evident because he relies so much on his wrestling, takedowns specifically. GSP was named the Canadian Athlete of the Year three years in a row from 2008-2010.

There have also been many people that've been in awe of the guy, including past opponents. Josh Koscheck was a hell of a collegiate wrestler and very athletic himself, he's one of the most explosive athletes to ever fight in the UFC. He accused GSP of experimenting with steroids years back only to apologize and take back his statement. He made this interesting comment back in early 2012 about GSP...

Koscheck: Hopefully George is out for more than 10 months and they make that interim title holder fight twice.

Helwani: You're rooting against him?

Koscheck: Yeah absolutely. Hopefully he never comes back. Basically ACL surgeries take a lot out of you. I've had friends who've had the surgery and they say they're never the same. Hopefully it evens out the playing field and we can get another crack at Georges.

Helwani: There's still bad blood there?

Koscheck: No. Me and George have always been cool. He's a respectable guy outside of the cage when we're not fighting. He's a great person. I'm sure we would probably hang out. Well maybe not, he'd probably say no but I'd be willing to kick it with him.

[YT]P9J2ftWGZPU?start=225[/YT]

Talking about GSP's complete ACL tear and surgery, he actually says "equals out the playing field" but he's talking specifically about GSP's ability to use his high level of athleticism, and this is coming from a very good athlete himself in Koscheck. It's telling, and he'd know, GSP beat him twice handily and outwrestled him, and he's a very accomplished wrestler. KOS is a 4x Division-I All-American, a NCAA Division-I national wrestling champion (and Runner-Up another year), and has several other impressive awards that he won as a collegiate wrestler.

Here is Eddie Bravo practically losing it while talking about GSP's "incredible" wrestling in MMA while teaching at 10th Planet Jiu-Jitsu. He can't understand 'how' GSP is able to take everyone down at will, especially considering that GSP never wrestled in high school or collegiately. He wants to figure out "what the FUCK" GSP is doing that allows him to do this to some of the best wrestlers in MMA (and in American collegiate wrestling history), as he says in the video.

[YT]8cgrWPXLeOc[/YT]

The most impressive feats of athleticism that I've seen in MMA have also come from GSP, on several different occasions throughout his career.

GSP hitting an explosive scissor sweep from the botton...

GSP stuffing KOS' explosive shot as he tries to drive through him for the TD...

GSP's own double leg shot, covering a lot of distance with lightning quickness...

GSP sprawling hard on Trigg's double leg attempt and then reversing him for the takedown...

 

[skombolis]

[YT]8cgrWPXLeOc[/YT]

The most impressive feats of athleticism that I've seen in MMA have also come from GSP, on several different occasions throughout his career.

GSP hitting an explosive scissor sweep from the botton...

GSP stuffing KOS' explosive shot as he tries to drive through him for the TD...

GSP's own double leg shot, covering a lot of distance with lightning quickness...

GSP sprawling hard on Trigg's double leg attempt and then reversing him for the takedown...

Good stuff

People who were not around for his 15-20 fights don't really appreciate what it was like to see this guy just keep mastering different things and constantly tweaking and improving his game. By the time he got conservative I was so impressed with him that nothing was going to change that.

 

[Got GOAT]

Good stuff

People who were not around for his 15-20 fights don't really appreciate what it was like to see this guy just keep mastering different things and constantly tweaking and improving his game. By the time he got conservative I was so impressed with him that nothing was going to change that.

Same here. I've always appreciated his unequaled work ethic, his intelligence in the cage and his high level of athleticism he's put on display. What he does, the average person can't do. You'll never see the average person (or even above average) shooting a double as quick as he used to be able to do before he tore his ACL. He has inherent genetic gifts and worked extremely hard on top of these gifts to accomplish what he has.

These people on here can talk their A-level, B-level and C-level etc. classes of athletes, but I've seen a lot of high level athletes (supposed A and B) that wouldn't be able to do some of the things he's done in his athletic career. Just running fast in a straight line (ie., 100 meter, 40 meter etc) and jumping high aren't the only benchmarks for judging athleticism. Agility is even more important and neither of those test it. Though GSP does run sprints fast and definitely jumps high, but he's also very agile and conditioned with a ton of functional strength, excellent balance and a great degree of flexibility. He's one of the most well rounded athletes I've seen in any sport.

 

[GSPenn1991]

Jones lost that round, but all that matters is on the 3rd. On cormiers side for this one.

 

[skombolis]

Same here. I've always appreciated his unequaled work ethic, his intelligence in the cage and his high level of athleticism he's put on display. What he does, the average person can't do. You'll never see the average person (or even above average) shooting a double as quick as he used to be able to do before he tore his ACL. He has inherent genetic gifts and worked extremely hard on top of these gifts to accomplish what he has.

These people on here can talk their A-level, B-level and C-level etc. classes of athletes, but I've seen a lot of high level athletes (supposed A and B) that wouldn't be able to do some of the things he's done in his athletic career. Just running fast in a straight line (ie., 100 meter, 40 meter etc) and jumping high aren't the only benchmarks for judging athleticism. Agility is even more important and neither of those test it. Though GSP does run sprints fast and definitely jumps high, but he's also very agile and conditioned with a ton of functional strength, excellent balance and a great degree of flexibility. He's one of the most well rounded athletes I've seen in any sport.

I agree 100%. With the whole post but especially the highlighted portions. The guy was so naturally gifted but never rested on that. He worked his ass off and the combination resulted in him being who he was. It was really inspirational to be along for the ride even as just as a fan.

 

[Got GOAT]

I agree 100%. With the whole post but especially the highlighted portions. The guy was so naturally gifted but never rested on that. He worked his ass off and the combination resulted in him being who he was. It was really inspirational to be along for the ride even as just as a fan.

For sure. Especially when you compare him to other great fighters, notably BJ, and how he relied on his physical gifts and just coasted for years on it. He didn't have the work ethic and it cost him down the line. GSP had those natural gifts too and the mental fortitude and dedication to take it to a completely different level, and he did it consistently, year after year. That's why I'll always respect GSP because nobody worked harder than he did.

 

[skombolis]

Jones lost that round, but all that matters is on the 3rd. On cormiers side for this one.

Yeah I am starting to remember why I got tired of all the talk the first few times around. It can be entertaining at times but it has created interest with casuals so I guess that is a good thing. All I know is I can't wait for the part that actually matters. I haven't looked forward to a match-up the way I am looking forward to this one in a long time. There is no way these guys aren't leaving it all in the cage.

 

[skombolis]

For sure. Especially when you compare him to other great fighters, notably BJ, and how he relied on his physical gifts and just coasted for years on it. He didn't have the work ethic and it cost him down the line. GSP had those natural gifts too and the mental fortitude and dedication to take it to a completely different level, and he did it consistently, year after year. That's why I'll always respect GSP because nobody worked harder than he did.

Co-sign

 

[Rusk]

Where in that exchange did you see racial characteristics?

I am sincerely curious

It can't be not being able to dunk can it? Someone that can dunk is more black? I have to be assuming wrong here. But that is why I am asking.

 

[godsedd]

Anyone that thinks he physicaly can't dunk is stupid. Also he's one of the best athletes in MMA, he just isn't trained to dunk and will never be. He doesn't need to be able to dunk.

 

[chaoticmayhem]

How high a person can jump is a measure of how athletic someone is. Everyone knows that.

 

[Takamine86]

DC is a platform guy like GSP, all he does is work on explosive movements.

 

[Phoenix Down]

Jones is too white in a bad way.

In some weird and bizarre way I think you're actually 100% right.

 

[Wayweary]

Ive seen fat 220+ guys dunk before.

Yeah, it's about training the specific muscles and movements, not natural athleticism so much, although that does play a part.


But anyway, Jones is in the record saying many times he was not a natural athlete like his brothers. He had to work really hard to accomplish what he did in wrestling and now MMA. For those that like to denigrate his character and now his athleticism, you sort of can't have it both ways.

 

[Doomer]

Daniel Cormier or Jon Jones are far from being with elite motor or athletic abilities and so is Cain or JDS and many others.

I am disgusted when I read Jon Jones is great athlete (considering abilites) etc... he is far from it if I go by raw athletic abilties.

Vitor Belfort has great raw athleticism.

Mirko also had his days with his strenght, agility and speed. Vitor and Mirko had much better athletic abitlies than the likes of Jon Jones, Cormier, Gustafsson etc...

 

[mikekoz68]

I'd be very interested in seeing DC dunk a basketball. He's a big dude, not saying I don't believe he could get that weight off the ground but, no that is what I'm saying.

I don't think DC can dunk either, he only said he can touch the rim which is still pretty amazing for such a big guy at his height. (or does that mean he can dunk?? lol)

Jones is 6'4" and supposedly so athletic, he should dunk easily but he's got chicken legs.

Hate Jones, cheering for Cormier but in a Decathlon I would see Jones winning and that is the premier best athlete in the world indicator (supposedly)

 

[uppercutbus]

DC can dunk jones on his head with his chicken legs hanging in the air.