Cheap submissions

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by ozyabbas, May 25, 2008.

  1. ozyabbas

    ozyabbas Purple Belt

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    I just wanted to put it to this board to discuss what people would call a cheap submission/set up or whether there is no such thing as a cheap submission.
     
  2. Big Eck

    Big Eck On the mat

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    I've never really thought of any submission as cheap. It's not like striking, where there are "lucky punches". I guess the grappling equivalent would be nailing a submission off of a scramble, but even then there's nothing "cheap" about it. So I'd say that there are none.
     
  3. Darksky

    Darksky Blue Belt

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    I consider cheaps subs ones that I may tap to so my neck doesnt hurt all week not because I was technically submitted or stuff that will make it so I cant train the next day but not a true sub.
     
  4. Teedoh74

    Teedoh74 Black Belt

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    I always thought of the face crank as a cheap sub, especially when they can't finish the rnc.
     
  5. bds08

    bds08 White Belt

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    That hurts like hell. But i will not tap to that crap. And payback is a bitch. lol
     
  6. makoa26

    makoa26 Orange Belt

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    If it causes enough pain to cause a tap, then it's worth the same as any other sub.
    War Mark Kerr's Massive chin!!!!
     
  7. Teedoh74

    Teedoh74 Black Belt

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    I was not tapping either until my jaw started locking when I yawn.
     
  8. ozyabbas

    ozyabbas Purple Belt

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    I think there are definantly times where I either feel good or bad about a submission I pulled off. Submissions where more technical skill was needed to pull them off feels good were as I don't feel so good about opportunistic submissions.

    Techniques that you wouldn't necessarily tap to in a competition or a fight I would class as cheap. Such as some untechniqual neck cranks.

    I also wouldn't feel proud about a roll where I only managed to get out of some submission or position because of physical advantages.
     
  9. devante

    devante Silver Belt

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    no such thing as lucky punch, maybe a lil sloppy; but no luck, throwing a punch w/bad intentions is not luck.
     
  10. kumite

    kumite Orange Belt

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    yea, that's how i feel about that as well. I had guy dig in on a cross face when I told him i just had a tooth pulled on that side. Payback wasn't pleasant.
     
  11. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    There isn't such thing as a cheap submission IMO (if its legal that is).
     
  12. dvermillion15

    dvermillion15 Purple Belt

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    maybe in pride when they move them from the ropes and when the ref tells them to go the guy in gaurd slaps an arm bar real fast. but even then its not really cheap.
     
  13. FLMikeATT

    FLMikeATT Purple Belt

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    jaw/face locks are dirty jiu jitsu.
     
  14. nightshroud

    nightshroud Orange Belt

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    really no such thing but it is "cheap" when ur opponent ball smashes u when ur not wearing a cup or excessive crossfaces
     
  15. georgejjr

    georgejjr Black Belt

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    I agree. Also, no such thing as a cheap submission - if its good enough to make the guy tap, then its legit.
     
  16. Slithers

    Slithers Green Belt

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    knee on face aka skullride is cheap if you are in the gym but okay in competition
     
  17. Art_Wanderlei

    Art_Wanderlei Brown Belt

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    "If he taps, its Jiu Jitsu" - Rodrigo Gracie



    "Here, in the street, in competition, a man confronts you he is the enemy. An enemy deserves no mercy." - Sensei John Kreese
     
  18. beeble

    beeble Green Belt

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    there are a couple that arent really cheap. but almost frowned upon by your fellow grappling partners.. for me its when someone gets a lockdown and tries to sub you with an achilles lock, or neck cranks of any kind imho.... everything else is fair game, just as long as you respect your partner
     
  19. FlameBoy

    FlameBoy Green Belt

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    mmmmm, not sure I feel that thats the case?

    Say your a white belt and youve competing in your first comp. Youve trained for 11 months and youre in you first fight, some guy skullrides you to escape the triangle. You come off the mat after hes won and think - "why the fuck has that never happened in training?

    you go to your mates and say "some guy just crushed my head against the floor with his knee, what a scumbag"

    your buddies go - "hey thats competetion shit"

    you say " why the Fuck do we not train for this stuff???????????"

    Personally I think that all the dirty stuff should be done in class. All at a level that is comfortable for the individual grapplers. Not all the time, but when you with a good friend that wont take the piss and wont graunch subs of, cheap or dirty moves should be used, all the time. He wont take the piss, because he knows you'll get him back, you wont take the piss for the same reason!!
     
  20. Estemachine

    Estemachine Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    My jaw makes a crack noise every time I open my mouth wide enough.
     

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