Can anyone point to the fights I should watch which show Cereal Gone has the skillset to beat Aspinall definitively?

[Slapjit]

Ok so you dont know what FRAT means

Waheguru ji the answer is "Fuck Reading All That" buddy

 

[don't ask]

Good call,
Bas Rutten is one of the anomalies in this sport. Bas was/is very smart and very physically adept.

(Granted, no one at the time was truly high level. There wasn't much of an opportunity to be. )

Wait a minute -- does GSP count? When did he start training grappling? Maybe he started younger than I thought, I thought it was in his late teens.

lol sorry to bug you with this, for some reason my brain can't accept that no one has done it. It thinks that if BJ Penn could become a world class grappler in 3 years, there should be a striker who managed to do it, too, but I think you're right.

 

[Nathan LaMontagne]

Wait a minute -- does GSP count? When did he start training grappling? Maybe he started younger than I thought, I thought it was in his late teens.

lol sorry to bug you with this, for some reason my brain can't accept that no one has done it. It thinks that if BJ Penn could become a world class grappler in 3 years, there should be a striker who managed to do it, too, but I think you're right.

You are not bugging me at all, this is the reason I'm still on this site after too long.

I had a back and forth over a year trying to figure out the exact order of UFC 1s fight card.

I think GSP started as a Jiu Jitsu guy before MMA (and the obvious Kyokushin)
It was his insane transition to borderline Olympic level wrestler.
But he did always have a grappling base.

Going back I do think Bas counts. He ended up with more submission wins than KO wins

There are a ton of grappers that became good strikers. Werdum, Penn, Oliviera.
Then you have all the wrestlers that fall in love with their striking (koscheck, hendricks)

Not a whole lot of pure strikers with actively bad ground games develop into
Maybe Pettis? But he was always good off his back from memory

There has to be a bunch of examples that I'm forgetting.

 

[don't ask]

You are not bugging me at all, this is the reason I'm still on this site after too long.

I had a back and forth over a year trying to figure out the exact order of UFC 1s fight card.

I think GSP started as a Jiu Jitsu guy before MMA (and the obvious Kyokushin)
It was his insane transition to borderline Olympic level wrestler.
But he did always have a grappling base.

Going back I do think Bas counts. He ended up with more submission wins than KO wins

There are a ton of grappers that became good strikers. Werdum, Penn, Oliviera.
Then you have all the wrestlers that fall in love with their striking (koscheck, hendricks)

Not a whole lot of pure strikers with actively bad ground games develop into
Maybe Pettis? But he was always good off his back from memory

There has to be a bunch of examples that I'm forgetting.

I never knew that about GSP. I always thought Kyokushin was his base, but I don't know much about his early training history.

I never thought about this before, but I think you're right no real examples of a striker becoming a high-level grappler.

Wait... Overeem started as a striker and then won an ADCC qualifier!

 

[Epsteins Guard]

makes nganou look bad gane whooped nganous butt

but yeah every nganou fight where he looked like trash we have excuses

How did Gane whoop Ngannous butt? He lost the fight lol

 

[Epsteins Guard]

I mean Ngannou could wrestlefuck Gane, I'm fairly sure Aspinall can do that easier, it's just a question of if he gets caught before it hits the deck.

Obviously they're HWs so anything can happen, but is Gane really that type of striker? He seems to more wear people down rather than catch them with a big shot. It seems like his chance of winning with one big one is pretty low.

 

[TankAbbott4Eva]

Obviously they're HWs so anything can happen, but is Gane really that type of striker? He seems to more wear people down rather than catch them with a big shot. It seems like his chance of winning with one big one is pretty low.

Yeah fair point, I mean he beat the shit out of Tuivasa but I think it was a TKO in the end (he also got dropped in that one)

 

[arcadeperfect]

It depends on how much Gane has improved as a defensive grappler. If he's able to defend himself against Tom's grappling attempts and can recover to his feet consistently then it becomes a very difficult fight for any HW not just Tom.

 

[Safton]

I agree its the one thing you can point to as a hopeful weakness I'm just saying we have no idea if it is or not. Its speculation

Yeah but the initial post you responded to simply said Gane's chances will get better as the fight goes on. I don't think that's a particularly bold claim given that we know how dangerous Aspinall is early and we've seen him adrenaline-dump at least once, without ever really going deep into fights with success across his career.

Now if the poster had said "Aspinall will definitely gas out and get beaten up if the fight lasts longer than 7 minutes" then yeah I'd agree that's too much speculation. But simply saying Gane has better chances of winning if he can drag the fight out to the championship rounds versus taking part in intense exchanges early isn't crazy IMO.

 

[Nathan LaMontagne]

I never knew that about GSP. I always thought Kyokushin was his base, but I don't know much about his early training history.

I never thought about this before, but I think you're right no real examples of a striker becoming a high-level grappler.

Wait... Overeem started as a striker and then won an ADCC qualifier!

GSP won his second fight by armbar, then RNCd Pete Spratt in his 5th. He definitely started cross trained.

Ya know, Overeem may very well be a legit answer, he had a legit ground game (Look at his Brett Rogers fight. Just dominated him everywhere.) Great control one of the best guillotines in the business.

 

[Takes Two To Tango]

Gane is a mystery right now for me. We'll see how much he's improved his overall game.

 

[Oz.Pride]

watch the Jones fight and you got the answer that there is no way for Gane to beat Tom

Ah the most effective and damaging wrestler in UFC history is the same as the English dude with a paper mache bjj black belt his dad glued together in his shed. Gotchya

 

[mkess101]

Ah the most effective and damaging wrestler in UFC history is the same as the English dude with a paper mache bjj black belt his dad glued together in his shed. Gotchya

Good point. Instead watch Gane's last fight and the grappling exchanges with Volkov. Then watch Aspinall's phony black belt struggle mightily with Volkov on the mat.

 

[Oz.Pride]

Good point. Instead watch Gane's last fight and the grappling exchanges with Volkov. Then watch Aspinall's phony black belt struggle mightily with Volkov on the mat.

Way to introduce an entirely unrelated point there champ

 

[mkess101]

Way to introduce an entirely unrelated point there champ

Well sport, the thread asks the question of "which fight to watch". You commented on the guy who said to watch the Jones fight and used sarcasm to state why you think that fight is irrelevant. I then also used sarcasm but said instead of watching that fight, he can watch Gane/Volkov 2 and then Aspinall/Volkov to get a bead on how the "paper mache black belt" might in fact use his grappling in this matchup.

I get this might be a lot to process, but it all aligns with the question asked in the OP. If I can help with anything else little fella, let me know.

 

[Blastbeat]

really the only criticisms of Tom that hold weight are that he's never been dropped, stunned or wobbled so we dont know how good his chin is. and that his fights dont last too long so we dont know how good his gas tank is.

other criticisms just come off like people dont like Tom as a person, not really anything to do with him as a fighter. which, if we are talking about fighting, is TMZ tier bullshit.

 

[r-harper-1]

Hopefully Aspinall smokes him in a minute …..Aspinall the only hope for excitement at Heavyweight……well besides Black Beast

 

[r-harper-1]

really the only criticisms of Tom that hold weight are that he's never been dropped, stunned or wobbled so we dont know how good his chin is. and that his fights dont last too long so we dont know how good his gas tank is.

other criticisms just come off like people dont like Tom as a person, not really anything to do with him as a fighter. which, if we are talking about fighting, is TMZ tier bullshit.

Pavlovich didn’t stun him ?

 

[mkess101]

really the only criticisms of Tom that hold weight are that he's never been dropped, stunned or wobbled so we dont know how good his chin is. and that his fights dont last too long so we dont know how good his gas tank is.

other criticisms just come off like people dont like Tom as a person, not really anything to do with him as a fighter. which, if we are talking about fighting, is TMZ tier bullshit.

Nah. He got subbed in his 4th fight 10 years ago so clearly he's terrible.

 

[Blastbeat]

Pavlovich didn’t stun him ?

No, he landed good but Tom shook it off pretty quick.
That was an awesome fight for as long as it lasted. Pav easily could've put Tom out but Tom moved his head juuuuuust enough to lessen the blow.