BJ Penn's biggest issue wasn't his work ethic

[FilipEmoFights]

No, it was his work ethic, yes men, and inability to dial back his ambitions despite lacking the right preparation. One of the most naturally talented fighters of all time, he needed to stay with Marinovich, stop having his brothers or Parillo run his camps and to stay at 155. It was just one mistake after another. At his apex, he was one of my favorite fighters to watch but he squandered all that talent thinking it was enough.

He never lacked the courage of his convictions but there's a fine line between bravery and stupidity, and without the right preparation and people in his corner, it's obvious which side of that line he was on.

“The inability to dial back his ambitions”

Now that is some introspective analysis that lacks any ego or partisan agenda. It’s also some hard truth that I don’t think most normal people have the ability to wrap their head around because it’s the acknowledgement that there are things that exist that are unattainable for you simply because you just can’t do it.

However watching the way BJ fights in the old days up to around 2013-14 is a real pleasure to have watched. If you go back and watch his fights, the mastery is evident and appreciable. At his best he is truly as skilled as the GOAT and Anderson Silva called him the best for a reason. Still though, the question is how bad did BJ suck when he sucked, and why exactly is the gap between his best and his worst such a stark comparison?
I don’t think we’ve seen WorldBeater Champions who still shares the record for Title Defenses at LightWeight also have a 10 year long losing streak where he only got any offense out in maybe two fights…

I don’t think it’s 100% work ethic, I think mainly it’s weightclass and damage from the fights against larger men

 

[TankAbbott4Eva]

BJ Penn has a record of 16 wins and 14 losses. The boxing community laughs that this is a guy considered to be MMA's lightweight division goat. Compare Penn to the GOATs of boxing in the same division.

You can't compare MMA and boxing records, 20-0 can be fairly common in boxing, 20-0 in MMA you're basically the GOAT.

Couture had a shit record too but like Penn look at who he fought, mainly main events and thus the elite.

 

[Odoylerules4lyf]

His draw against Uno was a pretty bad decision BJ clearly won that fight and should have been the lightweight champion... That draw allay caused the ufc to basically abandon the weight class for some time. If that fight had have gotten the right decision we would probably be listing BJ as one of the GOATs in every talk.

He smashed Gomi before he went on his run, a win that aged very well. He moved up and smashed Matt Hughes for the belt and people bitch about Hughes being one dimensional but in his prime he would grapplefuck most guys today.

He fought Fitch to a draw when Fitch was firmly established as the number 2 guy in the division, was MASSIVELY bigger and he even took him down multiple times.

I think people who didn't watch mma back then and see Penn's shitty record don't understand the context of his performances at the time and the unprecedented things he was doing in the sport.

Also he jumped out of a pool

 

[WillyWill]

here's what always bothered me about BJ, he was so against steroids but at the same he's been - by many accounts over the years - an on again/off again/functioning drug addict. And not just smoking weed, IIRC coke was his "drug of choice." Man i love Penn but how do you allow THAT hypocrisy to live inside you?

 

[Royce's Gi]

It's that he mistakenly thought he could be at his very best without taking steroids like everyone else.

That's why I never view his career as a disappointment the way so many do. What he was able to accomplish as a clean fighter was astonishing. His natural gifts were second to none.

But if he had decided to take the Jon Jones, Anderson Silva route, etc., then there's no doubt in my mind that we would be talking about him as a top 3 atg.

But even still, 2 division champ is nothing to sneeze at when you did it with an estrogen filled dad bod.
View attachment 1025911

Imagine BJ Penn with Sean Sherks bod

 

[Royce's Gi]

here's what always bothered me about BJ, he was so against steroids but at the same he's been - by many accounts over the years - an on again/off again/functioning drug addict. And not just smoking weed, IIRC coke was his "drug of choice." Man i love Penn but how do you allow THAT hypocrisy to live inside you?

To him, there was a big difference between those drugs

One is a recreational drug and the other is a drug giving you an edge in sports and competition.

Or maybe he was too worried about his Gonads.

 

[JamM]

His draw against Uno was a pretty bad decision BJ clearly won that fight and should have been the lightweight champion... That draw allay caused the ufc to basically abandon the weight class for some time. If that fight had have gotten the right decision we would probably be listing BJ as one of the GOATs in every talk.

He smashed Gomi before he went on his run, a win that aged very well. He moved up and smashed Matt Hughes for the belt and people bitch about Hughes being one dimensional but in his prime he would grapplefuck most guys today.

He fought Fitch to a draw when Fitch was firmly established as the number 2 guy in the division, was MASSIVELY bigger and he even took him down multiple times.

I think people who didn't watch mma back then and see Penn's shitty record don't understand the context of his performances at the time and the unprecedented things he was doing in the sport.

Also he jumped out of a pool

A draw is not as common as someone win. But in that fight, a draw is a strange phenomenon. An unexpected decision.

 

[pankrat]

Imagine BJ Penn with Sean Sherks bod

Excuse me but Yushin Okami was never a big MW.

Fought the bigger Rich Franklin as a lanky 6'2" who barely cut weight for 185:

Weighted-in at soft 200lbs with clothes on for a week-notice bout vs OSP at LHW

A below average sized MW by today standards.
A tiny MW by Pereira's standards.

Here vs Dhiego Lima at 170 in his late 30s
Barely above average sized WW in modern day

 

[machidafan99]

If he took the hot sauce it would have ruined his legendary status.

 

[OmegaRugal]

Penn with EPO cardio would have been a nightmare

 

[aali14]

His biggest issue imo is he lacks heart, people often mistake showing heart and showing balls.

On the one hand BJ was fearless when it comes to accepting fights, he'll fight anyone anywhere, but when the going gets tough in there, he folds and he quits.

 

[colorles]

99.9 percent of high level athletes are PED users. whether or not Penn is in that 0.1 percent, I can't say

BJ Peen seemed like a typical Hawaiin lad that loved to eat, party, drink and do drugs. from a wealthy family no less. if I had a nickel for every athlete i've known that fucked up promising athletic careers over those four things, i'd have a lot of nickels. even then he was still talented enough to to be a BJJ prodigy and two division UFC champ who would fight anyone. and hopefully an up and coming politician

 

[orca]

ts thats ok
ive seen full grown men who really believed
fedor was the only clean fighter on pride
everybody else was using
but not him

then goes on a losing streak in a drug tested org

 

[orca]

His biggest issue imo is he lacks heart, people often mistake showing heart and showing balls.

On the one hand BJ was fearless when it comes to accepting fights, he'll fight anyone anywhere, but when the going gets tough in there, he folds and he quits.

this hes not the only one that has balls
ive seen fighters that if given an opportunity will also fight at a higher weight classes

hendo and many more arent really being praised for fighting bigger fighters
but bj who has like 10percent winning rate at a higher weight class is being praised

dude quits everytime the fight isnt favoring him

 

[jx820]

It's not wrong to assume professional athletes should probably be doping, and doubly so back then. That's not everything.

If you rewatch Penn vs Edgar 1 or 2 and watch the corners between rounds. Edgar's corner is telling him what he needs to look out for and adjust. Penn's corner is calling him champ and telling him how great he looks.

 

[doggo]

According to his mom or someone from his entourage he's been a vice loving coke head for years and kept in camp to stay healthy. That can' be good.

 

[ColombianFist]

It was his work ethic. Nothing else

 

[olimpicus]

"estrogen filled"
"UFC 2 division champ"

dude, pick one

 

[The Clinch]

No, it was his work ethic, yes men, and inability to dial back his ambitions despite lacking the right preparation. One of the most naturally talented fighters of all time, he needed to stay with Marinovich, stop having his brothers or Parillo run his camps and to stay at 155. It was just one mistake after another. At his apex, he was one of my favorite fighters to watch but he squandered all that talent thinking it was enough.

He never lacked the courage of his convictions but there's a fine line between bravery and stupidity, and without the right preparation and people in his corner, it's obvious which side of that line he was on.

 

[J Danger]

No, it was his work ethic, yes men, and inability to dial back his ambitions despite lacking the right preparation. One of the most naturally talented fighters of all time, he needed to stay with Marinovich, stop having his brothers or Parillo run his camps and to stay at 155. It was just one mistake after another. At his apex, he was one of my favorite fighters to watch but he squandered all that talent thinking it was enough.

He never lacked the courage of his convictions but there's a fine line between bravery and stupidity, and without the right preparation and people in his corner, it's obvious which side of that line he was on.

100% this