BJ Penn's biggest issue wasn't his work ethic

Penn is an old school guy that I think wouldn’t have to change his style a whole lot to be at the top right now. Add some leg kicks and he’s top 10, grapple a bit more and he’s top 5
 
I think BJ would have beet khabob in his prime. He didnt run to a lower weight class and stay there either he fought people bigger than him. Khabob never did that.
 
Skarsgard said:
He popped for IV use.
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He didn't "pop" for anything. He got engulfed in the monumental clusterfuck of USADA's early days. Anf I say that as a BJ low key hater.
 
corrupted said:
This example totally speaks to how seriously hew took his career. He was NEVER a HW. LOL. Why on earth he thought a good idea to get fat and fight at that weight when he was clearly the best around at lighter weights is beyond me. Taking on a guy a weight class or two above you is brave. Being 5'8 and wobbling in to fight at HW is not.

If he had taken his career a little more seriously, he'd have been the result of what being a prodigy actually is.
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well, at least he didn’t get knocked out by his much larger opponent, right? there’s always a baked-in reason to give him credit for a fight he didn’t win.

one of the main reasons i don’t rate penn as highly as his fans is because he often came up short in these “challenge” fights. sure, he did take tough fights (arguably recklessly), and he did occasionally live up to his billing as a “prodigy.” but he also had a lot of opportunities to prove himself. he was given quite a few title shots—7 in total. he won only 2 of them. at least 3 of them were not earned (i.e., he didn’t beat anyone in the division to justify the shot). so at some point “daring to be great” looks more like “being given yet another chance after failing previously.” it’s not fair to only credit his wins and discount his losses.
 
corrupted said:
Same reason most did I'd guess. To get hydrated after a dumbass weight cut maybe.. I don't put it past anyone. But I can't see BJ juicing.
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I can. I never bought into the image that he portrayed himself as a Hawaiian that just wants to scrap. No, he was looking into advantages by the time he had lost to Frankie back in 2014.
 
kingmob6 said:
is diego sanchez some goat? there is nothing impressive about that.
BJ Penn was talented, but he isn't some all time great. He shoudn't be in any conversations for top lists, he was a product of a shallow lightweight division, and had a mediocre career when put into perspective. He is the most overrated fighter in sherdog history.
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BJ was acknowledged as p4p best by other greats, such as GSP and Anderson Silva.

So the "overrated by sherdog" line doesnt work here. It only exposes your ignorance.
Get another hobby
 
Problem24/7 said:
BJ Penn has a record of 16 wins and 14 losses. The boxing community laughs that this is a guy considered to be MMA's lightweight division goat. Compare Penn to the GOATs of boxing in the same division.
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This dude fought Lyoto Machida, who is at least 40lbs heavier than him. BJ didn't really care about protecting his record.

I think that if BJ just stuck at 155, he'd have a great record until he became washed. Even at 155, he was not really cutting weight.
 
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capnlarge said:
This dude fought Lyoto Machida, who is at least 40lbs heavier than him. BJ didn't really care about protecting his record.

I think that if BJ just stuck at 155, he'd have a great record until he became washed. Even at 155, he was not really cutting weight.
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BJ was cutting 10-15lbs to make LW, which doesnt make what he did vs much bigger opponents any less impressibe.
 
BJ Penn got flagged by USADA for suspicious activities, such as OTP Blood IVs so Penn could take advantage of his weight against Cole Miller, and he was rightfully kicked out for 6 months for shooting up so much <mma4>
(and statting that IVs were for "wimps" and that situation was

Penn's rivals were notorious natty badasses, from Jens Pulver to GSP, with Frankie Edgar & Matt Hughes, Nick Diaz as other natties.
 
BJ went on his epic run after starting to train with team quest and getting kinda swole...
 
BJ easily would've went down as one the best to ever do it if he was fully dedicated from day one and in the right camp.

Amazing what he did accomplish with sporadic dedication and long run in his career surrounded by yes men.

I don't think him taking roids without doing anything more would've done him any good. He did great in BJJ tournaments and we all know those are riddled with PED abusers.
 
Substance Abuse said:
No, it was his work ethic, yes men, and inability to dial back his ambitions despite lacking the right preparation. One of the most naturally talented fighters of all time, he needed to stay with Marinovich, stop having his brothers or Parillo run his camps and to stay at 155. It was just one mistake after another. At his apex, he was one of my favorite fighters to watch but he squandered all that talent thinking it was enough.

He never lacked the courage of his convictions but there's a fine line between bravery and stupidity, and without the right preparation and people in his corner, it's obvious which side of that line he was on.
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Positive balance, reincarnated
 
I think he was one of those guys who peaked early. Early BJ was very hungry. He moved from Hawaii to California and then to Brazil to learn BJJ. He did what he needed to do to be successful.

When he decided to leave Hawaii; it was a little too late. Natural skill only goes so far when you are doing a lot of drugs and not training hard.
 
Smato_rules said:
Did he train with team quest? I know he was with aka way back in the day, but never heard of him with quest
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Yeah, he trained with Randy/Lindland specifically for his return WW title fight against Hughes the first time. I think he did quite a bit of back and forth for his LW training camps too in addition to working with Dolce on his 'nutrition'.
 
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