BETA Academy owner explains ending relationship with Lloyd Irvin

[ElKarlo]

I am sure that that personLI's page is a fake. I am sure that Nak did some shady stuff, but at this point I am sure that LI is out to get Nak and is going to do whatever it takes to smear his name.

 

[Eric O]

Thank you, and well written.

I think how people like Nak and others fell for this, was that LI was their coach and mentor. Esp if it was done slowly, and perhaps with them not losing a great deal of money at first, and when they finally realize it, they have been Ben Franklin Syndromed into not being able to get out.

The slowely part is what gets you. I trained at my first BJJ Gym for 4+ years before leaving.

The instructor was one of the most legit and reputable people in BJJ.

When you started everything was cool. But after a while he'd try to get people to sign up for "Instructor lessons." This way you could teach his system. So you'd pay $160 a month (with a 1 yr contract) than additionall $$$ for the instructor class (it varied what he charged based up what he thought he could get out of you). Then he'd expect you to teach classes for free while still paying to train there.

Then we started getting charged $100 for belt promotions which were only once a year.

Then you needed 4 stripes to get a promotion and you could only get 1 stripe per year by paying $100 (although blue belt after 1+ full years)

Then they would do collections to buy new gym equipment and everyone would be expected to kick in $30-$50 which would add up to a few grand really quick but only $500 worth of equipment would show up.

At that point I left. His gym is still open. Most of the good people have left and they have a big kids program which keeps them going but overall it was a rip off.

 

[robotsonic]

posted this in the other thread but ima post it here to:



If that is this case, why is his school sucsessful?

From the site you publish your articles on:

"Again, Beta is one of the largest TLI affiliates so this is a big move"


So Beta Academy is one of the largest Martial Arts schools in the DC area... + they charge the extortionate Lloyld irvin fees... but he aint making money??? C'mon Son!!!


Have you seen how many classes they run a day?:

https://clients.mindbodyonline.com/ASP/home.asp?studioid=33559


Former Beta Academy worker speaks up on Lloyd Irvin's page:

Alexander 'Omega Red' Khojainov: "As someone who worked at BETA for 2 years and did all the hiring, firing, sales staff and front desk management, phone script and sales system enforcement, chasing homeless people out of the school and scrubbing the mats when the underpaid cleaners didn't show up

 

[OldGuyBjjATL]

Are you really busting my chops for referring to the verdict as an acquittal? That is a 100% accurate term, sir. I have not claimed he was innocent nor have I claimed that he did nothing wrong. He did do something wrong, and for whatever reason he was not convicted.

Quite frankly, I think this gives him a moral obligation to do something to help women avoid this heinous crime, rather than simply doing nothing.

Not interested in busting chops. And it wasn't my intent to come across that way. More than enough i'net tough guys that I'm sure you'd enjoy sparring with far more than I.

I would almost agree with you on a few levels; but the problem is that he displays chronically predatory behavior. His "marketing" is pure scam, who's success is reliant upon taking advantage of people who are either easily manipulated (not a reflection of intelligence whatsoever) or people who do not know any better. He also has created an environment where the people around him display predatory tendencies.

And when asked rational, fair questions about his background, and business practices, he has a pathological response that makes him redirect, deny and make counter accusations. All marks of someone who's devoid of the notion of consequences and something to hide.

 

[Vinyasa]

You know what and that's fine, let the letters some. There are always two sides to every story keep that in mind. Everyone here is like Lloyd pointed a gun at Nak's head and said do this or die? Really cmon please people. He has legal time and lawyers and they were ones who told him not to make a statement / recant it and he even said that in his letter when, but by then it was way to late for all of you, it would have been to late even if he responded right away all the same for many of the folks here.

At this point it's painfully obvious that Devnull is Lloyd Irvin. Way too much in depth knowledge regarding all these situations and now even types "cmon" in this post just around the time (if not before) the c'mon video comes out.

 

[Junior Skilo]

I am sure that that personLI's page is a fake. I am sure that Nak did some shady stuff, but at this point I am sure that LI is out to get Nak and is going to do whatever it takes to smear his name.

How can you be so sure of that? What evidence are you basing your view on? Apart for your current perspective of Lloyd...

check out Alexander Khojainov's linkedin page:

http://www.linkedin.com/pub/alexander-khojainov/18/6a3/955

Alexander Khojainov's Overview

Current

Owner at 'Striking Gold' - Striking Championships

GM at BETA Academy Martial Arts

Education

American University - Kogod School of Business

The George Washington University - School of Business
Connections

79 connections

Alexander Khojainov's Experience

Owner
'Striking Gold' - Striking Championships
April 2012

 

[Steelviper]

Cmon son!!! Cmon sherdog haters!! lol = ).. On the real though questions answered, nay sayers???

Obviously this looks pretty duplicitous on Nak's part, though I do want to point out that all the numbers he keeps throwing around are gross, not net.

The Burger King in Kirksville, MO (smallish college town) grosses over a million dollars a year, easy. But how much does it net to the owner? Some percentage of that obviously. And depending on how close you're running your margins (if you're running sales trying to attract customers, or pouring money into investments, etc.) you can easily end up running in the red even when you gross over a million dollars.

In all, using the video testimonies made while he was tight with TLI just seems more aimed to discredit Nak rather than attempt to vindicate TLI.

 

[KGB256]

Not interested in busting chops. And it wasn't my intent to come across that way. More than enough i'net tough guys that I'm sure you'd enjoy sparring with far more than I.

I would almost agree with you on a few levels; but the problem is that he displays chronically predatory behavior. His "marketing" is pure scam, who's success is reliant upon taking advantage of people who are either easily manipulated (not a reflection of intelligence whatsoever) or people who do not know any better. He also has created an environment where the people around him display predatory tendencies.

And when asked rational, fair questions about his background, and business practices, he has a pathological response that makes him redirect, deny and make counter accusations. All marks of someone who's devoid of the notion of consequences and something to hide.

I'm sorry, I thought we were talking about whether hosting free rape prevention seminars made him a terrible person, not whether he should be nominated for man of the year.

Just because I don't have a problem with him giving the seminars doesn't mean I think he's a swell guy. There's lots of reasons to call the guy a scumbag, hosting free seminars to try to help women just isn't one of them.

 

[OldGuyBjjATL]

So the big "cash grab" was to bilk women for shipping charges?

And as annoying as his emails are, that's what spam filters are for. Nobody is under any obligation to buy anything.

The point that you're missing is that by simply associating in this "free" commodity, you pay a shipping fee, and then you're added to a boiler room type of email list; which is in turn handed over to all of the people that have a "system" and have paid into his marketing system.

Now, you may not think that the $6.95 is a lot, but when you do the numbers, and see how many are sent out; and understand the profit margin in making and sending out the DVD, you see the scam. Insult to injury is that you're now going to get every piece of spam he's sold your info to.

It in fact proves the points that people make about his "marketing" tactics.

 

[ElKarlo]

The slowely part is what gets you. I trained at my first BJJ Gym for 4+ years before leaving.

The instructor was one of the most legit and reputable people in BJJ.

When you started everything was cool. But after a while he'd try to get people to sign up for "Instructor lessons." This way you could teach his system. So you'd pay $160 a month (with a 1 yr contract) than additionall $$$ for the instructor class (it varied what he charged based up what he thought he could get out of you). Then he'd expect you to teach classes for free while still paying to train there.

Then we started getting charged $100 for belt promotions which were only once a year.

Then you needed 4 stripes to get a promotion and you could only get 1 stripe per year by paying $100 (although blue belt after 1+ full years)

Then they would do collections to buy new gym equipment and everyone would be expected to kick in $30-$50 which would add up to a few grand really quick but only $500 worth of equipment would show up.

At that point I left. His gym is still open. Most of the good people have left and they have a big kids program which keeps them going but overall it was a rip off.

Wow that sucks. But not knowing any better he had you till you figured him out

 

[ElKarlo]

At this point it's painfully obvious that Devnull is Lloyd Irvin. Way too much in depth knowledge regarding all these situations and now even types "cmon" in this post just around the time (if not before) the c'mon video comes out.

Could be someone youngish and in the inner court too

 

[OldGuyBjjATL]

The slowely part is what gets you. I trained at my first BJJ Gym for 4+ years before leaving.

The instructor was one of the most legit and reputable people in BJJ.

When you started everything was cool. But after a while he'd try to get people to sign up for "Instructor lessons." This way you could teach his system. So you'd pay $160 a month (with a 1 yr contract) than additionall $$$ for the instructor class (it varied what he charged based up what he thought he could get out of you). Then he'd expect you to teach classes for free while still paying to train there.

Then we started getting charged $100 for belt promotions which were only once a year.

Then you needed 4 stripes to get a promotion and you could only get 1 stripe per year by paying $100 (although blue belt after 1+ full years)

Then they would do collections to buy new gym equipment and everyone would be expected to kick in $30-$50 which would add up to a few grand really quick but only $500 worth of equipment would show up.

At that point I left. His gym is still open. Most of the good people have left and they have a big kids program which keeps them going but overall it was a rip off.

*100 on what you guys said.
I learned the hard way myself. I spent 12 years directly training with master level Brazilian. He lived with me for a couple years, I brought him back and forth to the States, etc. From 95, through 2007. He treated everyone terribly, and because I was his go to guy, I was so rapped up in the fact that while he was "good" to me, he was totally taking advantage of me. A man like him should have hundreds training with him; yet if you went to one of his classes, you'd see plenty of room to roll. One of the best things to have happened to me was a total separation of my left biceps tendon in 2007. Long story not worth telling; but it allowed me to get the reality check I needed.

I empathize with the folks that got roped it. It becomes a bad thing when you know it, and do nothing about it.

 

[Junior Skilo]

So this dude acts like Nakapan is an asshole for 'fucking people out of their money' then fully admits that Nakapan's 'methods' were completely based on Lloyd's...LOL

LOL, give me a break you stupid ass shill. I don't really care about this Nakapan dude, no doubt he's probably into some scummy marketing shit too, but as far as we know he never gang raped anyone.

When you're a piece of shit, your feigned outrage at other pieces of shit doesn't really hold any water.

Actually if look closely at what say's he clearly does not agree with all of Lloyds practices

By no means was it all bad, and I got a lot of experience in operating the back end of a business, and I got a lot of perks and 'if-come' potential as long as I kept my head down and my mouth shut. Can't say much cause of the NDA I signed with Nakapan, but I fucked a lot of people out of their money to get Nak that BMW.

 

[ElKarlo]

So this dude acts like Nakapan is an asshole for 'fucking people out of their money' then fully admits that Nakapan's 'methods' were completely based on Lloyd's...LOL

The problem seems to be that however much shit Lloyd's lackeys throw at other people they are never going to have the moral high ground to have it mean anything. This is a school run by a scumbag marketer who gang raped some chick and bred an environment of sociopaths that ended up repeating his behavior 20 odd years later and he's acting outraged at the 'amoral' behavior of others.

LOL, give me a break you stupid ass shill. I don't really care about this Nakapan dude, no doubt he's probably into some scummy marketing shit too, but as far as we know he never gang raped anyone.

When you're a piece of shit, your feigned outrage at other pieces of shit doesn't really hold any water.

Well said. Lloyd Irvin's people are a bunch of liars, hypocrites, and are pointlessly elitists

 

[OldGuyBjjATL]

I'm sorry, I thought we were talking about whether hosting free rape prevention seminars made him a terrible person, not whether he should be nominated for man of the year.

Just because I don't have a problem with him giving the seminars doesn't mean I think he's a swell guy. There's lots of reasons to call the guy a scumbag, hosting free seminars to try to help women just isn't one of them.

Apparently I did not articulate my point well enough.
He still displays the behaviors that led him to think it okay to rape someone. And he still displays the type of behaviors that finds him in the personal company of others who obviously think that rape is okay.

I don't have a problem with him giving a free seminar either. But the context and timing of his seminar in this case show him trying to get in front of an issue. He did not do it to "help women".

 

[Vinyasa]

The irony of LI accusing someone of doing whatever it takes to get ahead in business is fucking unreal.

Even if Nak IS angling for more money from training fighters or WHATEVER, what the fuck does LI have to say about it? Nak is just a goddamned 3%er doing his fucking business, crushing red bulls, and fucking up the competition. LI needs to take that bitchassness and park it in his garage, next to all the rented cars.

QFT

Nak is just being a 3%. Gettin his money son. Lloyd (Devnull) stop with your 97% bitchassness!!!!

 

[GiBurns]

posted this in the other thread but ima post it here to:



If that is this case, why is his school sucsessful?

From the site you publish your articles on:

"Again, Beta is one of the largest TLI affiliates so this is a big move"


So Beta Academy is one of the largest Martial Arts schools in the DC area... + they charge the extortionate Lloyld irvin fees... but he aint making money??? C'mon Son!!!


Have you seen how many classes they run a day?:

https://clients.mindbodyonline.com/ASP/home.asp?studioid=33559


Former Beta Academy worker speaks up on Lloyd Irvin's page:

Alexander 'Omega Red' Khojainov: "As someone who worked at BETA for 2 years and did all the hiring, firing, sales staff and front desk management, phone script and sales system enforcement, chasing homeless people out of the school and scrubbing the mats when the underpaid cleaners didn't show up

 

[Eric O]

Wow that sucks. But not knowing any better he had you till you figured him out

It was a new gym and BJJ wasn't popular. We're talking 2001 so it was like train there or don't train BJJ at all. The next closest gym was an hour away.

You get stuck with so much invested that you can't walk away. When another gym opened up in my area I jumped ship and 10 others followed.

 

[KGB256]

The point that you're missing is that by simply associating in this "free" commodity, you pay a shipping fee, and then you're added to a boiler room type of email list; which is in turn handed over to all of the people that have a "system" and have paid into his marketing system.

Now, you may not think that the $6.95 is a lot, but when you do the numbers, and see how many are sent out; and understand the profit margin in making and sending out the DVD, you see the scam. Insult to injury is that you're now going to get every piece of spam he's sold your info to.

It in fact proves the points that people make about his "marketing" tactics.

The original claim that started this tangent was a claim that he was promoting his rape prevention seminars as a "cash grab", sir. Except that they're free and TLI has done them for years. Which led to people to ridiclously claim that it's a "cash grab" because seminar attendees might decide to sign up for regular classes.

That subsequently led to the claim that the redirect of the lloydirvinrape.com URL was also a "cash grab". Except that it redirected to a site for a free DVD. Now you guys want to cry about a shipping charge and spam emails? Now that's the "cash grab"?

If you're doing a cash grab, you don't do it with free seminars, spam emails, and DVDs where you pay nothing but a small fee for shipping. In fact, if you were trying to exploit women's self-defense as a way to make money, it would probably look a little more like this.

 

[Eric O]

*100 on what you guys said.
I learned the hard way myself. I spent 12 years directly training with master level Brazilian. He lived with me for a couple years, I brought him back and forth to the States, etc. From 95, through 2007. He treated everyone terribly, and because I was his go to guy, I was so rapped up in the fact that while he was "good" to me, he was totally taking advantage of me. A man like him should have hundreds training with him; yet if you went to one of his classes, you'd see plenty of room to roll. One of the best things to have happened to me was a total separation of my left biceps tendon in 2007. Long story not worth telling; but it allowed me to get the reality check I needed.

I empathize with the folks that got roped it. It becomes a bad thing when you know it, and do nothing about it.

I feel like were talking about the same guy. I know someone that my old instructor did that to as well as he's from Brazil.

He even got one of his students (a police officer who has money)to finance a gym for his son. The 2 of them were partners. The gym was in the red or barely broke even for several years but the cop looked at it as "I get to train with a BJJ black belt every day and I'm helping the old man out and his son."

So one day the two of us are at a tournament out of state and some guy comes up to us and tells us he's a blue belt from the gym the cop owns. Cop says "really, I've never met you or heard your name."

Guy says, "I've been taking private 3x a week every morning with XXXX for a year."
(These privates were $100 an hour)

Cop goes back and sets up hidden cameras in the gym and find out his partner (my instructors son) was teach 2-3 privates every morning (while he was at work) and pocketing the money.

When you look back you think how dumb was I but you were under the pretense that were helping someone out.