Elections 2020 Democratic Primary Thread v4

[Fawlty]

Bloomberg is the third party run that would spoil the Dems

Even if Tulsi did run third I think she would get enough across the aisle support to nullify her impact on the Dems

Agree the first has worse potential, but the second seems like you falling for a really obvious Republican rhetorical trick.

 

[PHATV]

'We've never seen spending like this': Bloomberg, Steyer saturate airwaves...

Bloomberg campaign vendor used prison labor to make calls...

'We only learned about this when reporter called us'...

 

[ultramanhyata]

He changed it? Ok, fair enough.

I never saw him present anything other than this. You may have fallen for some of the disinformation spread by his critics on the left. I was operating under false assumptions about Yang for a few months.

But his latest position on healthcare reform is straight garbage.

 

[kpt018]

I never saw him present anything other than this. You may have fallen for some of the disinformation spread by his critics on the left. I was operating under false assumptions about Yang for a few months.

But his latest position on healthcare reform is straight garbage.

Well no, his original position is that the freedom dividend would replace other safety net spending.

I don’t even care to track it honestly. He’s a crappy long shot candidate with a bad signature policy (even with the correction).

 

[PEB]

Internally Democratic party members are coming around to the idea that Sanders could very well win the nomination. At least what Politico is saying.

 

[method115]

Internally Democratic party members are coming around to the idea that Sanders could very well win the nomination. At least what Politico is saying.

Yea after he surged back up after the heart attack you pretty much have to take him seriously at this point. Not to mention the records he's setting with his donations\volunteers.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Yea after he surged back up after the heart attack you pretty much have to take him seriously at this point. Not to mention the records he's setting with his donations\volunteers.

He started the campaign as the frontrunner, fell behind a bit but was among the most likely winners, seemed dead after the heart attack, and is now back to where he was. Currently tied with Warren at +400 on Bovada (Biden is at +200).

 

[Anung Un Rama]

Edit old news already posted a few pages back

 

[xcvbn]

For the liberal elites and their stooges, this is why centrist, moderate, technocratic reform is NOT an option.

It is an absurdity to ask those born of the same economic ideology who have spent the past 50 years dismantling unions and attacking New Deal policies to solve working class struggles that have never been more similar since then.



@Fawlty @Jack V Savage @kpt018

However, I will concede that a coalition with that old guard will be needed in order to defeat the monstrous movement on the right. But this time there needs to be the concession from the establishment that the current system is incompatible with a successful future which prevents creatures like Trump from bubbling to the top.

 

[Jack V Savage]

For the liberal elites and their stooges, this is why centrist, moderate, technocratic reform is NOT an option.

It is an absurdity to ask those born of the same economic ideology who have spent the past 50 years dismantling unions and attacking New Deal policies to solve working class struggles that have never been more similar since then.

You're conflating different ideologies here, which pretty much invalidates the whole point. FDR saw himself as a defender of the capitalist system (as the guy acknowledges), and liberals who the idiot left screech about have been fighting for stronger unions.

Me: We should have a market-based economy with a safety net, with protections for workers, an SWF, environmental protections, and gov't policy to target full employment. And we should take effective actions to make improvement along those lines rather than pointless grandstanding that will only lead to moving in the opposite direction.
Idiot leftists: So basically you agree with Paul Ryan about everything. Got it.

However, I will concede that a coalition with that old guard will be needed in order to defeat the monstrous movement on the right. But this time there needs to be the concession from the establishment that the current system is incompatible with a successful future which prevents creatures like Trump from bubbling to the top.

In fact, what would have prevented Trump from taking the presidency and then reversing worker and environmental protections, passing regressive changes in the tax code, weakening the safety net, and filling the courts with young radicals who see their mission as stopping progressive policy would have been more fake leftists actually voting for Clinton. But, as usual, they got played by the right.

 

[xcvbn]

You're conflating different ideologies here, which pretty much invalidates the whole point. FDR saw himself as a defender of the capitalist system (as the guy acknowledges), and liberals who the idiot left screech about have been fighting for stronger unions.

Me: We should have a market-based economy with a safety net, with protections for workers, a safety net, an SWF, environmental protections, and gov't policy to target full employment. And we should take effective actions to make improvement along those lines rather than pointless grandstanding that will only lead to moving in the opposite direction.
Idiot leftists: So basically you agree with Paul Ryan about everything. Got it.



In fact, what would have prevented Trump from taking the presidency and then reversing worker and environmental protections, passing regressive changes in the tax code, weakening the safety net, and filling the courts with young radicals who see their mission as stopping progressive policy would have been more fake leftists actually voting for Clinton. But, as usual, they got played by the right.

Since FDR we have had roughly equal in time liberal leadership as conservative and worker rights and protections have either diminished or remained at a standstill in that time, irregardless of which party is in power, yet you sincerely believe this has all taken place under Republicans within the last 3 years. Have you looked at Obama’s conservative judge appointments? Clinton?

What planet do you live on?

We tried the reform method with FDR and suppressed the radicals who “screeched” that if we don’t attack the economic system we will be back to square one after the capitalist class attacks the reforms. Well, we’re back to square one.

Let me ask: who is responsible for pushing America towards Social Democracy in the 30s? Was this purely a bone the capitalist class was willing to throw at their own discretion without any outside influence?

 

[Jack V Savage]

Since FDR we have had roughly equal in time liberal leadership as conservative and worker rights and protections have either diminished or remained at a standstill in that time, irregardless of which party is in power, yet you sincerely believe this has all taken place under Republicans within the last 3 years. Have you looked at Obama’s conservative judge appointments? Clinton?

What planet do you live on?

How are you defining "leadership," and why is "time in leadership" your preferred metric here? Post-FDR, we continued to expand the safety net and other liberal programs, until seeing big rollbacks starting with Reagan. We've since been expanding them some more.

And I'm on Earth, where McConnell shut down a lot of judicial appointments (not just Garland), leaving the courts open to be remade by the right. And LOL at the idea that Obama's appointments were mostly conservative.

We tried the reform method with FDR and suppressed the radicals who “screeched” that if we don’t attack the economic system we will be back to square one after the capitalist class attacks the reforms. Well, we’re back to square one.

Really? Social Security, SNAP, Medicare, Medicaid, and more are all gone? I must have missed that.

Let me ask: who is responsible for pushing America towards Social Democracy in the 30s? Was this purely a bone the capitalist class was willing to throw at their own discretion without any outside influence?

Voters and their elected representatives are responsible for all changes in gov't policy in every direction. Maybe if you keep voting for Republicans you'll get what you want.

 

[PHATV]

Elizabeth Warren's fibbing is forming a pattern - she just can't stop lying and is being called out all over

 

[xcvbn]

How are you defining "leadership," and why is "time in leadership" your preferred metric here? Post-FDR, we continued to expand the safety net and other liberal programs, until seeing big rollbacks starting with Reagan. We've since been expanding them some more.

And I'm on Earth, where McConnell shut down a lot of judicial appointments (not just Garland), leaving the courts open to be remade by the right. And LOL at the idea that Obama's appointments were mostly conservative.



Really? Social Security, SNAP, Medicare, Medicaid, and more are all gone? I must have missed that.



Voters and their elected representatives are responsible for all changes in gov't policy in every direction. Maybe if you keep voting for Republicans you'll get what you want.

You know, if you and other like-minded individuals of the managerial class had as much contempt and disgust for the Republicans and the conservative movements as you do for working class people, poor people, uneducated people, victims of war, victims of American Empire, victims of systematic authoritative abuse in American cities- then perhaps we could destroy the Republicans as an organized force and move towards a truly democratic, equitable and just society.

But no. Your job in the present is to deny even the existence of a working class movement and to already place blame on an imagined 2020 loss on the people who belong to said “non-movement”

You are fucking disgusting. Shame on you and shame on the little twats who echo the same contempt of your fellow man @Fawlty @kpt018

 

[kpt018]

You know, if you and other like-minded individuals of the managerial class had as much contempt and disgust for the Republicans and the conservative movements as you do for working class people, poor people, uneducated people, victims of war, victims of American Empire, victims of systematic authoritative abuse in American cities- then perhaps we could destroy the Republicans as an organized force and move towards a truly democratic, equitable and just society.

But no. Your job in the present is to deny even the existence of a working class movement and to already place blame on an imagined 2020 loss on the people who belong to said “non-movement”

You are fucking disgusting. Shame on you and shame on the little twats who echo the same contempt of your fellow man @Fawlty @kpt018

Dude, why are you so bent out of shape?

I’ve never voted for a Republican for the federal government in my life and since the party has gotten worse during my life there’s no reason to consider it now.

Here’s the difference between us. I think the Republicans are so corrupt and craven I would vote for any decent human over them, including (gasps!) a moderate Democrat! You, on the other hand, will cry like a bitch and probably vote 3rd party if it’s anyone but Bernie. You’re like a cult member.

And I’ll keep repeating this until it seeps into your stubborn brain - if Bernie is the nominee I will march into the booth and vote for him with a huge smile on my face. I’ll stay up until the election is decided cheering him on and getting triggered at every state Trump wins. We are on your fucking side! We just don’t agree with your stupid takes.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Dude, why are you so bent out of shape?

I’ve never voted for a Republican for the federal government in my life and since the party has gotten worse during my life there’s no reason to consider it now.

Here’s the difference between us. I think the Republicans are so corrupt and craven I would vote for any decent human over them, including (gasps!) a moderate Democrat! You, on the other hand, will cry like a bitch and probably vote 3rd party if it’s anyone but Bernie. You’re like a cult member.

And I’ll keep repeating this until it seeps into your stubborn brain - if Bernie is the nominee I will march into the booth and vote for him with a huge smile on my face. I’ll stay up until the election is decided cheering him on and getting triggered at every state Trump wins. We are on your fucking side! We just don’t agree with your stupid takes.

Crazy how alike Bernie bots and trump cultists are. Uneducated yet overly zealous nut jobs who wrap themselves in blind ideology like a warm blanket to comfort themselves from made up boogeymen

 

[xcvbn]

Dude, why are you so bent out of shape?

I’ve never voted for a Republican for the federal government in my life and since the party has gotten worse during my life there’s no reason to consider it now.

Here’s the difference between us. I think the Republicans are so corrupt and craven I would vote for any decent human over them, including (gasps!) a moderate Democrat! You, on the other hand, will cry like a bitch and probably vote 3rd party if it’s anyone but Bernie. You’re like a cult member.

And I’ll keep repeating this until it seeps into your stubborn brain - if Bernie is the nominee I will march into the booth and vote for him with a huge smile on my face. I’ll stay up until the election is decided cheering him on and getting triggered at every state Trump wins. We are on your fucking side! We just don’t agree with your stupid takes.

In this moment we need solidarity, not sympathy.

Maybe when you figure that out you’ll become useful, but in the present your line of politics, which helped bring us Trump, is part of the problem.

 

[bobgeese]

I’ll stay up until the election is decided cheering him on and getting triggered at every state Trump wins.

It’s gonna be a crazy fucking night.

 

[kpt018]

In this moment we need solidarity, not sympathy.

Maybe when you figure that out you’ll become useful, but in the present your line of politics, which helped bring us Trump, is part of the problem.

I’d bet the farm you couldn’t accurately summarize my politics. If you could you wouldn’t have made such a dumb statement.

 

[kpt018]

Crazy how alike Bernie bots and trump cultists are. Uneducated yet overly zealous nut jobs who wrap themselves in blind ideology like a warm blanket to comfort themselves from made up boogeymen

Indeed. And I think it’s equally important to call out the cultist idiots on the left as it is with Trump cultists. They’re not as dangerous but they could be and they’re definitely counter productive.

It’s so annoying to be aligned with the guy on most issues only to be called an enemy and no better than a Trumpist.