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Again you assume all pipeline leaks will be found and stopped in 15 minutes. The article also states that the leak detection systems miss 19 out of 20 spills which you ignore.
Keystone pipeline leaks 210K gallons of oil in South Dakota
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Lol, stay on topic and quit deflecting. I never said ALL and I'm talking detectable leaks per YOUR post.
I explained why I used 15 minutes so quit being dense.
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Never did I narrow down discussion to Detectable leaks.
Your decision to use 15 minutes was based off of this particular leak.
Your words: If, like the Keystone spill this week, it's detected, contained and shut down within 15 minutes, then the chances of a 500,000 gallon spill are remote.
It's an assumption that you are trying to use to discredit the information put forth in the article.
Pickle Rick
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are people actually trying to defend a leak in an oil pipeline? jesus be less partisan
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This is true. People don't seem to understand this.
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Who doesn't get that? I think people just expect higher standards in construction when our environment is at stake and government oversight is the only way to get a profit obsessed corporation to not cut corners, yet our adminstrstion nuthugs these oil companies and they'll be no response to this while the same materials and engineering go into building more leak prone pipes across our water tables.
Just because something is the best way t do it doesn't mean it can't be fucked up by inept or greedy companies.
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[/QUOTE]
Ok, but what do you consider higher standards? The vast majority of pipelines have a 99.99+% success rate (better than first class priority mail delivery rates of postage) and total success rate for rail, truck and pipeline is around 99.9%
The issue you may have is just with the shear volume of oil being shipped but that is to meet a demand that everybody needs.
"
Fact: more than 99.9 percent of the oil and petroleum products transported by pipeline, rail, and marine are delivered without incident. To put that into perspective, only 90.5 percent of first class mail shipped through the United States Postal Service arrives at its destination on time and without incident.
Rail is also much safer than road transportation. Of the 34,000 deaths resulting from transportation-related accidents in 2011, 93 percent occurred on highways -- mostly in cars, light trucks, and vans. Rail accounted for only 759 deaths. And most of those occurred when people trespassed onto the tracks and were struck by an oncoming train.
Rail transports a very high volume of oil per year without spillage. In 2012, railroads carried 11.2 billion gallons of gas, only 95,000 gallons of which was lost in accidents. That's a 99.999 percent success rate.
Oil pipelines have also proven to be very safe, although not accident-free. The number of deaths from such oil carriage has steadily dropped in recent years. And so has the rate of breakages and spills. In 2012, over 474 billion gallons of crude oil and petroleum products were carried by pipeline. Just .0005 percent of that haul was spilled -- that's another 99.999 percentage success rate."
https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertbradley/2014/02/05/rail-transport-99-9-safe/#757523401eaf
From Time:
There’s No Such Thing As a Spill-Proof Way to Transport Oil
Ok, but what do you consider higher standards? The vast majority of pipelines have a 99.99+% success rate (better than first class priority mail delivery rates of postage) and total success rate for rail, truck and pipeline is around 99.9%
The issue you may have is just with the shear volume of oil being shipped but that is to meet a demand that everybody needs.
"
Fact: more than 99.9 percent of the oil and petroleum products transported by pipeline, rail, and marine are delivered without incident. To put that into perspective, only 90.5 percent of first class mail shipped through the United States Postal Service arrives at its destination on time and without incident.
Rail is also much safer than road transportation. Of the 34,000 deaths resulting from transportation-related accidents in 2011, 93 percent occurred on highways -- mostly in cars, light trucks, and vans. Rail accounted for only 759 deaths. And most of those occurred when people trespassed onto the tracks and were struck by an oncoming train.
Rail transports a very high volume of oil per year without spillage. In 2012, railroads carried 11.2 billion gallons of gas, only 95,000 gallons of which was lost in accidents. That's a 99.999 percent success rate.
Oil pipelines have also proven to be very safe, although not accident-free. The number of deaths from such oil carriage has steadily dropped in recent years. And so has the rate of breakages and spills. In 2012, over 474 billion gallons of crude oil and petroleum products were carried by pipeline. Just .0005 percent of that haul was spilled -- that's another 99.999 percentage success rate."
https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertbradley/2014/02/05/rail-transport-99-9-safe/#757523401eaf
From Time:
There’s No Such Thing As a Spill-Proof Way to Transport Oil
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clean it up an move on, spills happen.
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Ok, but what do you consider higher standards? The vast majority of pipelines have a 99.99+% success rate (better than first class priority mail delivery rates of postage) and total success rate for rail, truck and pipeline is around 99.9%
The issue you may have is just with the shear volume of oil being shipped but that is to meet a demand that everybody needs.
"
Fact: more than 99.9 percent of the oil and petroleum products transported by pipeline, rail, and marine are delivered without incident. To put that into perspective, only 90.5 percent of first class mail shipped through the United States Postal Service arrives at its destination on time and without incident.
Rail is also much safer than road transportation. Of the 34,000 deaths resulting from transportation-related accidents in 2011, 93 percent occurred on highways -- mostly in cars, light trucks, and vans. Rail accounted for only 759 deaths. And most of those occurred when people trespassed onto the tracks and were struck by an oncoming train.
Rail transports a very high volume of oil per year without spillage. In 2012, railroads carried 11.2 billion gallons of gas, only 95,000 gallons of which was lost in accidents. That's a 99.999 percent success rate.
Oil pipelines have also proven to be very safe, although not accident-free. The number of deaths from such oil carriage has steadily dropped in recent years. And so has the rate of breakages and spills. In 2012, over 474 billion gallons of crude oil and petroleum products were carried by pipeline. Just .0005 percent of that haul was spilled -- that's another 99.999 percentage success rate."
https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertbradley/2014/02/05/rail-transport-99-9-safe/#757523401eaf
From Time:
There’s No Such Thing As a Spill-Proof Way to Transport Oil[/QUOTE]
I get nothing is failure free but we are also far from taking as many preemptive steps to protect the locals from them as we could/should.
I expect our representives to demand oversight of these pipelines so the failures that do occur aren't from cut corners and as many pre-emptive steps are taken instead of the minimum/what is the best for shareholders. These failures can and have destroyed ecosystems and water sources. Right now the shareholders are calling those shots mostly and we are accepting them instead of the other way around.
Considering this company's state of the art pipeline has had a failure and they are still moving forward with completing a nation long pipeline and the oil doesn't even stay in the states it's clear we are gambling for a small payoff and aren't even doing what we could to make the odds better because Trump nuthugs oil lobbyist and donors. It's stupid pandering.
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The oil is the the shareholders main focus so obviously stands to reason that the protection of the product via effectiveness of the transportation vessel is a key priority -- and they are getting it right. i mean pipelines have a .0005 failure rate which is exceedingly good. From that i would say corners are not being cut. But if you need a government panel to oversee issues like a FAA, sure.
The stats are pretty overwhelming good for the oil companies in land delivery
Show me the plans to go beyond their current 99.999 success rates? Remember to factor in the pipe spills due to sabotage
http://www.bnn.ca/commodities/video/group-takes-responsibility-for-pipeline-sabotage~969763
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Confusing why people think pipeline companies don't give a damn about spills and cut corners on construction.
That Keystone spill probably cost them several million dollars in revenue. No clue what a barrel of tar sands crude sells for. And that's just from the lost oil. Now calculate the losses on the shutdown of the pipeline until the problem can be determined and repaired. Then there are the repair costs.
Now add to that the cost of containment and remediation.
No telling what the PR and lobbying costs are from this. Not to mention the XL pipeline is up for approval in Nebraska. You're going to have to marshall the forces to convince politicians this is an isolated incident and they should still vote for constructing the XL through Nebraska.
The hard and soft costs of a spill are significant and no company wants to deal with them.
That Keystone spill probably cost them several million dollars in revenue. No clue what a barrel of tar sands crude sells for. And that's just from the lost oil. Now calculate the losses on the shutdown of the pipeline until the problem can be determined and repaired. Then there are the repair costs.
Now add to that the cost of containment and remediation.
No telling what the PR and lobbying costs are from this. Not to mention the XL pipeline is up for approval in Nebraska. You're going to have to marshall the forces to convince politicians this is an isolated incident and they should still vote for constructing the XL through Nebraska.
The hard and soft costs of a spill are significant and no company wants to deal with them.
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Actually you're wrong. The TransCanada pipeline goes through my property & the EPA had to inspect their work. The EPA & TransCanada actually got into a dispute on who was paying for erosion damage on my property that was caused by the pipeline construction.
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I could be wrong, but I'd be willing to bet the pipeline has sensors that detect when there's a leak. If not, that's ridiculous.
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LOL @GearSolidMetal trying to defend what happened. Man take me off your shitty polls list. I gotta distance myself from you like you're in Washington.
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I'm not defending what happened, just pointing out that its not as big of a deal as the headline of '210,000 gallons' implies it is.
And I'll happily take you off the list. You haven't voted in any polls this month anyway.
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What's rediculous is you making this comment.
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What's ridiculous is your spelling
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Dude, the post of mine you quoted mentioned leak detection systems.
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